The IAM, the UK’s largest independent road safety charity, recommends cyclists:

* Take up a primary position around 75-100m before reaching a junction, in the centre of the lane, providing it is safe to do so. This move will mean that drivers exiting the junction will be more likely to see the cyclist as they are in the same traffic flow as more hazardous vehicles.

Sounds about right to me. You’ve GOT TO get into the flow of the traffic to make your turn, otherwise you’ll be sat waiting in the gutter for both lanes to clear, so you might as well leave the bike at home and walk in that case..!

And it works.
Make a bold, correct move to the centre/offside of your lane, without slowing down and you’ll be given the respect and room you need. Fanny around in the gutter and you’ll be sliced up like a joint of ham. 🙂

Not sure what rule 163 has to do with anything TJ, or am I in breach of that too somehow?

Anyway I still don’t think there’s a need to hog the middle of the lane on that road.

Too many flashing lights mean the driver could not actually tell where you were. Or even look directly at you ? Therefore they guessed they they had over taken you but you were cycling faster than average cyclist ?

Al – “hogging” shows your car driver bias. its holding no one up, its clearly the correct road positioning. Basic defensive riding Youare not holding traffic up – you are traffic

That rules shows that there is not room for a car to pass either side safely. as a car doing so would be in breach of it.

However – you clearly know better than the IAM, highway code and anyone who knows what defensive riding is.

Edit – and CTC

4) Ride both assertively and defensively. For example, claim your road space, ensure that you clearly indicate your intentions to other road users and avoid putting yourself into a position where a mistake by others might put you at risk. Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as vehicles. Always apply this principle and ride in a way that demands others give due recognition to your right to use the public road.

scu98rkr – no -= he came up behind me – pulled to my left – drove alongside me looked straight at me and moved right pushing me into teh kerb.

he had seen me and knew exactly where I was

TJ I still don’t see what that picture has to do with the situation we are discussing. Road widths do vary.

Yes I do take a different approach to you on this stuff and I’m not saying it’s for everyone, but it works for me.

LOL I hesitated before leaving “hogging” in there, I knew you’d fall for that!

😛

EDIT anyway does the HC not say “stay to the left”?

Al – you state there is enough room for 2 cars and a bike on that section of road. If the cars are obeying that rule there clearly is not. Is there room for 3 cars? No. In that case there is not enough room for 2 cars and a bike according to the highway code. Simple enough for you?

As usual you are actually just trying to assert your dominance and troll not actually wanting to understand.

I don’t know why I waste my time debating anything with you. I won’t again.

Is there room for 3 cars? No.

I think there might well be. I understand your view TJ and I stand by mine.

Does it always have to be about right and wrong? I’m just saying what I do works for me and I consider it safe. I’m not saying that you’re wrong remember!

BTW it’s not about dominance!

Edinburgh taxis are a nightmare. Good luck nailing him, did you get his taxi number? They do have a formal complaint system.

scu98rkr – no -= he came up behind me – pulled to my left – drove alongside me looked straight at me and moved right pushing me into teh kerb.

he had seen me and knew exactly where I was

He’d have been walking back down the road for his wing mirror if he’d have tried that on me.

Tandem even in you own link it says “PROVIDING IT IS SAFE TO DO SO”
you wouldn’t have started this thread if you thought the situation was safe ergo you are in contravention of the passage you yourself linked!!

Tandem even in you own link it says “PROVIDING IT IS SAFE TO DO SO”

Well, if you think about it, it WAS safe to do so being as the taxi driver in question undertook him and came from the left!

Also, at what point does SAFE TO DO SO become a green light to be forced into the gutter? Answer me that….

you wouldn’t have started this thread if you thought the situation was safe ergo you are in contravention of the passage you yourself linked!!

He wouldn’t have started the thread if he thought the situation was safe? He’s deemed it to be safe and is there fore bang-on right to do what he did!
Come back and try again when you make some sense!

I did not pull in front of the taxi – at the previous junction (100m back from the pic I posted ) there were 3 cars – one in the left lane two in the right. No one behind me for a distance. AS I approached theis junction the lights started to change ( I saw the ped lights go to red) do I pulled into the centre of the lane behind the two cars – I had enough time to get to the front ( there is an ASL right across both lanes) and block them but did not. As I accelerated away following the two cars the taxi had not had to slow for the traffic lights thus caught me up. I was only a short distance behind the car in front. teh taxi would have had no room to get intot eh correcft lane between me and the cvar in front without going far too close to one or both of us. I was in the safest place in the road other than getting off and walking.

It was 7.30 at night. not much traffic.

safe doesn’t only have to account for your own actions safe also needs to take into account the sometimes inconsistent actions of other road users…………………

that good enough for you………

I belive you Teej, but it seems you have a problem with those that are hard of thinking and big on trying to look clever…..

Where else could I have gone on the road?

safe doesn’t only have to account for your own actions safe also needs to take into account the sometimes inconsistent actions of other road users…………………

Go on then, tell me how you ‘account’ for what happened to TJ. I’m all ears.

TJ was 100% right and there’s no other way of putting it.

Is that a reference to me?

