[Closed] Is it open season on TJ?

Or did someone take a contract out? Or am I just paranoid?

Not one but two taxis nearly got me last night.
1) I am on a roundabout heading straight on in the middle of the left hand lane of two. Taxi comes onto the roundabout from the entrance to my left without slowing or stopping. If I had not been looking down the road for someone doing this he would have got me. Didn't see me even after I shouted and when my lights were lighting up the car.

2)two lane one way street. heading for a fork. I want the right hand fork so am in the middle of the right hand lane only 50 m from the fork. Taxi comes up on my left and turns right pushing me into the kerb. No indicators. Looked straight at me and forced his way in. Pushing me towards the right hand kerb.

Both times I was in the right position on the road I believe, I have a steady and a flashing light front and rear, reflective stuff all over the bike.

grrrr.

The second one might be on CCTV so the cops are checking it out. if they got him he is going down!

Be careful out there - the b's are out to get [b][u]you[/u][/b]

Fixeded it for you!

The second one might be on CCTV so the cops are checking it out. if they got him he is going down!

innocent until proven guilty in a court of law?

Or did someone take a contract out? Or am I just paranoid?

just because you are paranoid it doesn't mean they are not out to get you 😉

if they got him he is going down!

don't worry TJ, the price of failure is high in my organisation

<sits back in chair, stroking cat>

Big n daft - oh he is guilty - even if I have to stitch him up like a kipper

Sounds dangerous out there, take care, hope you were wearing a helmet!! 😉

Taxi comes up on my left and turns right pushing me into the kerb. No indicators. Looked straight at me and forced his way in. Pushing me towards the right hand kerb.

If he'd done that to me, he'd have had some unwelcome additions or subtractions to the side of his car.

EDIT
It's like training a dog: There's no point chastising them 5 hours after they've been chewing the sofa to bits, but discilipine them when you catch them in the act and it'll sink home pretty quickly.

even if I have to stitch him up like a kipper

But that would be wrong, and you're NEVER wrong

wrt point 1 - happens all the time to me in the burgh. most fun when one gets one's face right up close to the driver's window and shout loudly at which point they often poo themselves!

PP -= I was very tempted but I'm trying to grow up now I am approaching middle age - and it might be on CCTV

Flatfish =- end justifies the means

MrK mkII - he was doing 30 mph and didn't slow down Otherwise I would have done

aaahhh a typical reactionary then

(a leftie whose been mugged/burgled/cut up by a taxi driver :wink:)

Be careful out there - the b's are out to get you

Swear filter avoidance?
😉

PP -= I was very tempted but I'm trying to grow up now I am approaching middle age - and it might be on CCTV

I know where you're coming from, but a car has a registration plate on it for easy identification on CCTV. A bicycle does not. 😈

(2) doesn't sound like fun

I am gonna get me some of [url= http://www.sheldonbrown.com/lirpa.html#bayonetz ]these[/url]

I want my money back.

Taxis, enough said. IME although they should be highly skilled due to all the hours they drive they must be some of the worst drivers on the road.

Just 2 thoughts on the second one....

......why were you riding in the 'middle' of the lane on the bike, I would have issues with your consideration to others on this,

.....also when turning right, if there is traffic or the road is not clear, is a cyclist not supposed to pull in to the left hand kerb until it is clear and safe for you to make your manouver

in no 1 I would question you being in the 'middle' of the lane, but guy entering from left and not stopping is clearly a @osser regardless

At junctions, or when overtaking
parked cars, get in the right position
early. For example, to turn right from
a major into a minor road, first look
behind and signal right. When it’s safe to
do so, cross the left carriageway to ride
just left of the centre-line of the road

yep there we go from bikability site......when its safe to do so........taxi approaching from behind safe to do so?

Have you thought about http://www.rsct.org.uk/pages/level2.htm

Haha! Someone beat me to it! It's YOUR fault for riding wrong! 😆

......why were you riding in the 'middle' of the lane on the bike, I would have issues with your consideration to others on this,

Why?
A bicycle is traffic and [i]should[/i] follow that same rules as the rest of the traffic. He is perfectly entitiled to be in the centre of his lane if he so wishes and it is 100% the onus of any vehicle approaching from behind to pass safely and legally. Now, I don't know the junction in question, but as a regualar commuter I [u]KNOW[/u] that if you fanny around at the side of the road you'll be harrassed by cars and get nowhere. If you're making a turning on a busy road, act like you own your bit of the road: Mirror, siganal, manouver: Look behind, check the gap, indicate, pull out and get in the correct position. They HAVE to let you do this. They have no choice. Consideration had bugger all to do with it, it's about making a safe, visible turning, which a cyclist has every right to do.
So a car has to slow down for 10 seconds. Big deal. It'll get caught in the same queue 10 second later is all.....

yep there we go from bikability site......when its safe to do so........taxi approaching from behind safe to do so?

