F1 2021 – spoilers here

Ignore me, 10 place penalty not a go to the back penalty. Mazapin in 18th

17th? Bottas, LeClerc, Verstappen. Who else is at the back?

Latifi

Jesus, where’s Mazepin starting now?

If you're confused about how the back of the grid is now looking with all of these grid penalties…

P16: Giovinazzi
P17: Bottas
P18: Latifi
P19: Leclerc
P20: Verstappen

— The Race (@wearetherace) September 26, 2021

Should be a good race.

I’ve never quite got the negativity for Sochi – it’s always produces some incidents and has proper overtaking spots.

So Bottas will start P16, with Mazepin 15 and Schumacher 14. Giovanazzi will start P17.

A mixed up grid and rain forecast. will this actually be entertaining?

Very! Couldn’t believe it when I looked up and it was only lap 12. Battles up and down the field!

this fun

Wow. What a race. I have been thoroughly entertained start to finish. I honestly thought Merc made the wrong call there at the end with the pit stop and McLaren nailed it.

Well done Lewis, 100 wins is something else. Gutted for Norris mind, he raced so well.

amazing race for Hamilton and Verstappen! Feel for Norris, such a shame

Great race. Gutted for Lando, brave call that backfire unfortunately.

I can’t remember the last time I’ve enjoyed a season as much as this one! So many ups and downs. We are witnessing a classic for sure

I thought at the time that Norris was making a hero/zero decision by staying out, was really hoping it would be a hero moment. Gutted for him but happy for Hamilton, 100 and counting is a massive record that will be hard to beat.

Just a pity that Verstappen got such a good result, means the penalty for Monza and the engine are pretty much pointless.

When did Bottas sign for red bull? He might as well have rolled out the red carpet for max. Mercedes might as well ditch bottas and use a reserve driver for the rest of the season

Mercedes might as well ditch bottas and use a reserve driver for the rest of the season

I thought exactly the same.

means the penalty for Monza and the engine are pretty much pointless.

He started at the back of grid, or are you just cheesed off about the fact that underneath all the petulance, there’s a very talented driver?

He started at the back of grid, or are you just cheesed off about the fact that underneath all the petulance, there’s a very talented driver?

…and a very lucky one. Right call, right time.

The problem with taking the 3 place drop at the same time as the engine penalty is that is effectively cancels out the 3 place penalty for the driving error which caused the accident. This creates an issue where you can’t avoid the penalty if you are given it during the race (10 seconds, stop go etc) and you can carry on driving but you can if it results in you DNFing as they always look at it after the race.
That’s how the rules currently work and it isn’t working to punish the offenders properly.
They could simply say you can’t take a driving grid place penalty at the same race as a component swap penalty, unless it’s the last race. That would make sure all the penalties have an effect on potential results and hopefully will help to modify behaviours.

Tacking concurrent penalties makes a mockery of the punishment, I’m sure merc have benefited from this in the past?

What can you say about Bottas?

They could simply say you can’t take a driving grid place penalty at the same race as a component swap penalty, unless it’s the last race.

That’s way to simple and sensible for an F1 rule. Come back when you’ve padded it out to 4 sides of A4 with all kinds of pointless technical language.

Great race though. Gutted for Lando, Lewis held his nerve and stayed out of trouble in the early laps biding his time. Nearly cost him though.

Much as I dislike a lot about Max, when he is on fire and driving cleanly he is exceptional also so chapeau to him also. Yes I would have liked to see Lewis pull out more of a lead but you cannot deny Max didn’t earn the position.

Will be a cracking end to the season…

The problem with taking the 3 place drop at the same time as the engine penalty is that is effectively cancels out the 3 place penalty for the driving error which caused the accident.

But the rule is the same for every one. Plus a grid penalty is still a grid penalty whether or not you change some other part of the car. Verstappen was both lucky and because he’s a talented driver backed by a good team managed to get a result way beyond what most folk (including RB) though was possible.

They could simply say you can’t take a driving grid place penalty at the same race as a component swap penalty, unless it’s the last race. That would make sure all the penalties have an effect on potential results and hopefully will help to modify behaviours.

Or, you get your three place drop after all engine penalities etc are applied. If you can’t be dropped 3 places (because you’re already at the back for whatever reason) then you take the 5 seconds or whatever the in-race equivalent was.

I’m not impressed with how Red Bull have handled things this year, but I think they were quite justified to be disappointed with how Silverstone turned out. Hamilton got a 10 second penalty for being predominantly at fault, but it meant nothing because his car was faster than anything else left after the crash. That part of it was just a normal racing incident, but Max losing an engine due to that crash was a potentially title-deciding blow.