First sign of madness:

Referring to yourself in the third person…

TJ got cut up by a car through no fault of his own we all agree on this, but TJ could have avoided being cut up if he had stayed in the left of either the left or right hand lanes, and made his manouver when the road was clear, granted he may have suffered some inconvenience possibly having to stop but its better than being squashed by the next taxi that might not see you, all for the sake of you own equal rights road owning ego

Errm – have you rad what I wrote? The taxi came up from behind me. My speed was limited by the car I was following. Going on the left of the right hand lane he would simply have pushed past me the other way pushing me into cars on my left or teh traffic island, going on the left of the left lane I would not have been able to take the right turn I was making legally and safely.

Its not that the taxi did not see me – its that he just pushed me out of his way. Because I was riding defensively I saw him coming and had room on the road to avoid him

Have a look at eh google link above

I read the initial post, and knowing TJ is in Edinburgh guessed which junction it was…and I was right.

TJ – you did the right thing, and were in the right place in the road. Anyone disagreeing doesn’t know the road, or is wrong 😉

Taxis round there are a nightmare even if you’re in a car.

I nearly got a pedestrian this morning- does that make us even? Ruddy peds fault and I wasn’t as near to hitting them as they thought – dozy moo.

However – you clearly know better than the IAM, highway code and anyone who knows what defensive riding is.

Bit rich?

Everyone needs to be careful out there, if they don’t see you even if you wear the right gear and wave 😯 try banging on the car with your feet!

maybe they will hear you 💡

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/drivers-at-fault-in-majority-of-cycling-accidents-28489
😉

@TandemJeremy – it does seem like taxi and bus drivers are particularly cranky & thoughtless on Edinburgh roads at the moment. Got pushed by an overtaking bus into a parked car the other week, in broad daylight…

Lights don’t seem to improve safety, so I’m going for a horn as well.

Taxis, enough said. IME although they should be highly skilled due to all the hours they drive they must be some of the worst drivers on the road.

I think it’s an extension of the idea that ‘familiarity breeds contempt’. IE, they’re on the roads so much, that they develop their own sets of rules and codes of conduct, that suit themselves, rather than obeying the actual Law and respecting other road users. The same applies to bus drivers, vayn drivers, as well as cyclists. If getting about quickly is part of your job, or you need to get places fast, then you tend to cut corners, sometimes quite literally.

The bus drivers in London on the whole aren’t too bad, as they’re generally not in such a rush. Taxi drivers seem to have the idea that they and they alone have the right to drive as they like, and no-one else should be lowed to use the roads. I’ve had more run-ins with Black Cab drivers than any other drivers. Some of them are utter, utter scum. I’ve had them deliberately cut me up, pull out on me, even drive right into me. They just don’t care.

I won’t go into any accounts of some of my retaliatory actions, on a Family Forum…

Ohh purleeeese!

Elfinsafety – Member

I won’t go into any accounts of some of my retaliatory actions, on a Family Forum… because they are pure fantasy.

FTFY

Ohh purleeeese!

What? You came here and ride around central London, then tell me cabbies aren’t homicidal maniacs!!

You don’t know me, do you, Al? You have no idea, sunshine…

You are very cynical though, I must say… 😉

I know you well enough little boy, you are worse than that ton and his “fist pie”!

@TandemJeremy – it does seem like taxi and bus drivers are particularly cranky & thoughtless on Edinburgh roads at the moment. Got pushed by an overtaking bus into a parked car the other week, in broad daylight…

Lights don’t seem to improve safety, so I’m going for a horn as well.

On the whole the buses in Edinburgh are amazing – their boss makes them watch a helmet cam video of him cycling to work during their training i think. the taxis really are a nightmare though.

re the horn – a mate bought one and used it for the first time on an old boy in a car who cut him up at lights. the old boy got out his car and challenged him to fisticuffs! hilarious.

I find the buses OK with cyclists

I know you well enough little boy, you are worse than that ton and his “fist pie”!

Oh right, I’d forgotten you’ve met me several times, and have been present when I’ve had altercations with cab drivers. Silly me. 🙄

Do yerself a favour and go and do yer washing up; it’s starting to smell.
Run along now.

Patronising to the last eh? 🙄

Unlike yourself, of course:

I know you well enough little boy

Have a word with yourself. I know you need to ‘win’ this one, same as how you need to prove what a great bike rider you are by sprinting away from people, but I know and you know there’s little point in continuing this, as you’ll only make yourself look stupid.

Be quiet now please. If you respond to me again, then you’ll only show yourself up to be a petty-minded insecure frustrated individual.

See how you’re sitting there thinking up your next witty condescending response? Have you wondered how you could turn that energy into something positive and productive?

I’ve done you a favour here. It’s ok though; you’re welcome. S’the sort of bloke I am. 🙂

X

On the whole the buses in Edinburgh are amazing – their boss makes them watch a helmet cam video of him cycling to work during their training i think. the taxis really are a nightmare though.

re the horn – a mate bought one and used it for the first time on an old boy in a car who cut him up at lights. the old boy got out his car and challenged him to fisticuffs! hilarious.

Actually, I do think the buses are pretty good. My incident was out of the ordinary, for the buses. 🙂 Interesting to know about the video.

@BigJim – are you saying a horn is a good or a bad idea, then? :-))

Fred I’m gonna set my mate ton on ya.

We’ll see who’s laughing then.

That’s rubbish. That’s like sprinting away from someone, then yer chain snaps and you slip and smash yer knackers on the top tube, yer chin on the stem, and yer shin on a pedal. And end up in a heap on the floor, crying, while I just ride past shaking my head at your foolishness.

🙄