Maybe there was a big enough gap. Maybe the taxi was in the other lane so TJ was getting out of it's way. If you wait for every 'approaching' car you'll get nowhere. If a car turns right, sometimes you have to wait behind them. What's different for a bicycle?
I find that if you cycle by the book whan making turnings, be visible, indicate and make a confident manouver out from the nearside to the offside, that drivers WILL respect it and let you on your way. 🙂

is perfectly entitiled to be in the centre of his lane if he so wishes

Al - Fine when going down the road, but it's not possible to make a right turn from the left hand side of the road is it? Stop being picky, you know what I mean!

EDIT
Reading the OP again I can see exactly how TJ was riding: He was making a manouver that would leave him in the middle of the road at this fork no matter where he was positioned, so he chose the middle of his lane and rode in a confident manner to get through the junction as fast as he could whilst remeianing as visible as possible. If he'd have been an the left of his lane at the fork, he would have risked cars coming up both sides of him in an effort to get past. So he chose the middle of his lane to complete the manouver as he judged it the most correct and safest way to do so. After the fork he would ahve pulled back to the left of his lane.

Am I right TJ?

While I'm glad that you haven't come to any lasting harm.

What else do you expect from taxi drivers, who treat our roads and streets as their own play ground.
😉

In my city, bus drivers are just as bad, and its deliberate.

It would appear that there may be a sub-species of driver who has an inbred hatred of cyclists. An emotion they can neither control or articulate.
Normally observed in drivers of taxis, buses and white vans.

Be Safe.
😉

PP what you are now saying is quite different to what I quoted! Of course you have to move to the right of the lane to turn right, that doesn't justify riding in the middle of the lane until you do so.

In any event, that's not what TJ was doing and there was no need, from what I have seen, for him to be in the middle of the lane (unless he was going to turn/move right after the junction in question).

TJ was this Bristo Place?

EDIT

If he'd have been an the left of his lane at the fork, he would have risked cars coming up both sides of him in an effort to get past.

Is this necessarily risky? I think not.

@ ChunkyMTB Anyone with any sense would have paid in full following satisfactory completion of the job...

PP what you are now saying is quite different to what I quoted!

You quoted a short, all encompassing phrase from the Highway Code which you hoped would trip me up, and failed. 😀 😉

That said maybe this bit of mine
[i]"He is perfectly entitiled to be in the centre of his lane if he so wishes and it is 100% the onus of any vehicle approaching from behind to pass safely and legally. "[/i]

was a bit vague?
Maybe I should have said

[i]He is perfectly entitiled to [b]use all of his lane to make his turning[/b] and it is 100% the onus of any vehicle approaching from behind to pass safely and legally. [/i]

EDIT
Just seen your edit!

Is this necessarily risky? I think not.

I think it is. Traffic passing both sides? Or traffic passing only on one side? Catch my drift?

🙂

Ah so you "kind of" admit you're wrong then? 🙄

Traffic passing both sides? Doesn't need to be risky IMO/E, this can happen to me daily, it's not always risky.

As much as I dislike TJ's ideology he comes across a capable town cyclist. He appears to have acted correctly, the driver was an idiot.
What often helps is beinging 6'10" or carry an axe on the rucksack.
BTW Years ago I seem to remember hearing on the BBC London radio station that statistically you are more likely to be mistreated by other road users as a cyclist if you don't wear a helmet. That would be a tough one for TJ to accept if true.

Hairychested - Member

BTW Years ago I seem to remember hearing on the BBC London radio station that statistically you are more likely to be mistreated by other road users as a cyclist if you don't wear a helmet. That would be a tough one for TJ to accept if true.

A recent report concluded the opposite! So he's OK...

Ah so you "kind of" admit you're wrong then?

Eh? No. Not at all. I just phrased it differently. We both know what I meant first time, but some people need simple things spoon feeding to them so they can understand...... 😛

Traffic passing both sides? Doesn't need to be risky IMO/E, this can happen to me daily, it's not always risky.

