Carol Thatcher

Is it me or does the solicitor who thinks the BBC acted within its rights to dismiss Carol Thatcher look like an ….. erm ……. Golliwog?

Not even going there

I’ll put the kettle on.

Off to the corner with you!!!!!!!!!

null

What’s the name of that book? “They **** You Up” I believe it’s called.

I thought he looked like he had been drawn by a young child…

Wonder where Carol Thatcher would have learned to be a racist?

You can still buy Goliwogs on the Isle of Wight.

I’m reading the Wishing Chair Trilogy to my 4 yo currently, and shifted somewhat uneasily in my seat earlier this week when Chinky’s friend (and BTW Chinky’s just the name of a Pixie, there is no insinuation he is oriental – I digress) – anyway Chinky’s friend Mr Blacky the Golliwog comes to visit.

With the innocence of 4yo’s, Mr Blacky was accepted as a name and a golliwog was accepted as ‘a sort of soft toy’ when I was interrogated.

But, o wise STW, how SHOULD I have handled those questions?

I wouldn’t have been reading a story with a golliwog in it to a child – but I condone the actions of the thought police I do

I confess Ive never thought of Maggie as rascist (and yes, Ill be her apologist for many things, but I wouldnt apologise for that)

got anything to illustrate that allegation grumm?

Well she was a supporter of the apartheid regime in S Africa and considered the ANC to be terrorists – that racist enough for ya?

Its interesting that some assume she is racist (and I have no opinion on her whatsoever, i am aware she won the channel 4 thing and of course aware who her mother is) however I will nail my colours to the mast.
Firstly i find it incredible that an individual felt the need to report the comment and I would be staggered if those I chose to surround myself with in what I understand was an informal and friendly environment acted in this way.
On a general note i am disapointed that recently we appear to be held hostage to those that would find “offence” at almost anything and the fact that they (?) feel others need to modify their behaviour to such an extend for those that seek to find offence. I am not for one moment condoning deliberately offending people nor do I condone racist behaviour or language, however our culture seems to be becoming obsessed with correctness and any minor innocent infringement is met with howls of outrage.
Their also seems a double standard, although this is a seperate point, that we can dismiss (in my opinion) slightly more offensive language from members of the royal family yet our public bodies feel the need to overreact on our behalf!

Just my thoughts!

I wouldnt confuse a political stance with racism. At the time Thatcher was being Reagan’s best buddy, which would neccesitate agreeing with the US foreign policy stance on engagment with the South African regime.

I still dont see her as racist on the scale of say, Powell, even though she was wrong about her position on SA.

Well she was a supporter of the apartheid regime in S Africa and considered the ANC to be terrorists – that racist enough for ya?

The ANC were terrorists. Amazing how a little reconciliation can erase some people’s memories.

Snigle
:o(

apartheid supporter said ANC were marxists (false) and terrorsits (true if you suported the regime and viewed it as legitimate and false if you think they were oppressed and freedom fighters which most people would except snigle and thatcher …..nice company you keep)
claimed britain was being “swamped by people of a different culture”
Views on Europe
Views on Islam and terrorist .. told of fin Lords for her comments iirc
Enough yet?

The ANC were terrorists.

One man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter.

Norman Tebbit was a long standing colleague/ally of hers – a man known for his tolerance and enlightenment. I’m not suggesting she was some kind of nazi – just your average nasty right-wing casual racist.

damned by association now is she?

On a general note i am disapointed that recently we appear to be held hostage to those that would find “offence” at almost anything

Who are the “those” to whom you refer surfer? It was in the green room of a BBC show for which she corresponds and is paid. I think that counts as a workplace and as such, the workplace (or nowhere else for that matter, but I’m not condoning “thought policing” really, I’m not!) is no place for that kind of language.

As for the Royal Family incidents, I don’t think a two week vilification in the enlightened media was exactly them being excused or it being “dismissed”.

Well when you associate with people like Pinochet, for example, I think being damned by association is probably fair. And surely she is responsible for employing outright bigots in her cabinet?

Who are the “those” to whom you refer surfer? It was in the green room of a BBC show for which she corresponds and is paid. I think that counts as a workplac

I suppose I am refering to those firstly that find this “language” offensive. We are after all talking about a word that is still acceptable in many places, It may or may not be objectionable but the extent to which we villify people for the use of language that was until quiote recently in common use is out of proportion IMO.
I am also criticising individuals who claimed they were offended by this and I suppose my only description of them is that they are unbelievebly “politically correct” and frankly quite wet!
I may be wrong but I understand she likened somebody to a Golliwog, isnt it a bit like likening me to a beanpole? alternatively I am from Liverpool should I recoil in feined “offence” when somebody calls me a scouser?

