Donald! Trump!

Channel 4 are a state-owned broadcaster btw. I wasn’t referring to the beeb…..

when results like this, and brexit come in my opinion sways further and firmer towards that the fact that a seemingly large majority and an increasing percentage of the population are, frankly, utter scumbags.
No, they ill informed, easily led, and aren’t being provided with a genuine alternative.

Let’s tackle those issues.

lol

the MSM

Oh my. That’s one away from me shouting “House!”

What’s the finale? My last square is something of the anti-lockdown/anti-vax/covid-denial ilk.

Go on. You know you want to.

Love the snarfing liberal elite chipping in to prove everyone’s point lol

To be honest, their influence is shrinking so fast that they will just be the BATOLM soon (Bitter And Twisted Old Lefty Media).

Turns out kimbers had the words I was reaching for.

And yet neither of you care to explain why. Do you seriously think the poor and less well off are treated with the same respect and inclusivity as we extend to other minority groups?

My point is that before Elon bought Twitter, every legitimate outrage about censorship was met with the cry of ‘if you don’t like it, start your own twitter’ from the left.

Yet now- they are suddenly all pro free speech because they can’t abuse X’s terms and conditions with impunity.

Typical lefty hypocrites.

There’s plenty of hypocrisy on the left on social media. No arguments from me there.

So would you also say all the right wingers that were complaining about censorship on twitter, and now have no problems with X banning journalists Elon doesn’t like, are typical right wing hypocrites?

@dazh – some are, some less so.

Pensioners for example are treated as Demi-gods by the media.
The unemployed, not so much.

Bitter And Twisted Old Lefty Media

CH you’ve raised some interesting points but FFS lay off the ‘lefty’ nonsense. The mainstream media are not lefties any more than most of the people on this forum. You don’t appear to understand what a ‘lefty’ is so maybe go and find out before spouting more bollocks eh?

Given the collusion involved last time in suppressing the Hunter Laptop story- Trump has every right to be a bit miffed at the state of the US ‘press’.

eyeroll emoji

FBI had warned companies not to share russian fakenews

laptop story was pushed by Russian accounts or proxies

so social media companies didnt touch it, but it turned out to actually be legitimate (although not the actual stuff that implicated biden sr as russian sources & trumpettes had claimed

Its amazing that ignoring the MSM ends up being about consuming the stuff that Russia wants to- see the stuff that Musk & Trump have retweeted from Tim Pool , Tucker ‘attacked by demons’ carlson and others funded by the Kremlin   and lets not go down the antivax- ivermectin wormhole…

I’m a middle class reasonably comfortable lefty @dazh
My father was a Fabian don’t you know.

He’s welcome to have a pop at me.

No because the oppression inflicted on the people I’m thinking of was proved to be nothing but politically motivated propaganda. It wasn’t part of a rules based order.
They woke up one day, decided 2+2=5 and purged everyone who said WTF….

Besides- if the shoe has been on the other foot, the journalists involved would have probably been suicided!!

Do you seriously think the poor and less well off are treated with the same respect and inclusivity as we extend to other minority groups?

You’ve already said that you think they’re not. Could you provide your evidence for this assertion?

On the lefty thing, I’ve already explained it’s shorthand for whatever the hell we are supposed to call the open border, globalist, pro censorship, oppressive, DEI obsessed conglomerate of interests.

Lefty/dem is quickest and easiest even though as I say, L/R is pretty much meaningless now….

@crosshair

What did you make of lockdown, BTW?

To me, it seems that Trumps policies are more about thwarting technological innovation.

all of his laws against women and the environment are just ‘Kaoss’, with the goal of keeping the left occupied with stuff that should have been properly codified decades ago.

Behave Kimbers lol
It was outright election interference.
And let’s not go down the Russia route…. Well mainly because since Hilary smashed up and bleached her laptop there is no more to say about it anyway.

26″ or 29″?

On the lefty thing, I’ve already explained it’s shorthand for whatever the hell we are supposed to call the open border, globalist, pro censorship, oppressive, DEI obsessed conglomerate of interests.