This time, things went a bit the other way. Max got a grid penalty for being predominantly at fault, but it was cancelled out by the engine penalty. Through a combination of a truly impressive drive and some amazing luck, he finished second, which is really as good as he could have hoped for even without the penalties. His engine penalty hasn’t affected the championship, so I think both sides should just put it all to bed and get on with enjoying the best championship battle in years.

Just thinking about Lando.
If he hadn’t binned it in Q3 at Spa he was looking likely for pole, and therefore the win as it turned out, the team told him not to race Daniel at Monza, he could have had a go on a couple of occasions and then he came within a couple of laps of a win in Sotchi.
Within a whisker of three race wins on the trot. Let’s hope next year’s Mclaren is a good one!

It would be hard to begrudge Verstappen the championship if he is producing performances like that in adversity.

It would be hard to begrudge Verstappen the championship if he is producing performances like that in adversity.

Absolutely agreed. He and Redbull have made far less mistakes than Hamilton and Mercedes. But Redbull (not so much Max) are making it hard for me to like them this year.

I think it woul dbe hard to begrudge either Max or Lewis the championship. It is a proper title fight, the likes we have not seen for many many years.

Both have had moments of genius with some truly outstanding drives and both have had off weekends. Lewis by his exceptionally high standards has not been quite on top of his game but it is great to see other teams in the mix as well on the odd race.

Fascinating stuff and whowever wins will be well deserving assuming no real dirty shanningans in the last few races.

But Redbull (not so much Max) are making it hard for me to like them this year.

I think RedBull without Horner and Marko would be a far more likeable proposition. Over the years Horner has done nothing to make me feel any more favourable towards him – they’re smug when they win and vile when they lose. Sadly Max is being schooled by them which makes his talent harder to appreciate too.

The amount of hate towards Lewis is crazy. The F1 page on FB is a perfect example. I mean I don’t really have much to say about him really, but people calling him lucky his whole career and being given the best car is just mental. I thought football fans were the most hateful, but some F1 fans are worse than that.

Yesterday was the first race I’ve watched from start to finish, I really enjoyed it. I was really gutted for Lando, and also Sainz. I thought he made a great start, but that startegy was wrong and the Ferrari just didn’t have the outright pace. F1 will be very competitive at the front in 3-4 years, so many great young drivers starting to shine now.

What can you say about Bottas?

Starts 16th, finishes 5th?

What can you say about Bottas?

Starts 16th, finishes 5th?

Usually good, occasionally brilliant, but not consistently brilliant like he needs to be to win a title. Top of the second tier, as good as the likes of Webber, Coulthard, Berger, Barachello. He has delivered four consecutive constructors titles and is well on the way to number five.

Starts 16th, finishes 5th?

He was well outside the points until the rain came.

He was well outside the points until the rain came.

Norris was leading until the rain came…Never really understood why a driver who’s been employed to do precisely what he’s done for the last 4 seasons gets as much grief as he does.

Because he’s always claimed to be better than he is – every new season is going to be his championship season, with tales of increased training and focus over winter. It’s over a year since he won a race now.

At least the likes of Barrichello and Irvine accepted their No.2 status.

While we’re on No.2 drivers – Perez needs to up his game. Should have been a minimum of a podium yesterday in that car.

What can you say about Bottas?

I think one of the tech analyses on the weekend compared the rear wing on the Red Bull and Merc, with the Merc having a much higher downforce wing. I’m not sure why Merc would do that, maybe to do with getting the tyres up to temperature. Anyway, if that’s the case, it might explain why both Hamilton and Bottas had so much trouble passing much slower cars whereas Max didn’t.

Because he’s always claimed to be better than he is

Said every racing driver in F1 since the dawn of time. I think it pretty much goes with the job description doesn’t it? For a driver who’s only ever been given one year contracts, he’s been remarkably consistent behind a driver who’s total wins is equal to the combined wins of Lauda, Senna and Fangio…(made up stat. of the day)

I think one of the tech analyses on the weekend compared the rear wing on the Red Bull and Merc, with the Merc having a much higher downforce wing. I’m not sure why Merc would do that,

More like the other way around, RB had commented that they’d reduced Verstappens wing to increase the overtake opportunity and move him forward.

More like the other way around, RB had commented that they’d reduced Verstappens wing to increase the overtake opportunity and move him forward.

That’s what I mean. Red Bull ran less wing which makes passing on the straight easier. Both Mercs struggled to overtake anybody, it’s wasn’t just Bottas.

Was it not because the other cars were running a wet bias set up for qualifying and the Max didn’t as he started from the back without qualifying.
Not 100% sure on the parc ferme rules.

Was it not because the other cars were running a wet bias set up for qualifying

I was wondering if Merc had gone for a better wet setup thinking that there was a good chance of rain during the race. Didn’t think about Max not taking part in qualifying.