Lifetime frame warranty – Santa Cruz Vs Transition

Knackered my frame last week so I am looking at new options. I will keep this for some time. The frames speaking loudest to memon paper are the Transition Sentinel and Santa Cruz Hightower.

Both have lifetime frame warranty….but which warranty is better?

I know Santa Cruz is supposed to be good. What about Transition?

Ta!

Actually can we add yeti to the list. Liking the look of the SB130 also. Also lifetime warranty.

There was a big thread a few weeks ago where I think it was decideded lifetime warranties rarely actually are.

I’ve used Yeti and SC warranty, SC was a far better experience tbh.

Free bearings from SC too, my SB66 was 120 quid a year in bearings, and that was nursing them along.

That said, I prefer the look of Yetis, and my SB66 was the best descender I’ve ever ridden.

No experience of transition.

Has the Yeti you’re looking at got switch infinity? If so that doesn’t always play well with UK weather. I know someone who tried to claim on warranty to replace one and literally they’ll only replace it when it’s almost hanging off. You also need to grease it I believe – so it’s another bit of maintenance.

I’d take SC or Transition over Yeti all day.

My replacement rear triangles on my yeti were 10 weeks from warranty to delivery. Yeti wanted the cracked part back in the states first, and the distributor didn’t hold any spares, not ideal.

I’ve recently had to warranty my 2 year old Hightower frame due to paint finish. Absolutely no quibble & an enjoyable experience tbf.
Had to wait a few weeks for the new 2022 colourway as they’d not been released but could carry on using my old frame.

Lifetime bearing warranty is a simple online form. Fill it in and you’ll have them in a couple of days.

Free bearings from SC too, my SB66 was 120 quid a year in bearings, and that was nursing them along.

I’d rather get a bike that doesn’t need bearings changed every year…

Never had to change the bearings on any of the Santa Cruz frames I’ve had (or my partners had) earlier than 2 years tbf.
That’s after doing several weeks in the Alps btw.

Jungle (SC UK) are always a pleasure to deal with, they’ve sent out little bits of hardware without even asking to see my invoice, free bearings is a real thing too 😁

I’ve had to use the warranty before and it was a very easy turnaround.

Free bearings are probably more useful than a lifetime warranty.

Most carbon frames come with 3 to 5 years warranty with a lot less small print to worm their way out of a replacement frame.

Read the small print of a lifetime warranty, they word it in a sneaky way. For example it’s the lifetime of the bike and how it’s intended to be used, so a lifetime warranty from the same company can be interpreted differently for a road bike vs a downhill bike.

A lifetime warranty doesn’t mean your lifetime! Each company is different though so make sure you read it in full not just the headline.

Never had to change the bearings on any of the Santa Cruz frames I’ve had (or my partners had) earlier than 2 years tbf.

Yup, me too.

Mate of mine been waiting a year for a warranty replacement Nomad frame from SC. Seems they’d rather build the frames up and sell them, than honour the warranty.

I know a few who have had to use Transition warranty, they seem good enough, but industry wise, SC seem to always be the best, they have a network that seems to support warranty and spares, yes you’ll have the odd issue as always, COVID and Brexit have caused a lot of issues, you can tell that simply by the fact you read a story about a sentinel needing replaced in the states, it’s done in less than a week, you do the same in the UK and it’s going to be a lot longer just now.

I’d say if you are looking at the warranty side being a big part of buying, make sure you buy local and from a good LBS, that’s what can make warranty easier, when they do all the running and pushing, rather than just sending an email and waiting.

another +1 to finding out what the definition of lifetime is in the frame maker’s eyes. It almost certainly won’t be as good as it sounds……

Thanks all. Understand it’s never quite as good as it seems, but if I’m dropping considerable cash (£2.5k+) on a frame then it’s really important to know they’ve got my back for at least the next 5-10 years. That’s around how long I would want to be keeping it for (at a guess) to ensure it was cost effective.

SC warranty gets praise everywhere and as such that’s a big plus point.

And yes the yeti has a switch infinity link. Also separately I’ve read up about the reliability issues of the switch infinity and also yeti in general. Takes that option out of the running unfortunately. On paper in terms of ride characteristics it may actually be the best bike for me.

I’d rather get a bike that doesn’t need bearings changed every year…

Which bike is this?