Which is nonsense, I’m what most people would call a classic lefty, an extremist left even and have been accused of it many times on here. I’m also anti-globaliist, anti-censorship, anti-oppression and anti-authoritarian. Granted I don’t particularly have a problem with open (or at least porous) borders and don’t have a problem with DEI as long as it’s not being rammed down my throat in a judgemental manner but the other aspects you mention are classic traits of rightwing neoliberal capitalism. Your association of all the above into the phrase ‘lefty’ makes no sense either in the traditional description of a lefty socialist or a more modern one in terms of a left liberal.

I doubt he’ll be thwarting Elon Musks tech given Musk we’ll be in charge of his own regulation.

Not sure I’d feel too comfortable around his driverless cars…

Lockdown seemed like a good initial theory implemented by clinically insane people to me.
I kind of got the idea behind it first time around but when it morphed into bonkers and ultimately made-up laws that seemed to me to be WORSE than doing nothing (ie no outdoor exercise, country walks etc etc) then I quickly decided it had become nothing but a psy-op to test compliance in large populations.

And let’s not go down the Russia route…. Well mainly because since Hilary smashed up and bleached her laptop there is no more to say about it anyway.

Oh, there’s plenty to say about Russia, very little of it to do with Trump’s fabrications.

It’s this kind of bad faith manufactured bullshit that leads us to where we are today.

What did you make of lockdown, BTW?

This is the Trump thread isn’t it.

Not sure I get your point Dazh. People and political ideas are complex and multi layered.

But those broad definitions get close enough to defining the sides of the culture war I am referring to.

To me, it seems that Trumps policies are more about thwarting technological innovation.

all of his laws against women and the environment are just ‘Kaoss’, with the goal of keeping the left occupied with stuff that should have been properly codified decades ago.

You missed off the destabilising effect of his avowed non-interventionism. Like it or not, past balls-ups or not, I’d much rather have an engaged US in global affairs in 2024 than one pretending they can just pull down the shutters.

I quickly decided it had become nothing but a psy-op to test compliance in large populations.

You are taking the piss now, right?

Actually, no. Never mind.

Life is too short for what comes next. This has been done a thousand times and it usually follows one or two pretty familiar paths.

Forget it.

No. It became totally potty. You could share a taxi with a stranger with masks on and breath in each others air but couldn’t sit with a friend on a park bench.
The irony is that a lot of the gestapo enforcing it probably tweeted at some point in the past three months that “I hope the bad orange nazi doesn’t win”.

Not sure I get your point Dazh.

It’s fairly simple. What you’re calling a lefty I call a rightwing neoliberal capitalist. It’s about as far away from the traditional definition of lefty* as you can get. 🙂

*one who believes in socialist ideas aiming to empower working people, reduce and mitigate the power of capital, eliminate poverty and deliver social justice.

Yeah fair enough but as I say- the conversation would get unwieldy if I had to caveat every post with a massive definition.

the conversation would get unwieldy if I had to caveat every post with a massive definition

You could just use the phrase ‘neoliberal corporatist/capitalist’ instead of ‘lefty’ because that would be much more accurate.

You could share a taxi with a stranger with masks on and breath in each others air but couldn’t sit with a friend on a park bench.

No you couldn’t.

Taxis (of the Toyota Avensis variety) had to put up a plastic barrier between the front and back seats, like any vaguely modern black cab.

And travel was supposed to be only if really necessary, so there was a pressing reason for being in the back of the taxi.  Meeting you mate on a park bench would just have been unnecessary risk, even if it was a lower one.  The higher risk doesn’t do anything to negate the lower one. If anything it makes it a multiplier.  Now I’ve got covid from being in the taxi because the person before met their mate in the park and caught it off them, and now I’m going to give it to my mate in the park.  Cutting out the unnecessary transmission is what got the R number <1 because it made the remaining necessary interactions safer.

c.f. If I drive to a trail center the risky part of the day is doing a lap of the trail. It doesn’t somehow make me less likely to crash on the way home though.

You could share a taxi with a stranger with masks on and breath in each others air but couldn’t sit with a friend on a park bench.

Yeah, that’s horseshit for the very reasons above.

