Best way to secure exposed hinge screws on a stable door

Our outside storage is three old stone stables, each complete with a two-part stable door. Currently each of them has the bottom bit bolted shut on the inside and the top bit padlocked shut on the outside. You can’t pen the bottom bit without opening the top bit. I’m going to finally get around to improving the security on them a bit, not least as there’s been a spate of attempted burglaries in the nearish vicinity.

The doors themselves are good, solid things which won’t be gotten through without enough noise to wake us and/or the neighbours, so I’m going to stick a beefier bolt on the inside of the bottom bit and a better hasp and padlock on the top bits. Thing is, the hinges are this kind of things:

So, I can put a carriage bolt in to secure the strap onto the door, but the screw heads on the frame fittings are still exposed and an enterprising thief could, I suppose, remove them to get the doors open. What’s the best way to secure them?

Torx headed screws then hammer a ball bearing in. Probably more of a pain for you than any thief, though.

Can you make up a metal plate that slots over the fixed part and covers the screws. That plate is then held in place by the swinging part? Could even be wood for adequate levels of security

These…

I think they are called clutch screws.

Ask me to take the screws out, I’ll have the heads chewed up in no time.

Thinking ahead…. how are you going to get them off again when you need to. If you think the risk is unscrewing them – but the benefit to your future self is being able to unscrew them then strike a balance between your own conveince and someone else’s inconveniences – use 8 differnent screw / hex / bolt headed fittings maybe. Time is the factor – psychologically theres only some much time a thief will commit to gaining entry before there bottle goes,  Thieves are generally not that interested in undoing 8 screws of any sort though if the only tool they are carrying is a crow bar – precisely because of that time pressure

You could have the hinge pins welded to a longer strap and have more fixings along the length of the door frame maybe- as a guard agains both unscrewing and prying the door

Also they’re a lift-off hinge so a door could be levered upwards and off the hinges. In reality the weight is only ever really sitting on one hinge the other isnt bearing any weight unless installed with a stunning level of accuracy – the other hinge is giving support sideways. If you flip one over so the pin is facing downward it’ll still work fine as a door and prevents the door being jacked upwards.

You could also fit  straps /chains / cables between the inside of the door and the frame, behind the hinges so that even of the hinges are removed the door can’t swing open on that side

Cheers all.

I had considered the ball-bearing/screw option, but as has been said this makes it difficult for them to removed legitimately in the future. Saying that though, many of them haven’t been removed for many years, so the chance of them coming out cleanly is probably slim anyway.

Can you make up a metal plate that slots over the fixed part and covers the screws. That plate is then held in place by the swinging part? Could even be wood for adequate levels of security

Yeah, I thought about something like that. To be honest, I thought that such a hinge might exist as it seems quite an obvious thing, but I’ll be buggered if I can find one.

Also they’re a lift-off hinge so a door could be levered upwards and off the hinges.

I thought about this, but the way the door sits in the, er, door hole when it’s shut means it can’t be lifted off the hinge.

You could also fit straps /chains / cables between the inside of the door and the frame, behind the hinges so that even of the hinges are removed the door can’t swing open on that side

Ah, good idea…

https://www.screwfix.com/p/smith-locke-zinc-plated-hinge-bolts-2-pack/7948P?tc=YB1&ds_kid=92700048793290424&ds_rl=1249413&gclid=Cj0KCQiA_bieBhDSARIsADU4zLc2-Ku9qSp9uz9Tke5O-sOFzglUAHYkvGUhY4xvrMBl_0aszvp56CUaAnVqEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Fit these, and Ben if the hinge is undone the hinge side is still bolted to the frame.

Phillips/Posi screws. Countersunk a couple on each hinge with a drill bit to demolish the cross. They can be drilled out in future

you can get specific security screws that need a specific bit to remove

Or do you have access to the other side to bolt through the frame?

Or bit unsightly but something like a locking bar

Open the door and lift it off the hinges. You can then slot plates over the fixings. They will only be removable if the door is open, so secure but no problem to you.

Can you make up a metal plate that slots over the fixed part and covers the screws. That plate is then held in place by the swinging part? Could even be wood for adequate levels of security

Anything you attach to the door will crash into the frame if it overlaps the hinge plates when you open the door

a two-part stable door. Currently each of them has the bottom bit bolted shut

Dont forget to shoot the horse after the door is bolted.

Quickest and easiest would be 5 lobe screws and a bit to match. Looks like torx, isn’t. While its not going to deter everyone, you’d need to be a well organised thief to be carrying that one in the toolbox.

Looks like torx, isn’t

Use tx10 Torx screws – even if the theif has a full set of Torx bits the 1×10 one will be broken. Or it will be before they get to the 7th screw

Drill all the way through and use round head coach bolts? With the nut on the inside of course!

Drill all the way through and use round head coach bolts? With the nut on the inside of course!

This is the winner.

Thing is, the hinges are this kind of things:

Don’t use that kind of thing? Is there a different style of hinge that’s more suitable?

Weld all the screws to the fixings and grind flat. Use an angle grinder if you ever need to remove them and replace with new

Have bolts welded to the hinges with the nuts only accessible on the inside of the stable door.

Appreciate existing hinges might be galvanised which would create an issue for welding, but having a blacksmith fabricate some new hinges with welded bolts wouldn’t be too expensive.

I went with the security screws John Doe posted above, and coach bolt, for my shed door. Not planning to remove it, but then I don’t have horses inside my shed hoofing the door.

You only need two coach bolts on each hinge, one on each side. That then leaves the hinge as the weak link, which can be solved with chains on the inside. I used old bike chains as I already had them lying around.

Could do what Greybeard suggested, remove the door from the hinge, then drill a hole in the plate going on the wall that will be covered be the door part of the hinge, this will only be accessible when the door is open/off.