So sometimes, at least, it IS RISKY then! 🙂
And if it's sometimes risky, and TJ can stop it happening, that's good, right?

Taaaa-Daaaaa! 😉

LOL at the back-pedalling, it should be an olympic sport!

LOL at the back-pedalling, it should be an olympic sport!

what tyres for that?

😆

All good fun Al!

The number on the licence plate of the taxi has no relevance to the expected IQ of the driver,

Got cut up by a taxi a few years ago, took out my camera and started taking pictures of him and the taxi, he got quite angry, i just explained that his pictures would be posted up www,neanderthals driving taxis.com, he even asked how i spelt neanderthals.

Al - bristo place going south towards bristo square

I cannot believe you would put yourself in a position between two lanes and allow cars to pass both sides - thats wrong and dangerous road positioning.

There are two lanes going south - the right hand one turns right the left hand one turns left. There is not room for 2 cars and a bike safely so whichever way you are going on a bike the safe place to be is in the centre of the lane I was about in line with the right hand side of the red car in this pic.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Bristo+Place,+Edinburgh&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=12.426641,28.256836&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Bristo+Pl,+Edinburgh+EH1,+United+Kingdom&ll=55.946148,-3.190026&spn=0.011487,0.027595&z=15&layer=c&cbll=55.946051,-3.189819&panoid=WvooiJX_RAN29KXvnvCvqQ&cbp=12,120.37,,0,5

After the junction I would drop to the left into the cycle lane but I would never allow a car to pass both sides. There was another car 20 m ahead of me If I had been in the red painted bit there would not have been room for the taxi to pass me safely on my right, he should not attempt to pass going thru a junction anyway

The IAM, the UK’s largest independent road safety charity, recommends cyclists:

* Take up a primary position around 75-100m before reaching a junction, in the centre of the lane, providing it is safe to do so. This move will mean that drivers exiting the junction will be more likely to see the cyclist as they are in the same traffic flow as more hazardous vehicles.

http://www.iam.org.uk/latest_news/cyclistsclaimyourlanesaysiam.html

There is not room for 2 cars and a bike safely

I disagree. I think I disagree with the IAM also.

EDIT I actually agree with this: "Remember it is not always sensible or appropriate to take the centre of the lane especially if traffic is heavy."

so cynic al is right, IAM and highway code are wrong.

[img] [/img]

The IAM, the UK’s largest independent road safety charity, recommends cyclists:

* Take up a primary position around 75-100m before reaching a junction, in the centre of the lane, providing it is safe to do so. This move will mean that drivers exiting the junction will be more likely to see the cyclist as they are in the same traffic flow as more hazardous vehicles.

Sounds about right to me. You've GOT TO get into the flow of the traffic to make your turn, otherwise you'll be sat waiting in the gutter for both lanes to clear, so you might as well leave the bike at home and walk in that case..!

And it works.
Make a bold, correct move to the centre/offside of your lane, without slowing down and you'll be given the respect and room you need. Fanny around in the gutter and you'll be sliced up like a joint of ham. 🙂

Not sure what rule 163 has to do with anything TJ, or am I in breach of that too somehow?

Anyway I still don't think there's a need to hog the middle of the lane on that road.

Too many flashing lights mean the driver could not actually tell where you were. Or even look directly at you ? Therefore they guessed they they had over taken you but you were cycling faster than average cyclist ?

Al - "hogging" shows your car driver bias. its holding no one up, its clearly the correct road positioning. Basic defensive riding Youare not holding traffic up - you are traffic

That rules shows that there is not room for a car to pass either side safely. as a car doing so would be in breach of it.

However - you clearly know better than the IAM, highway code and anyone who knows what defensive riding is.

Edit - and CTC

4) Ride both assertively and defensively. For example, claim your road space, ensure that you clearly indicate your intentions to other road users and avoid putting yourself into a position where a mistake by others might put you at risk. Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as vehicles. Always apply this principle and ride in a way that demands others give due recognition to your right to use the public road.

scu98rkr - no -= he came up behind me - pulled to my left - drove alongside me looked straight at me and moved right pushing me into teh kerb.

he had seen me and knew exactly where I was

TJ I still don't see what that picture has to do with the situation we are discussing. Road widths do vary.

