Alcohol and Cycling / Sports

Currently have a month of abstinence and as one who struggles with the freedom of enjoying myself with my only vice and all too frequent -albeit low volume – drinking, I found Dans honesty and science balance a perfect mix:

I hope it may be educational / useful to others

So, what’s the answer?

42

42%?

So, what’s the answer?

‘Believe it or not, it’s best to drink at breakfast’. Apparently.

Nothing new for me, it’s what I already knew about alcohol. It’s terrible stuff but I actually enjoy the taste, especially in food. Mmmmm brandy in Christmas pud.

Some more in depth details of alcohols effects on your sporting performance and recovery.

https://www2.hse.ie/living-well/alcohol/health/physical-health/sports-performance/

Edit: short version is, alcohol is a poison and there is no safe limit of consumption, so you should not drink any.

mostly general knowledge put across in a good way imo.

Nothing new but his honesty and approach we’re great to watch

Strangely for a poison,  those who drink small amounts live longer than abstainers.

“The j shaped curve shows that light and moderate drinkers of any form of alcohol live longer than those who abstain or drink heavily.”

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmsctech/1536/1536vw08.htm

‘Believe it or not, it’s best to drink at breakfast’. Apparently.

I’ll choose to believe that.

“The j shaped curve shows that light and moderate drinkers of any form of alcohol live longer than those who abstain or drink heavily.”

In most dietary things, I think moderation is the key. Having a glass of wine with your dinner is not going to do you serious harm. Having two bottles every night is a different thing. Same with chips, etc. Having McDonalds once a week won’t do you any harm if you eat a generally decent diet. Having it every day is going to be pretty unhealthy.

The other thing is that people who abstain may be doing so because they have health problems so you need to check that the analysis is controlled for that. Stretching is similar – people who stretch regularly apparently get more injuries, but it’s not clear what the causality is. They may be stretching because they have suffered an injury, so the stretching is the result of injury rather than the cause of it.

I found it quite odd that someone who did / does drank 4-6 beers a night 5 x a week.  Just wow.

I think moderation is the key

More than 40 years ago and as a child my Cockney Nan told me many things which have turned out to be pure wisdom.  One of these is “A little bit of what you fancy does you no harm”.   It’s funny how we go around the hamster wheel so often, to arrive at the same conclusions.

I think the idea that light drinking has beneficial health effects is a bit out of date. WHO say no safe level of consumption:

https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/04-01-2023-no-level-of-alcohol-consumption-is-safe-for-our-health

…and a recent study discredited the J-curve :

https://www.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/jul/25/moderate-drinking-not-better-for-health-than-abstaining-analysis-suggests

‘Believe it or not, it’s best to drink at breakfast’. Apparently.

I’ve been saying that for years.  I keep getting funny looks at work, though, which sometimes kills my buzz.

I think the idea that light drinking has beneficial health effects is a bit out of date. WHO say no safe level of consumption:

I think the benefits come from drink allowing you to socialise and even have a community, both of which have definitely been linked to longevity.

Arguably we should all learn how to just sit around together being sober rather than drinking poison but I’m not sure if I could actually be bothered meeting anyone to just hang out if drink wasn’t involved.

Ages ago I used to wire people up with fancy heart rate monitors for 3 days at a time. It measured it with hear rate variability.

One thing they measured was sleep quality.

One drink of anything alcoholic in an evening significantly affected sleep quality in the 100 or so people I wired up. Unless they were drinking tones on another evening, then it looked good in comparison to the one drink day but they still had poor recovery compared to non drinkers that night.

Sex never seemed to impact people’s heart rate much to several peoples disappointment when they had hand written notes and asked about very specific times in the evening.

Tldr- don’t drink any alcohol in an evening  and you will sleep better

“The j shaped curve shows that light and moderate drinkers of any form of alcohol live longer than those who abstain or drink heavily.”

Did you actually watch the video?

This was pretty much discounted and more to do with the fact those folk were from a healthier cohort in the first place.

It was only when I got a Garmin watch a couple of years ago that I really appreciated what alcohol did to my body (sleep, body battery, heart rate etc), but I’d already dropped well down from what I use to consume in my 20’s-40’s.  I still like a beer, but I’m now at less than a pint a day (average across the week).

Yeah but….

Eating bacon is dangerous, driving is dangerous, your cat sleeping on the stairs at night is dangerous, heaven forbid even riding a bike is dangerous.  All these things has a J curve; the less you do them the less likely you are to suffer any effects from them.  Yet, a lot of them have an enjoyment / mental health factor for most people as well.