There are far worse things than a bit of name calling. Which, at the end of the day, is all that the majority of these so called ‘racist’ incidents are.

Snigle
:o\

I agree with surfer. Overreaction.

What about if she had used the word ‘****’ or ‘coon’, or ‘savage’?. Would that still be a storm in a teacup?

Besides, the main reason there seems to have been a fuss made is that she refused to apologise or admit that there was anything wrong with it.

My suspicion, having seen Carol Thatcher on the telly and being thoroughly unimpressed, is that this was the opportunity they were waiting for to ditch the silly woman.

And while the term “gollywog” has all sorts of racist connotations and I wouldn’t use it to or about a human being, I have no problem with the toys of that name that came from a less PC era. Should we not have Teddy Bears, as it is demeaning to wild bears to pretend that they are simple lovable creatures?

I doubt Mrs T was racist, btw – ignorant, no truck with PC, but not racist. And no doubt the people who view the ANC as freedom fighters hold the same view of the IRA/UDF, just for consistency?

I remember seeing G-OLLY on a plane at Filton.

It turned out to be the Robertsons Company Plane.

http://www.airport-data.com/aircraft/G-OLLY.html

What about if she had used the word ‘****’ or ‘coon’, or ‘savage’?. Would that still be a storm in a teacup?

No it would be more significant, but its testament to how far that we have come that I would struggle to even type the N word. It is a word with far reaching conortations that has now left what most reasonable people would agree is acceptable language.

Besides, the main reason there seems to have been a fuss made is that she refused to apologise or admit that there was anything wrong with it.

From what I can gather she did apologise but I understand was not genuflecting (sp) enough when she did it, part of my point is the fact that rather than letting a silly remark just hang in the air for (I assume) most of those in earshot to dismiss, somebody felt the overiding urge to report it! therefore we must have more money wasted on independent investigations and opportunities to show how the BBC is so painfully PC!

And while the term “gollywog” has all sorts of racist connotations and I wouldn’t use it to or about a human being, I have no problem with the toys of that name that came from a less PC era

So the fact that they’re a piss-taking caricature of those savages from the colonies is fine is it? Just because it was ok back then, does not make it ok now. You’ve said it yourself…it has “all sorts of racist connotations” – therefore, why wouldn’t you have any problems with the toys?

I may be wrong but I understand she likened somebody to a Golliwog, isnt it a bit like likening me to a beanpole?

No it’s not – I don’t think anybody finds the term “beanpole” offensive. I’m a bit of shortarse myself and somebody might use it to upset me but in fairness, I can get over that…if somebody with dwarfism was referred to as a “shortarse” I don’t think any of us would find that acceptable would we?

alternatively I am from Liverpool should I recoil in feined “offence” when somebody calls me a scouser?

I don’t recall anybody using the term “scouser” offensively. Is it any different from people from Newcastle being referred to as Geordies or those from Sunderland calling themsleves “Mackems”. Yes, those words can be used in a phrase to upset you…anyway, I digress into semantics here.

I am also criticising individuals who claimed they were offended by this and I suppose my only description of them is that they are unbelievebly “politically correct” and frankly quite wet!

I still don’t know who these people are? Is there a “political correctness” society or something? Who the bloody hell are these people policing our language then?

I’m against people who say ‘dont rat on someone’ or ‘we hate grass’s’ however her co-presenter is an idiot of the highest order. Does he have any tact himself? Couldnt he have said to her ‘look I object to that comment’ and have asked her to apologise for it? It was said off camera and in private to him. Crass idiot. So he lets it rip into the public domain, puts in a complaint without giving the person the opportunity. Sorry, Ive had people say ill-thought remarks to me and Ive sorted it quietly and they realised etc.