Yes I do take a different approach to you on this stuff and I'm not saying it's for everyone, but it works for me.

LOL I hesitated before leaving "hogging" in there, I knew you'd fall for that!

😛

EDIT anyway does the HC not say "stay to the left"?

Al - you state there is enough room for 2 cars and a bike on that section of road. If the cars are obeying that rule there clearly is not. Is there room for 3 cars? No. In that case there is not enough room for 2 cars and a bike according to the highway code. Simple enough for you?

As usual you are actually just trying to assert your dominance and troll not actually wanting to understand.

I don't know why I waste my time debating anything with you. I won't again.

Is there room for 3 cars? No.

I think there might well be. I understand your view TJ and I stand by mine.

Does it always have to be about right and wrong? I'm just saying what I do works for me and I consider it safe. I'm not saying that you're wrong remember!

BTW it's not about dominance!

Edinburgh taxis are a nightmare. Good luck nailing him, did you get his taxi number? They do have a formal complaint system.

scu98rkr - no -= he came up behind me - pulled to my left - drove alongside me looked straight at me and moved right pushing me into teh kerb.

he had seen me and knew exactly where I was

He'd have been walking back down the road for his wing mirror if he'd have tried that on me.

Tandem even in you own link it says "PROVIDING IT IS SAFE TO DO SO"
you wouldn't have started this thread if you thought the situation was safe ergo you are in contravention of the passage you yourself linked!!

Tandem even in you own link it says "PROVIDING IT IS SAFE TO DO SO"

Well, if you think about it, it WAS safe to do so being as the taxi driver in question undertook him and came from the left!

Also, at what point does SAFE TO DO SO become a green light to be forced into the gutter? Answer me that....

you wouldn't have started this thread if you thought the situation was safe ergo you are in contravention of the passage you yourself linked!!

He wouldn't have started the thread if he thought the situation was safe? He's deemed it to be safe and is there fore bang-on right to do what he did!
Come back and try again when you make some sense!

I did not pull in front of the taxi - at the previous junction (100m back from the pic I posted ) there were 3 cars - one in the left lane two in the right. No one behind me for a distance. AS I approached theis junction the lights started to change ( I saw the ped lights go to red) do I pulled into the centre of the lane behind the two cars - I had enough time to get to the front ( there is an ASL right across both lanes) and block them but did not. As I accelerated away following the two cars the taxi had not had to slow for the traffic lights thus caught me up. I was only a short distance behind the car in front. teh taxi would have had no room to get intot eh correcft lane between me and the cvar in front without going far too close to one or both of us. I was in the safest place in the road other than getting off and walking.

It was 7.30 at night. not much traffic.

safe doesn't only have to account for your own actions safe also needs to take into account the sometimes inconsistent actions of other road users.....................

that good enough for you.........

I belive you Teej, but it seems you have a problem with those that are hard of thinking and big on trying to look clever.....

Where else could I have gone on the road?

safe doesn't only have to account for your own actions safe also needs to take into account the sometimes inconsistent actions of other road users.....................

Go on then, tell me how you 'account' for what happened to TJ. I'm all ears.

TJ was 100% right and there's no other way of putting it.

Is that a reference to me?

First sign of madness:

Referring to yourself in the third person...

TJ got cut up by a car through no fault of his own we all agree on this, but TJ could have avoided being cut up if he had stayed in the left of either the left or right hand lanes, and made his manouver when the road was clear, granted he may have suffered some inconvenience possibly having to stop but its better than being squashed by the next taxi that might not see you, all for the sake of you own equal rights road owning ego

Errm - have you rad what I wrote? The taxi came up from behind me. My speed was limited by the car I was following. Going on the left of the right hand lane he would simply have pushed past me the other way pushing me into cars on my left or teh traffic island, going on the left of the left lane I would not have been able to take the right turn I was making legally and safely.

Its not that the taxi did not see me - its that he just pushed me out of his way. Because I was riding defensively I saw him coming and had room on the road to avoid him

Have a look at eh google link above

I read the initial post, and knowing TJ is in Edinburgh guessed which junction it was...and I was right.

TJ - you did the right thing, and were in the right place in the road. Anyone disagreeing doesn't know the road, or is wrong 😉

Taxis round there are a nightmare even if you're in a car.

I nearly got a pedestrian this morning- does that make us even? Ruddy peds fault and I wasn't as near to hitting them as they thought - dozy moo.