You makes your choice etc…. But as above, moderation is key.

I don’t think anyone is suggesting not doing things you enjoy, just pointing out that the latest research suggests that alcohol doesn’t have a J-curve with respect to longevity, and there is no “safe limit”, which are things that have been previously claimed (and extensively promoted by the alcohol industry).

Very similar to you @Kryton – very moderate drinking (and crisps) were my only real vices.  But since covid, I do tend to have a single drink (either a cider or a 175ml wine) on most days.  Twice per year (Feb and Sept) I stopped for a month, but this year I did Jan to March 12th and right now I’m doing September to (min) December.  Truthfully, I don’t notice any difference to health. physique, etc, but I do miss it as my wind down.

This time I’m not using any alcohol substitutes as I think it actually makes it worse as it reminds you (due to it not tasking as good) that you’re missing something.

I stopped drinking for quite some time (I was drinking too much). I do have a couple pints a week now. But I enjoy the beer for its flavors, not several beers for its effects.

The one thing I really noticed was, people aggressively defend their drinking! People really do not like anyone questioning if drinking is a good idea, and get instantly defensive.

In my case, mates/colleagues would not let it go that I wasn’t drinking. Always questioning why, what’s wrong with me etc. At no point did I ask anyone else to not drink, or even verbally suggest it. But I think me not drinking caused them to internally question their habits, which externally came out negatively. After a couple of years it’s ok now, people don’t say much.

There’s some weird thing in society, if you’re not doing what everyone is doing, they get upset. For other example see cycling, not eating meat..

Like it or not, society relies on drinking for a lot of its socialising.  Maybe it’s the perceived threat to that socialisation and togetherness people react to, rather than just the fact people have chosen to stop drinking.

I’m definitely drinking a lot less since effectively becoming a social hermit.  Long term though I doubt it’s going to do me any good as the health benefits I’m getting from less drinking are probably counteracted by the lack of social contact and community.

Tldr- don’t drink any alcohol in an evening  and you will sleep better

I get 8+ hours of pretty good sleep, despite having a glass of wine in the evening with my supper, but then I do make sure my bedroom is cooler, I stop looking at screens at least an hour beforehand, and I have a routine, which I think at my moderate levels of alcohol intake is probs doing the heavy lifting.

Truthfully, I don’t notice any difference to health. physique, etc, but I do miss it as my wind down.

Same, I’ve cut out alcohol on a number of occasions and while I’m not a huge drinker, I didn’t notice any appreciable difference to my health or wellbeing other than missing a nice glass of wine in the evening.

Last week I had a day without alcohol….. First day in maybe two years.

I probably drink too much.

3-5 beers a day, minimum. It’s rare that a bottle of wine gets the cork stuffed back in its neck.

Yesterday I had three Weißbier in a bar, three glasses of wine at the restaurant and then finished off a bottle of wine by myself when we got home.

Going back to Germany tomorrow and given weed is now legal I’m going to hit that up and try not to drink so much…. Not easy given how much beer culture is ingrained in society there.

your cat sleeping on the stairs at night is dangerous

^^This a 1000%.

I do not fear the huge stash of single malts that I plan to reduce over the next few months.

If not the cat ,my demise will (most likely) be an accident that involves falling over and hitting my head against a sharp edge.

Probably, as I try to stand/hop while pulling a sock/pair of pants on.

and crisps

Then we have two things in common, crisps are my downfall yet hell will freeze over before I give up crisps.

This time I’m not using any alcohol substitutes as I think it actually makes it worse

+1

my garmin tells me alcohol is bad for recharging my body battery, one or two beers, bed at 10pm and recharge doesnt start till well after midnight on the graph..

but then again sporting activities depletes body battery so you cant win, not sure i’d be healthy if i got 9 hours sleep a night and sat watching TV all day

I rarely drink Monday to Thursday then have 2-3 pints of strong beer Friday Saturday and Sunday. I find that if I drink earlier in the evening so that there’s a couple of hours break before sleeping then my Garmin figures are much better. However it’s really hard to stop at one or two.

If I’m honest with myself I feel poisoned the day after an evening drinking more than 2 pints. But I always check again the following weekend just to be sure.

Three pints of 4% beer in the pub yesterday evening between about 17:45 and 19:45. Couple of 5% cans when I got home, one whilst cooking the other whilst eating. Should have left in there really but then thought it’d be a superb idea to have a nice little Glenlivet to round off the evening, as I’d ridden a lovely 30mile xc loop earlier in the afternoon in near perfect conditions. But one Glenlivet then turned into three or four Glenlivets.

