‘Lane assist’ – how do I switch it off?

If it’s actually deserted, there’s no need to change lane. IF it’s not deserted, then your indicator will provide information to someone

You mean you don’t straight-line the corners on a deserted motorway? Weirdo. Although a deserted motorway is a very rare thing these days.

Genuine question, have I overlooked something?

Nope, that’s what indicators are for.
NOT indicating is worse, because the IAM driving god making progress behind you can’t really see the cyclist you’re pulling out to pass. Or read your mind. So you indicate to tell them you’re moving out.

If they can’t distinguish between indicating to turn, and indicating to pull out/overtake. It shouldn’t matter. Unless of course they are too close and making progress. Or if they are 80 and getting confused at everything. Like why are the police all so young these days?

Are folk saying they indicate when changing lanes on a deserted motorway at 11pm at night?

<pendant’s corner>If it’s actually deserted, there’s no need to change lane. IF it’s not deserted, then your indicator will provide information to someone</pendant’s corner>

Good points both.

Back when I was learning to drive, I was taught to indicate regardless of any other perceived traffic as a) roads might not be as deserted as you initially think and b) it helps build muscle memory so you automatically indicate before manoeuvring rather than it being an extra step you have to consciously think about.

An advanced driving instructor once told me not to bother indicating on motorways when changing lanes to the left, the thinking being that drivers to your left are moving slower so your lane change cannot affect anyone. This struck me as odd. Not only are you unlearning rote behaviour but you’re assuming that no-one will ever overtake you on the left. Maybe that was the broader point, to have a driver question why they’re doing what they’re doing and then make better decisions? I don’t know.

It’s good to indicate both ways, in case you’ve misjudged the distance to the car you’re passing. They at least get a second or two of indicator before you smash your nearside rear corner into them. So they can either honk, brake or drive into you because they are flicking through tinder.

Also why blind spot warning systems are useful.

Now I can see this is very helpful if you’re prone to falling asleep at the wheel after a long lunch, or sending Snapchats on the M4, but I don’t do those things

It would have prevented the car accident my parents were in, if it were active on one of the cars involved, just not sure which one. And my Dad had been driving for 50 years (not continuously) at that point without a single accident and is hyper-attentive and very much a safety-first person; clearly not the kind of person described here. Point is that if it can happen to him it can happen to anyone.

I think I’m a decent driver but unlike the OP I realise that even I can make mistakes, so I leave it on except for narrow B roads of the kind you often get down South with white lines down the edges, it gets a bit difficult then. Fortunately on my car there’s a button to turn it off; unfortunately it’s obscured by the wheel so it’s quite hard to find.

I’ve got a 69 plate, 2020 registered, Skoda Kodiaq. I’ve never noticed any lane keep feature

Re indicators, my driving instructor told me not to indicate when there was no-one there or when it was obvious what you were going to do. But as above I also disagree because a) there might be someone you cannot or didn’t see who wants to know, b) because it may not be obvious to everyone, they may not be able see that you’re in a left-only turn lane, c) why not indicate anyway? and d) you’re un-learning the automatic response which means that some time you WILL forget about it.

Re learned responses – people will say ‘oh you’re just training yourself not to bother checking’ but I don’t think this is the case. I always leave my keys on the rack when I come in the house, regardless – that way I can always find them. My wife puts them in a variety of places for various reasons that she has invevitably forgotten about the next time she needs them.

An advanced driving instructor once told me not to bother indicating on motorways when changing lanes to the left, the thinking being that drivers to your left are moving slower so your lane change cannot affect anyone.

This is what I was taught by my instructor when learning to drive (1977). The rationale being not only that they were going more slowly, but also that changing lanes to the left is what everyone would be expecting you to do anyway. Obviously that no longer applies.