I mean a world in which I can not call a wog a wog, a **** a ****… whatever has the world come to

enlightmement … feel free to join us.
All are welcome except the ignorant and stupid but we will try and help you get there
Best wishes
PC society

What is it about being right wing and being racist?
Not for a moment am I trying to imply that being right wing makes you racist. But it does seem that the majority of racists prefer right wing politics.
So what is it about the politics they like?

what amuses me is that no-one has a copy of what she actually said, nor the conversation before/after she said it

I’ve suffered people calling me a german, box head, nazi stormtrooper, german tank commander, nazi salutes etc for years including in the workplace. Should I have complained on the basis of (incorrect) racial sterotyping based on the colour of my skin and hair?

btw, if someone accused me of acting like a scouser I’d be offended

Couldnt he have said to her ‘look I object to that comment’ and have asked her to apologise for it?

It sounds like he did, and she didn’t.

grumm ‘sounds like’? How do we know. Would be nice to have known the context etc. Why wasnt this dealt with internally? Doesnt the BBC have any real man-managers?

Someone said **** once in the office. Context was about race and someone got alittle excited. I objected and the person apologised. Case closed.

I think we can be too liberal and need to be alittle more robust in other areas than Policing thought too much.

I may be wrong but I understand she likened somebody to a Golliwog, isnt it a bit like likening me to a beanpole?

No it’s not – I don’t think anybody finds the term “beanpole” offensive. I’m a bit of shortarse myself and somebody might use it to upset me but in fairness, I can get over that…if somebody with dwarfism was referred to as a “shortarse” I don’t think any of us would find that acceptable would we?

To answer your points in reverse order then i agree the latter is offensive and unnaceptable.
You are now jumping to the conclusion that because you perceive that the term “beanpole” is non offensive to you that you can empathise with every other person that has or will be called “beanpole” and generalise that the term is therefore innofensive.
in reality offence in perceived not meant, if I use a pejorative term to describe somebody is the offence that I meant to offend or that offense was felt?
If its the former then Thatcher has explained that no offence was meant so is that the end of the matter? if its the latter then the offence can easily be judged by the method you have used above to judge that I should not be offended by being called a “beanpole” (I am not by the way)
Even more ridiculous in this example is that the person was “offended” by one persons likening of another person to a Golliwog! Effectively offense by proxy!

I don’t recall anybody using the term “scouser” offensively. Is it any different from people from Newcastle being referred to as Geordies or those from Sunderland calling themsleves “Mackems”. Yes, those words can be used in a phrase to upset you…anyway, I digress into semantics here.

You appear to want it both ways here. The word does not offend but as with the above words it is the connortations that they have. I work in London regualrly and the standing joke amongst my peers is that related to the theft of car stereos. Of course it is a joke which is riduclous given my position etc but it is only funny because there is widespread view that Liverpool people are often criminals. It is not the term scouser it is the negative conortations that can go with it.

her co-presenter is an idiot of the highest order

Why so is that then hora? Because he found her language despicable and reported her? If she’s working for and being paid by the BBC (otherwise you and me ultimately) then he was damn right to report her. She was given the chance to unreservedly apologise – though I don’t understand what a reserved apology would have been…”well, I’m sorry this time but I reserve the right to have another go next week”. She’s obviously part of the brigade who are obsessed with the encroaching enlightenment that is supposedly killing off our language – isn’t it terrible that we can’t use those words in public anymore…just terrible I tell you.

Stoner; do you get paid to be Thatcher’s apologist?

Maybe there’s a job for you…

Cameron apologises for Thatcher Apartheid policies.

Funny how now, even her own party are desperately trying to distance themselves from the vile, far-right-wing bigoted old bitch.

Even Hesselschwein thought her comments could encourage racism.

Thatcher remarked on a ‘World in Action’ television programme
shown in January 1978 that ‘people are really rather afraid that this country
might be swamped by people with a different culture’.

17 April On a trip to India, prime minister Margaret Thatcher defends the government’s Nationality Bill, which will further limit the rights of people from the black Commonwealth to come to Britain, and will make Britain the only country in the world where being born within its borders does not automatically confer nationality. She says immigration needs to be limited. The Times of India is unimpressed. Thatcher, it declares, ‘has done more harm to race relations in Britain than any other post-war leader there’.

As for her friendship with Pinochet…

Sorry but you just can’t claim that calling someone a ‘beanpole’ or a ‘scouser’ is in the same order of magnitude as using racial stereotypes born out of a history of 400 years of slavery and dehumanising black people.

She was given the chance to unreservedly apologise

ON AIR.
In the public stocks FFS. Why couldnt her co-presenter be a man?
Beleive me, I dont like the woman but I’m sick of our media. Scraping up anything and flooding their front pages with as much doom as possible. How much mileage can they ring out of this one?