It’s OK. I’ve got you categorised now. Don’t let me detain you any further. You won’t be getting any further interaction from me on this thread if I can remember to enforce my ‘do not interact’ rule. In some ways a block user function would be handy here.

Plenty of people around here were travelling in taxis with nothing but a cursory barrier that was going to stop nothing? After a very few minutes you were getting a lung full of whatever the driver had.

There was never any evidence of outdoor transmission. Being outside should have been THE way to let life carry on as normally as possible.

Unmilited exercise should always have been allowed- people should have been encouraged to get as aerobically fit as possible!

Mask on to walk to your table, mask off to eat. I mean what a shower.

And that’s not even to speak to the matter of personal choice. I mean, obviously we had to make sure nurses had enough tic-tok time for propaganda purposes so I understand a bit of caution about overwhelming the NHS…

Anyone that supported a policy that let people miss their loved ones funerals deserves a special place in hell.

I managed to break both my legs early on so was in hospital as wards were being converted to Covid wards etc and quite frankly, most of the chatter from the doctors and nurses in there was about the lunacy of it all.
In hindsight- they were proved correct.

We should have gone full Sweden and let the bodies pile high (oh wait, I mean not had any worse an issue than anyone else).

I suppose you’re going to tell me that the changes to how ‘excess deaths’ have been counted since the Psy-op is just some logical statistical necessity lol

Love the full ‘intruder alert’ meltdown lol

socialist ideas aiming to empower working people, reduce and mitigate the power of capital, eliminate poverty and deliver social justice

Oi! @dazh That’s just centre left isn’t it? Fabian even. Definitely not extreme lefty.

I do agree that what @crosshair (interesting choice of name) is so angry about sounds more like Trumpy rightwingers (DEI aside – which done properly is 95% just showing decent respect to others)

I do favour globalism – but simply because pragmatism tells me that when companies are bigger than countries and happily working cross border, them opposing globalism hurts people more than companies (see Brexit for a case study).
On an emotional level, countries are great for picking sports teams, and some sort of nostalgic often made up culture – but they aren’t good for much more these days.
Multi-national blocks just make more sense these days – and since we left the EU we’ve been scratting around trying to find a new one to join.

Oh my. That’s one away from me shouting “House!”

liberal elite

House.

Jonathan Pie pretty much nails it again

David Lammy 2019 :

Deluded, dishonest, xenophobic, narcissistic, Donald Trump is no friend of Britain. He is not fit to hold public office, let alone worthy of our country’s highest honours and a banquet with the Queen. Theresa May is selling out the UK to a serial liar and a cheat.

https://x.com/DavidLammy/status/1120465288250712064

David Lammy 2024 :

Congratulations to @realDonaldTrump on your victory.The UK has no greater friend than the US, with the special relationship being cherished on both sides of the Atlantic for more than 80 years.

 We look forward to working with you and @JDVance  in the years ahead.

https://x.com/DavidLammy/status/1854077924686573734

I guess that the difference between now and 2019 is that now we have a Labour government so it is absolutely fine to work with the “deluded, dishonest, xenophobic, narcissistic, serial liar and cheat”

The current Labour government really strives to reach new levels of hypocrisy. Any reasonable person might have hoped that Donald Trump’s election as US president would have jolted a “centre-left” Labour UK government to re-evaluate its”Special Relationship” with the United States. Sadly that is probably an unrealistic hope.

Oi! @dazh That’s just centre left isn’t it? Fabian even. Definitely not extreme lefty.

No I was only using that description for ‘lefty’. I have some other views that I didn’t mention which apparently make me an extremist like abolishing national administrative borders and armies, replacing representative democracy with direct democracy and implementing an economic system which aims for 0% growth and zero net consumption of natural resources. Apparently they are a bit too radical for most people so I’ll stick with the original description. 😉

The current Labour government really strives to reach new levels of hypocrisy.

If David Lammy had any self respect he’d have resigned this morning on the grounds that his job was untenable given his past comments but as we all know he’s one of those politicians who will say whatever he thinks people want to hear. And we wonder why voters are tolerant of the lies and nonsense that comes out of the mouths of politicians?