Re indicators, my driving instructor told me not to indicate when there was no-one there or when it was obvious what you were going to do. But as above I also disagree because a) there might be someone you cannot or didn’t see who wants to know, b) because it may not be obvious to everyone, they may not be able see that you’re in a left-only turn lane, c) why not indicate anyway? and d) you’re un-learning the automatic response which means that some time you WILL forget about it.

I totally agree with that. However (and I could be wrong here – I was told it some time ago) apparently it is a fail for the Advanced Driving Test as the driver should be able to show they have full awareness of everything around them at any given point.

My BMW 21 reg came with lane departure steering. You could switch it off but it would always came back on again next time car was started. After an OTA update, it can now permanently be switched off. I suspect that means either it isn’t legislated to reset itself, or that legislation has since been changed.

(Not suggesting it is a good/bad safety feature BTW 🙂

I hired a Mk8 Golf (the one with awful touch sensitive heater controls) last year, the first thing the guy showed me inside was how to turn off lane assist. I’ve driven quite a few cars that have it and it is probably the most annoying safety feature now fitted to new cars. Got a Dacia Jogger in November which thankfully doesn’t have it, as their CEO said why fit it when people just turn it off anyway.

apparently it is a fail for the Advanced Driving Test as the driver should be able to show they have full awareness of everything around them at any given point.

This is not possible in all situations due to the presence of opaque objects in the world.

You mean you don’t straight-line the corners on a deserted motorway? Weirdo.

On an empty roundabout or a normal road with perfect visibility, absolutely, the road’s there to be used. On a motorway though? The gains to be had there are surely vanishingly slight unless you’re doing 200 down an autobahn.

IAM / making progress

This crops up again and again, several times on this thread alone, and it’s getting tedious now. There seems to be a common belief that “making progress” is a euphemism / excuse for driving like a joyrider.

That’s not what it means, rather making progress is about efficiency. For example, slowing before a distant red light rather than flying right up to it then burying the middle pedal, so you can smoothly roll through it when it turns green rather than having to stop. Making progress is thinking ahead, being aware of your surroundings, driving fluidly rather than staccato and erratic.

The gains to be had there are surely vanishingly slight unless you’re doing 200 down an autobahn.

Saves fuel as you don’t have to drive so far. The difference can actually be measurable.

Saves fuel as you don’t have to drive so far. The difference can actually be measurable.

Apparently (and I was surprised too), the distance travelling clockwise around the M25 is only very marginally (like a couple of hundred metres) longer than the distance travelling anti-clockwise so I doubt that straightlining what is going to be a gradual curve on a motorway makes any discernible difference whatsoever.

I routinely straightline twisty B-roads when I can see it’s clear and safe to do so which is exactly the sort of situation that a Lane Assist thing would be blaring warnings about.

My BMW 21 reg came with lane departure steering.
…
(Not suggesting it is a good/bad safety feature BTW 🙂

I think a lane departure warning can be a good thing. Fighting the steering wheel out of your hands, not so much.

Fortunately, after thinking I’d have to be going through menus every time I got in the car, playing with it today, it turns out to be a very quick button sequence to disable it, which hopefully will be committed to muscle memory pretty soon, bit like sticking the clutch down to start it.

Whether it will be quite the same for my tech-hating wife, I don’t know.

For example, slowing before a distant red light rather than flying right up to it then burying the middle pedal, so you can smoothly roll through it when it turns green rather than having to stop.

Tailgaters hate this one simple trick!

Good.

😁

What’s the downside to people thinking you’re turning right when you aren’t?

If you’re turning right, you’ll start slowing down after you’ve indicated. If you’re overtaking a parked car (and the road is clear) you won’t. On a single carriageway, if I see that a vehicle in front is turning right, I’ll lift off to reduce the need for braking.

Good.

Yeah, I love doing it, it boggles their little minds. Bit like when you drive at 30 in a 30 with faster cars in front, but somehow always seem to end up right behind them at the next lights.

Plus, in pure energy terms, the first metre you drive from a stop has to be the most expensive, no?