Even on my single pivot, with gigantic and well protected bearings, I still kill them at least once a year. Bike never sees a pressure washer, but gets gets filthy on almost every ride in winter and used 4+ times a week. I felt like once a year was good going frankly. My Nomad was every 5-6 months.

RE Warranty, I don’t think you’ll go far wrong with either SC or Transition. I would just go for the the bike that has the biggest “want” factor. I’d have the Sentinel.

Have never owned a Yeti, but know people who have had genuine warranty cases refused, would never touch one as a result. And it’s not like they don’t have lots of practice with warranties, given their long history of frame failures you’d think the process would be smooth by now.

From personal experience (which I acknowledge is a sample size of 1), Yeti were very good.
1 month turnaround from reporting issue (seized bearing caused swingarm to crack upon removal) to frame returned to me.
3 winters of riding in sandy Surrey slop and never had any issues with the Switch Infinity Link.
When I finally wrecked the frame, due to pilot error they offered a very decent discount on a current model crash replacement, as they had no old like-for-like spares left.

Bearing life might be for another thread, but I’ve found all my four-bar frames needed the small bearings changing after a year or less. Though I wouldn’t have realised if I hadn’t checked.

The bigger bearings have sometimes lasted longer, and the two bearings on my Orange can last a couple of years.

My SC bearings lasted 4 years and probably would have been fine for longer. It’s no garage ornament either. Remarkable for a bike designed in california and ridden in bogs throughout most of the year. Their sealing is excellent.

I know you’re only comparing warranties but the sentinel looks to be a more modern design and is new. Hightower is due an update so would be worth waiting on perhaps.

SC warranty is good though and the bikes tend to be pretty reliable. Seen and heard quite a few issues with transitions that you shouldnt really expect on something at a similar price point. Not enough to put me off though.

As for yeti. Isnt the reason that they cost so much because they’re pricing in several warranty replacements?

If you’re looking at Sentinel and Hightower, I’d also add a Pivot Switchblade to the list of possibles. Not as progressively LLS as some others, but some people prefer that.

I know you’re only comparing warranties but the sentinel looks to be a more modern design and is new. Hightower is due an update so would be worth waiting on perhaps.

This is a good point, I’ve been comparing geometries on various current bikes lately (slow week at work) and I’ve noticed the main difference on the newer, progressive models is really slack head angles.

Something that I’ve done to my main bike with a headset and bushings (sub 63deg now) and think is really valuable for steep or fast riding.

As for yeti. Isnt the reason that they cost so much because they’re pricing in several warranty replacements?

That, and the distributors are arguably a bit greedy with most of their brands.

My SC bearings lasted 4 years and probably would have been fine for longer. It’s no garage ornament either. Remarkable for a bike designed in california and ridden in bogs throughout most of the year. Their sealing is excellent.

This blows my mind! What am I doing wrong?!

I really think bearing life is down to what you put the bike through – assuming we’re comparing the same quality of bearings like for like.

My Aeris 145 was 3 years old when I sold the frame and still on its original bearings. They were all still relatively smooth – I dismantled the bike to check them before selling.

My Aether 7 is broadly the same bearings and suspension setup I believe – and 18 months in I checked the bearings and a few were beginning to get notchy so I replaced the lot. I think the Aether did a lot more big snorkelling through all sorts of muddy / wet night rides last winter that the Aeris hadn’t been out through in the same way.

I also think too much washing (especially with a hose / jet wash) probably drives water through bearing seals or pushes mud / grit in them.

That said bearings for the Aether were only just over £50 for the full set iirc and I fitted them myself so it’s not really a big issue.

I think some bikes use angular contact bearings (e.g Commencal Meta maybe) which bumps up the price of bearing replacement so more of an issue if you go through them.

Anecdotally I’ve got one front hub that uses angular contact bearings and 5 hubs that use ‘normal’ bearings and the AC ones seem to be dying regularly whereas I’ve never had to replace the normal bearings in the others to date. Maybe it’s poor hub design (sealing) or maybe the AC bearings just aren’t as well sealed themselves 🤷‍♂️

Lots of factors for bearing life, manufacturers tolerances etc too, as Chakaping says, it’s a whole other thread.