I did not feel too special when I woke up this morning but 10min under a cold shower works wonders.

“The j shaped curve shows that light and moderate drinkers of any form of alcohol live longer than those who abstain or drink heavily.”

Correlation is not causation. But it is possible that people who practice moderation in one area of life may also practice moderation in others such as food intake, exercise taking, risk taking and so on. I like nice beer, can’t really taste wine any more, and today I am struggling to recall my last alcoholic drink. Not because I abstain, but because I don’t drink often and always in moderation. Some of my club will think three pints is needed for recovery. For me half a pint before I ride home is usually enough. Occasionally it will be TWO half pints!

 “A little bit of what you fancy does you no harm”

Tell that to the Catholic altar boys.

Or indeed Catholic altar boys.

If not the cat ,my demise will (most likely) be an accident that involves falling over and hitting my head against a sharp edge.

Don’t go up Helvellyn when you are pissed. Hth.

I struggle with the notion that someone is having 6-8 beers 5 nights a week and thinking that is in any way OK. The cost of it alone would have me in tears.

I do understand the “sociable” aspect though. I’m one of those who almost depends on alcohol.to.drop.my.guard a little and come out of my shell. Even a single beer helps. I’m less likely to feel so inclined if, for instance, it’s a cafe meet. If there are long term health benefits from socialising then an occasional drink.might still.be a positive.

I decided to cut down my intake after Christmas but there was no way I was doing dry anytimeoftheyear. Just passed 6 months without a drink.
Feel that I sleep better and don’t have that shabby feeling at all. Do drink 0.0 and alcohol free beers when out withe friends as soft drinks make me feel rubbish.

I don’t think anyone is suggesting not doing things you enjoy, just pointing out that the latest research suggests that alcohol doesn’t have a J-curve with respect to longevity, and there is no “safe limit”, which are things that have been previously claimed (and extensively promoted by the alcohol industry).

This research is heavily disputed    Background here

One drink of anything alcoholic in an evening significantly affected sleep quality in the 100 or so people I wired up. Unless they were drinking tones on another evening, then it looked good in comparison to the one drink day but they still had poor recovery compared to non drinkers that night.

Sex never seemed to impact people’s heart rate much to several peoples disappointment when they had hand written notes and asked about very specific times in the evening.

We can now all see that directly via our Fitbits and Apple Watches.

And I’m sure they could get the Fitbit to detect when I was making sweet lurve, if they wanted to. It seems to be able to correctly identify most other forms of exercise.

Rapid Hand Movement?

Only when I want to feel like someone else is doing it.

I had a bit of a reset with alcohol this year, having turned 40 last November and having already cut down my booze intake drastically since my 35th birthday. Been exclusively on the non-alcoholic beers this year, although haven’t really noticed any earth-shattering physical health or fitness improvements. I have had better sleep and seen some mental health improvements overall though.

Friday just gone though, had three 330ml beers, two medium glasses of wine, and a strong G&T spread out from 1pm-9pm at my sister-in-law’s wedding. That would have been a quiet Friday or Saturday night for me back in my 20s and early 30s, but I felt braindead / anxious all day Saturday and Sunday. I really don’t miss it.

…then thought it’d be a superb idea to have a nice little Glenlivet to round off the evening, as I’d ridden a lovely 30mile xc loop earlier in the afternoon in near perfect conditions.

I’m terrible for really wanting a drink after good exercise. Especially if socialising is thrown into the mix. It just feels right. A shame, because it definitely impacts the recovery.

This research is heavily disputed    Background here

I read criticism from two scientists in that story, and Christopher Snowden, the “head of lifestyle economics at the Institute of Economic Affairs” which is a famously shady right wing think tank. Snowden has admitted the IEA has received funding from the alcohol industry. The article also seems to be suggesting there is a conspiracy by the temperance movement to stop the consumption of alcohol!

Stockwell, who is responsible for the research criticising the J-curve has been quoted as saying he doesn’t think the science on this is settled and more research should be done, and has even admitted he feels there might be a protective effect; he just doesn’t think the research supports that at present. However, he’s not the only scientist proposing there is no safe amount of alcohol, and I assume WHO wouldn’t be taking that position unless they felt there was good evidence.

The article also seems to be suggesting there is a conspiracy by the temperance movement to stop the consumption of alcohol!

I’ve often suspected that myself.