Oh I don’t know about that. I’m not aware of any other motorways with a cock-shaped plantation of trees on a hillside overlooking the road:

I know I’m nearly home when I see Cock Forest 🙂

apparently it is a fail for the Advanced Driving Test as the driver should be able to show they have full awareness of everything around them at any given point.

Hmmm, despite being so advanced it seems they can’t get really their heads around the notion of using a fail-safe technique.

If you’re turning right, you’ll start slowing down after you’ve indicated.

Hmm… Mirror, Signal, Manoeuvre (granted, turning left/right feels a bit of a grey area, but that’s the sequence I had drummed into me when I was learning).

On my e-Tron it’s a single click on the end of the indicator stalk to disable it.
Seems about the right level of faff to switch it off if you want too.
TBH it’s probably one of the better bits of UI design in the car.

I’m not seeing how disabling an optional “feature” should trouble an insurer.

The insurance premium accounts for the safety features on the car, but this is affected if those features are being turned off or misused. It may look silly for one specific case or feature, however when looking at the big picture the progression of automotive safety features are one of the most significant drivers of improved road safety over the years. So it makes sense to manage how drivers may be increasing their risk by disabling or misusing features.

It was recently finalised that all new types of car from July 2022 or existing types sold from July 2024 onwards will be fitted with a raft of safety features including Intelligent Speed Assistance, Advanced Emergency Braking System, and driver monitoring. In parallel with this are rules about data logging units being fitted to all vehicles. I haven’t read this set of UN technical regulations but I believe the intention is for this to allow the option for regulators to link up how these features are being used with insurance coverage and claims – potential to be linked to criminal proceedings too.

Hmm… Mirror, Signal, Manoeuvre (granted, turning left/right feels a bit of a grey area, but that’s the sequence I had drummed into me when I was learning).

When learning to drive I was taught mirror, signal, mirror again, manoeuvre.

On two wheels you’re taught mirror, signal, shoulder-check, manoeuvre. They call that last glance before you commit “the lifesaver.” It really should be a part of driving too, it’d decimate the number of SMIDSYs and left-hooks.

The insurance premium accounts for the safety features on the car, but this is affected if those features are being turned off or misused.

Seems kinda strange that there’s an “off” switch then. Is this a numbers game again, assuming that most drivers won’t be arsed to fiddle with the tech?

It was recently finalised that all new types of car from July 2022 or existing types sold from July 2024 onwards will be fitted with a raft of safety features including Intelligent Speed Assistance, Advanced Emergency Braking System, and driver monitoring. In parallel with this are rules about data logging units being fitted to all vehicles. I haven’t read this set of UN technical regulations but I believe the intention is for this to allow the option for regulators to link up how these features are being used with insurance coverage and claims – potential to be linked to criminal proceedings too.

I was musing the other day how it’s odd that I’ve had cars with rear view cameras and a battery of forward-facing sensors for years now, yet no-one’s thought to hook them all up to a recording device. We have insurance discounts for young drivers with black boxes in their cars, it feels like a no-brainer to me to stick an SD card on the back of the existing tech rather than have drivers use third-party cameras which might get their window put through by scrotes.

I haven’t read this set of UN technical regulations

I have 🙁

It almost cured my insomnia, but i was at work.

When learning to drive I was taught mirror, signal, mirror again, manoeuvre.

I assume this is just the difference between instructors – I did have ‘check left, check right, check left again’ though.

On two wheels you’re taught mirror, signal, shoulder-check, manoeuvre. They call that last glance before you commit “the lifesaver.” It really should be a part of driving too, it’d decimate the number of SMIDSYs and left-hooks.

Yeah, I do this in the car but I can’t believe it is not actually a recommendation which I find very surprising.

I was musing the other day how it’s odd that I’ve had cars with rear view cameras and a battery of forward-facing sensors for years now, yet no-one’s thought to hook them all up to a recording device.