I would have thought whichever ‘lifetime’ is longer, would be the best one? Some manufacturers ‘lifetime’ is no more than a couple of years for certain parts.

Specialized only consider the front triangle as worthy of a longish warrantee. The back frame elements, are not covered for very long at all. AFAIR.

The best warranty example I’ve ever heard of was a cheap Trek road bike, an intern at work stored it on his flat balcony. Went out for a ride from Milngavie up past the golf course one day, the steerer failed, snapped, and he faceplanted the tarmac, quite a mess.

Despite the fork not being part of the frame warranty, being out of warranty, and corroded to ****, he got a new bike, all his dental bills paid, and even flights back and forward from Prague when he was on secondment to get dentistry work done.

Hightower is due an update so would be worth waiting on perhaps.

Is it? It’s only done 2 seasons so far and SC tend to run for 3 currently.  Megatower is next in line surely?

I’m on a Bronson, still on original bearings after almost 2 years (don’t ride it as much as some though) and no need to claim on warranty, but I’ve had a mate whose done the SC warranty thing and his was dealt with very well via Pedal and Spoke.

Is it? It’s only done 2 seasons so far and SC tend to run for 3 currently. Megatower is next in line surely?

According to my LBS, a new Mega is definitely in the works.

It just so happens I have had experience with both these companies.

1) SC via jungle, was dreadful. I would never ever buy another SC product ever again until they ditch jungle. SC usa were great and tidied up Jungles bullshit.
2) Transition (this was crash replacement) were great service, bent over backwards to help but had run out of my parts from production 2011 to crash 2013. They sourced a replacement from someones garage that was the wrong colour but at least got me riding again. I think Tranny were faultless, but they are not big enough to carry a decent parts stock long term.
3) Add on. My mate used Giant for crash replacement on a rear triangle, and 4 years after birth they had the right part, in the right colour.
4) Add on 2 – back in 2008 another mate had Marin frame crack at 4 years old, they sent him a new frame, headset and organised a huge discount on forks so he could fit everything else. This was 26 to 26 though…

If I wanted what you want I’d go big brand, Spesh, Giant, Trek, Marin etc.

Thanks all for the further thoughts. @5plusn8 what was the warranty issue and what was the jungle bullshit?

One of the advantages of SC is that Jungle is not too far away from me physically.

I have had a browse around the larger brands and nothing really getting my juices flowing TBH. Although, the Marin alpine trail carbon 2 (full bike) looks *amazing* VFM. 5 year warranty on that though, and it isn’t really quite what I want and is heavy.

Trek slash looks quite nice I suppose but I already have a trek rail ebike which is effectively the same thing, with a motor

Ive had my SC now for almost 3 years I’ve ordered bearings twice both times in the height of the pandemic and both times turned up with in 48 hours. Ive also had a frame problem in January last year .. two calls and one photo and a new swing arm lower link drop outs and axle in the post with in 48 hours.

No missed rides is a brilliant ethos because from where im concerned the best customer service ive received from any company in any aspect of live.

Oh and the bike well its lasted me almost 3 years and wont be going anywhere anytime soon 🙂

Read this. Until Dickon leaves I would never be a UK SC customer. TBH given the evidence I sent to SCUSA, it pissed me off that they didn’t do anything about it.

singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/stif-cycles-shoddy-customer-service/#post-12094481

On the other hand, Dickon has always been great when I’ve had dealings with Jungle.

The little grease ports on the lower linkage are a neat touch on Santa Cruz and undoubtedly prolong bearing life.

Dont order anything from SC because 5plusn8 once had a bad experience 15 years ago…??!

🤣

Trek slash looks quite nice I suppose but I already have a trek rail ebike which is effectively the same thing, with a motor

Slash is a great bike.

Give the Rail to me and crack on with buying one. Problem solved.

Quite fancied a rail myself.
Since quitting my SC addiction, I went through Superlight, Heckler and 2 bullits, one thing I have realised is that big brands are also much cheaper. I haven’t looked at Transition but they were at SC level 10 years ago.

Have used transition warranty. Bike bought via Tweeks online who are miles away from me. Both dealt with it brilliantly, I was having email chats to the ISA within an hour and they sent the parts to their UK distributor. They seemed to genuinely care. Makes me more inclined to buy from them again.