However - you clearly know better than the IAM, highway code and anyone who knows what defensive riding is.

Bit rich?

Everyone needs to be careful out there, if they don't see you even if you wear the right gear and wave 😯 try banging on the car with your feet!

maybe they will hear you 💡

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/drivers-at-fault-in-majority-of-cycling-accidents-28489
😉

@TandemJeremy - it does seem like taxi and bus drivers are particularly cranky & thoughtless on Edinburgh roads at the moment. Got pushed by an overtaking bus into a parked car the other week, in broad daylight...

Lights don't seem to improve safety, so I'm going for a horn as well.

Taxis, enough said. IME although they should be highly skilled due to all the hours they drive they must be some of the worst drivers on the road.

I think it's an extension of the idea that 'familiarity breeds contempt'. IE, they're on the roads so much, that they develop their own sets of rules and codes of conduct, that suit themselves, rather than obeying the actual Law and respecting other road users. The same applies to bus drivers, vayn drivers, as well as cyclists. If getting about quickly is part of your job, or you need to get places fast, then you tend to cut corners, sometimes quite literally.

The bus drivers in London on the whole aren't too bad, as they're generally not in such a rush. Taxi drivers seem to have the idea that they and they alone have the right to drive as they like, and no-one else should be lowed to use the roads. I've had more run-ins with Black Cab drivers than any other drivers. Some of them are utter, utter scum. I've had them deliberately cut me up, pull out on me, even drive right into me. They just don't care.

I won't go into any accounts of some of my retaliatory actions, on a Family Forum...

Ohh purleeeese!

Elfinsafety - Member

I won't go into any accounts of some of my retaliatory actions, [s]on a Family Forum... [/s] [b]because they are pure fantasy.[/b]

FTFY

Ohh purleeeese!

What? You came here and ride around central London, then tell me cabbies aren't homicidal maniacs!!

You don't know me, do you, Al? You have no idea, sunshine...

You are very cynical though, I must say... 😉

I know you well enough little boy, you are worse than that ton and his "fist pie"!

@TandemJeremy - it does seem like taxi and bus drivers are particularly cranky & thoughtless on Edinburgh roads at the moment. Got pushed by an overtaking bus into a parked car the other week, in broad daylight...

Lights don't seem to improve safety, so I'm going for a horn as well.

On the whole the buses in Edinburgh are amazing - their boss makes them watch a helmet cam video of him cycling to work during their training i think. the taxis really are a nightmare though.

re the horn - a mate bought one and used it for the first time on an old boy in a car who cut him up at lights. the old boy got out his car and challenged him to fisticuffs! hilarious.

I find the buses OK with cyclists

I know you well enough little boy, you are worse than that ton and his "fist pie"!

Oh right, I'd forgotten you've met me several times, and have been present when I've had altercations with cab drivers. Silly me. 🙄

Do yerself a favour and go and do yer washing up; it's starting to smell.
Run along now.

Patronising to the last eh? 🙄

Unlike yourself, of course:

I know you well enough little boy

Have a word with yourself. I know you need to 'win' this one, same as how you need to prove what a great bike rider you are by sprinting away from people, but I know and you know there's little point in continuing this, as you'll only make yourself look stupid.

Be quiet now please. If you respond to me again, then you'll only show yourself up to be a petty-minded insecure frustrated individual.

See how you're sitting there thinking up your next witty condescending response? Have you wondered how you could turn that energy into something positive and productive?

I've done you a favour here. It's ok though; you're welcome. S'the sort of bloke I am. 🙂

X

On the whole the buses in Edinburgh are amazing - their boss makes them watch a helmet cam video of him cycling to work during their training i think. the taxis really are a nightmare though.

re the horn - a mate bought one and used it for the first time on an old boy in a car who cut him up at lights. the old boy got out his car and challenged him to fisticuffs! hilarious.

Actually, I do think the buses are pretty good. My incident was out of the ordinary, for the buses. 🙂 Interesting to know about the video.

@BigJim - are you saying a horn is a good or a bad idea, then? :-))

Fred I'm gonna set my mate ton on ya.

We'll see who's laughing then.

That's rubbish. That's like sprinting away from someone, then yer chain snaps and you slip and smash yer knackers on the top tube, yer chin on the stem, and yer shin on a pedal. And end up in a heap on the floor, crying, while I just ride past shaking my head at your foolishness.

🙄