On my car (Mercedes) you can buy a similar system as an upgrade. I assume other manufacturers do the same?

You think these systems are annoying in a car, try them in a truck 🤣😡

I assume this is just the difference between instructors – I did have ‘check left, check right, check left again’ though.

Possibly an age thing also?

Left-right-left surely should be right-left-right though, unless I’ve misunderstood what you’re referring to?

You mean you don’t straight-line the corners on a deserted motorway? Weirdo. Although a deserted motorway is a very rare thing these days.

Well yeah it’s been 10 years since I used to do the 3am London-Bristol sprint regularly – don’t know how busy it is these days – but even then I was always mindful that there could suddenly be something going very slowly in lane 1 and I didn’t want any surprises!

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The auto brake at at parking speed stopped me reversing into a low wall I had missed.

Careful, I don’t think you’re allowed to admit that you’re anything less than a perfect driver on threads like these.

Our Enyaq came with it and it was a total liability on local roads. It can be turned off via the menu but you have to do it every time you drive the car which is a PITA. I plugged one of these in and used the app to turn it off – works a treat.
OBDEleven Device
As for the insurance thing – I don’t buy the argument that it’s a mod to the car – it isn’t if it can be turned off via the in car display menu.

My wife has had a new VW ID4 or the “eco panzer” as i call it for a week now, living in rural Norfolk, whilst it is extremely clever, it seems to be plain dangerous half the time, and she has to turn it off every time, it is has tried to wrestle steering wheel from her a number of times travelling on country roads that are barely two cars wide if that, and in first few days, braked hard as she pulled up a bank to give way to oncoming vehicles on a single lane road, almost causing car behind to go into rear of her.

A lot of these features seem great for motorway or city driving, but seem to get very confused by rural roads.

I routinely straightline twisty B-roads when I can see it’s clear and safe to do so which is exactly the sort of situation that a Lane Assist thing would be blaring warnings about.

Not sure that’s a good idea. Human vision in general isn’t all that reliable, which I’d have thought cyclists should know.

A lot of these features seem great for motorway or city driving, but seem to get very confused by rural roads

That’s when I turn mine off.

Are folk saying they indicate when changing lanes on a deserted motorway at 11pm at night?

Yep.  I would do it simply because I may have missed seeing someone.  Yes, of course I should always be aware of everything at all times but I’m also quite comfortable with doing something extra just in case I did miss something.

I was musing the other day how it’s odd that I’ve had cars with rear view cameras and a battery of forward-facing sensors for years now, yet no-one’s thought to hook them all up to a recording device. We have insurance discounts for young drivers with black boxes in their cars, it feels like a no-brainer to me to stick an SD card on the back of the existing tech rather than have drivers use third-party cameras which might get their window put through by scrotes.

This I believe is driven by a belief that the great motoring public would never buy such a vehicle if alternatives existed.  I’m not sure its 100% true, but certainly many people would not pay extra for the feature.  unless of course insurers were going to offer big discounts for cars with evidence capture turned on… …but I’m not sure how keen insurers are, it could work both ways.  Currently they can use the “the cyclist came out of nowhere, the driver couldn’t possible have seen him and so we deny the lifelong care costs” defence…   might be awkward if there was mandatory evidence capture equipment fitted!   I think it will happen though when we get more autonomous vehicles.

That’s when I turn mine off.

Me too, but because I live in a very rural area the ‘when’ is every single drive which becomes tedious. The auto manufacturers or governments who mandate this technology must assume everyone lives in a city and always drives on dual carriageways. It just doesn’t work on unclassified country roads.

The lane assist steering you into a verge is one thing, the brake assist slamming the anchors on inappropriately is even worse. The last time it happened to me was on the approach to a 90° bend when it assumed I was going to collide with an oncoming tractor when we were both safely in the middle of our respective lanes. The car behind nearly rear ended me. This technology is being foisted on us when it’s not yet sufficiently developed to be safe or practical.