This would at least keep one fixing unable to be accessed by the thieving scum

Is there a different style of hinge that’s more suitable?

Honestly, and surprisingly, it seems not. You’d have thought one with a plate that covered the hinge plate when the door was closed would be a thing, but it seems not.

Weld all the screws to the fixings and grind flat. Use an angle grinder if you ever need to remove them and replace with new

Even simpler, enlarge the countersinks slightly, filler over the screws with epoxy and paint. Or even just epoxy the screws into the frame, any thief would strip them/their screwdriver before they came out.

how solid are the pins of the hinges?  Could they be hammered out up/down with a punch?
I’m in the “through-bolts fastened internally” camp but maybe also bolt on something to block easy access to the top/bottom of the pin ?

Long bolts with dome heads secured from inside, still defeated by battery angle grinder.
Security Torx screws would be a winner. Bit of investment in a set of security torx bits but they are rare enough i doubt most scallies go equipped with a set.

Drill all the way through and use round head coach bolts? With the nut on the inside of course!

This, it’s exactly what I did with the t-hinges when I built the shed.

What’s your roof made of?  Anything that looks like a lot of effort has gone in to securing then any self respecting scrote will be looking for the path of least resistance. Tin/plastic/onduline roofing will be through with a good kick. That or the padlock will be bolt-cropped. Guess how I know.

Stick a loud alarm in each one with a door sensor and leave the exterior looking like an old stone stable.

FWIW after we were done a few years ago I went with drilling the screw holes out on the hinge plates and running 150mm x M8 coach bolts through the hinge and frame then putting a spreader plate across the back before putting the nuts on to stop them being pulled through by a crowbar.

Only to come home from work a month later to find a hole kicked through the panelling next to the door. Path of least resistance….

We moved.

To all of those suggesting bolting through to the inside – I would expect* that there is probably no frame to bolt to, the hinge plates will be attached directly to the wall/stone and that may be too thick for bolts.

Our stable doors are all fixed directly to the wall.

Unfortunately if someone wants to get in all they have to do is either cut through the door or an angle grinder to the hinge and they’re in.

* An angry horse could make short work of a frame if it wanted to.

Security Torx screws would be a winner. Bit of investment in a set of security torx bits but they are rare enough i doubt most scallies go equipped with a set.

Thieves aren’t interested in undoing anything – they’re not there to strip, service and reassemble your door. ‘breaking’ and entering – the clue is In the name. They’ll break the lock, or the door, or the hinges, or break the hinges out of  the masonry surrounding it. The reason to replace the screws with bolts isnt that the screws can be undone  its that they can just be ripped out of the timber more easily than a through-fixing like a bolt.

Fill the screw heads with Sugru. Take a while, but you should be able to pick it out eventually if you ever need to in the future

Can you still a hole (or two) in the plate on the inside where it’s covered by the strap of the hinge when it’s closed, and put an extra screw(s) in there?

That’s how other security hinges I’ve seen work – by the hinges themselves blocking access in the closed position.

Looks a bit tight on these, but a thief probably wouldn’t suspect til they’d spent time removing the other 4. Could possibly be crowbarred off at that point, but would slow them down .

I would expect* that there is probably no frame to bolt to

There is a frame, to be fair.

What’s your roof made of?

It’s tiled.

I think I’ll go with the carriage bolt option, and maybe something on the inside to make it difficult/noisy to remove the door even if the hinges/locks have been cut. It’s never going to be perfect, but I can do a bit to put them off/slow them down and, well, the rest is what insurance is for…

https://securityforbikes.com/proddetail.php?prod=HS1

Something like this should do it – when locked the exposed screw heads are covered, but still simple enough to remove when unlocked.

bolt through and nylok nuts on the back
literally cannot undo the bolt without holding the nut

Locks are often a weak point on doors.. look how easy it can be to gain entry through snapping a lock (more applicable to uPVC doors though)
What lock is on the door?

What lock is on the door?

Bottom half of doors – bolt on the inside, so you can’t unlock it without opening the top half.

Top half – hasp, staple and padlock. Currently pretty basic, but will be getting better padlocks and a covered hasp/staple that will get in the way of boltcutters. This kinda thing:

I hope I can explain this properly. This is what I did and assumes that your hinges are fitted to a wooden frame. It’s a trick I learned over many years of IKEA assembly! You quite often have to join two pieces together using a pin with an intersecting bolt at 90 degrees which is hidden for cosmetic reasons but in the case is hidden for security reasons.

Replace one of the screws in the part of the hinge that is fixed to the frame (or more for added security) with a dome headed coach bolt (the longer the better within reason). You should be able to fit one through the screw hole, but if not drill it out a little.

If you are lucky you can drill right through to attach a nut to the other end (like alan1977 said) If not:

Drill the hole for the coach bolt a little longer than you need.

Then on the inside of the frame, drill a large hole at 90degrees to the coach bolt with a wide drill bit so that it intersects the coach bolt. You want this hole to be as far into the frame as possible.

Install a half moon washer and nut to secure the coach bolt using the wide hole for access and to turn the bolt. From the outside the thieves will encounter a dome headed coach bolt. The nut is only accessible from the inside but is relatively easy to do should you ever want to remove the hinge.

Are you potentially overthinking it?

I’m assuming the wooden door is sturdy and pretty thick. Drill a slightly undersized hole and use an impact driver to drive them in. They won’t come out with a screwdriver easily without wrecking the head, they’ll need an impact driver to get them out which will be loud. If you’re really worried use a hot glue gun to fill the heads, you’ll be able to pick it out but it’ll take longer than a thief can be bothered with?

If they don’t care about noise then a battery angle grinder will whip that hinge off