a idea………re classified scammers

seem to be a lot of scams on classifieds of late.
i for one do not want it to affect my or other good folks selling.
so how about this simple solution.

if you are gonna buy off someone, then post on the main forum, is ton/whoever ok to buy from.
i for one do not mind anyone asking/posting about me.

what do you think…………?

I know when you are shafted you feel sick.
I like the premier only idea.
P.S. I’ve bought of Ton- headset (he changes stuff like the wind changes) and he has bought stuff of me(saddle). So the post on main forum idea is a slow – but effective way.

I shouldn’t post on these threads I know, but….I still think by far the easiest approach is for sellars to encourage buyers to post their opinion on one of the sellars previous for sale threads. Sellars can then put a link to that thread on future posts. Of course a bad experience can also then be posted on that thread as well. It works ok on retrobike I think.

That particular for sale thread then becomes the sellars feedback thread for all future sales.

What about newly joined posters?

As in a feedback thread, good idea, works on other forums, could be a new section of the forum, would make it easier to find a user you want to check the feedback of

With new users you just have to bite the bullet & use your own judgement & get a phone number/address

I have never had a bad experience. Is it really that common..?

Though I would like to see someones post count by their name.

There’s quite a list this week. Annoyingly – friend of the magazine JoB is playing games with people’s cash. If they can’t control their own mates – I wouldn’t hold out much hope for any help from ST.

It is bullploppy.

Moseymtb it forces new sellars to declare that they are, and this is a warning to buyers. Of course once they have sold something then that first post becomes their feedback thread.

Orangista; no need for a separate section. Just use one of the previous for sale threads.

This approach ca be purely voluntary as well, and could be explained by a sticky at the top of the section

I have built two 2nd hand mtb’s for my mates using parts bought off this forum. Never had a bad experience, infact I think almost every part I’ve bought has arrived within a couple of days of me sending the seller the money aswell.

I had a little go at posting a “thanks” on sale threads ayr or so ago (don’t buy much so maybe only 2-3 times). Sort of chickened out at the 1st pain-in-the-arse experience – wasn’t a major point but did piss me off. Reckon I’d have started a bit of a squabble and just didn’t seem worth it. (seller was & is a regular poster on all boards)

i like the sound of this. maybe stick a sticky up andy?

Andy – It’s a simple effective idea.
If it becomes a sticky – one could email old buyers for a recommendation, paste in thread.
“All arrived A1” hardly takes 10 seconds to do.

Why doesn’t the seller stick a reference up? A few people on here have met me, ridden with me and bought from me – not that I sell much – and vice versa.

i always tell people who buy from me to ask on the forum about my credentials.

Its down to the Big Wheels at STW Towers to implement as a sticky. There only needs to be one sticky explaining the approach. Individuals previous for sale threads that become their feeback would soon dissappear down the pages but would be accessable by the link at the bottom of future for sale threads.

I can understand if STW doesn’t go for the idea as it could lead to potential squabbles and might need additional moderating. But I suppose they could recruit additional moderators (from those people that stalk the classifides all the time 😆 and so are on there anyway).

I think its a good idea.
Majority of folk on here are top people, but something to weed out the chancers as they crop up, would be good.

I buy from Ton

he’s like a secondhand CRC 😉

I always check the sellers previous posts to get an idea of what they’re like. If they’ve tried to rip people off before then it would probably be evident in replies to their posts. It’s no guarantee but it helps I think. So far I’ve found sellers to be very helpful and true to their word.

big_n_daft – Member
I buy from Ton

he’s like a secondhand CRC

Aye so have I a few times and he is a top guy too 😀 . Maybe we should start a thread called “Whos bought from Ton”. Should make a couple of hundred posts in an hour 😉

Strangely, I’ve never bought anything from Ton, but I have sold to him.

If I buy anything now from the classified I never gift, I just add the fee to the total amount. I assume that way I have some comeback through Paypal?!

All it takes is to post on their classified thread

“Pain in the derrière” or “good guy”

anyone wanting to Buy merely looks at previous thread and sees “pain in the ass” or “good guy”

So thats the answer – just post on the thread the outcome of the deal

TJ if buyers post on one of the sellars threads only it keeps all the feedback in the same place. Heres an example from retrobike (Dan if reading this hope you dont mind the free good character reference 😀 ) HERE from someone who also sellsstuff here.

Retrobike use a separate forum but I dont think thats necessary. Anyway STW could always trial it for 6 months and see if it works.

People can’t even be bothered to tell you stuffs arrived these days so adding to the old fs thread will be beyond them. I just check sellers history and see past deals. If they are new I decide to take the chance or not, usually not. Being a premier member gives me a slight bit more confidence in them tho I’m not sure why

I think the references are a good idea but the thread may get a bit of a handfull after a while. I think that trading should be restricted to Premier members only. People are a lot likely to mess a buyer around if they know that their personal details are known to STW. Also the people that are premier members tend to have a little more emotional investment in this place and therefore are less likely to mess someone around.

Andy

Good point Firestarter. I always follow-up with “it’s arrived”. It’s only polite.

Andyhilton – I’m not premier, though I am a mag subscriber. Please can I be allowed to sell the odd thing; otherwise the garage might get out of hand.

Iain

think that trading should be restricted to Premier members only.

I disagree (but then I’m not a Premier member, so I’m going to). I’ve been knocking about on STW for years, prior to the xmas hack etc and I’m not sure that paying £££ necessarily equates to having any more / less emotional / non-financial investment in the forum and community.

I think the current system is ok, people just need to exercise common sense. In the main it works alright – there are a few bad instances but then the same is true of ebay / lfgss classifieds etc etc. If someone is determined to rip people off there is depressingly little you can do about it. When I buy / sell on here I certainly try and check that the person is known / isn’t just a ‘trader’ etc. There are forum plugins that give you the feedback system (along with PM’s etc), it’s up to STW if they want to implement but I’m not sure exactly how it differs from just spending a couple of minutes checking someone’s history to see how long they’ve been about / trying to get a handle on whether or not they’re likely to do a runner.

FWIW – I think STW having their personal details is largely irrelevant as it seems to me that in most instances seller’s who mess people around / scam have their details found out pretty quickly anyway. Everyone knew Lee Anderson’s name / workplace etc (I think that was what he was called) when he ripped people off, I’m not sure it’s much of a disincentive to be honest…

I’m a fan of the way Retrobike does it. A simple feedback forum where people say nice things about eachother and a “bad trader” thread – which has very little going on. The folks over there are great!
It’s pretty rare that I’ve had any trouble buying or selling, just the odd item which doesn’t come up to expectation, which I just put down to experience and don’t deal with the seller again. Never felt the need to grumble.

I too disagree that only paid up members should be able to trade – I wouldn’t ‘distrust’ someone just because they haven’t paid STW towers a sub….
I think a lot of people have ‘been around’ long enough for there to be a massive audit trail. those with less ‘presence’ – just ask about?

DrP

I think the references are a good idea but the thread may get a bit of a handfull after a while. I think that trading should be restricted to Premier members only.

Andyhilton, if you want to only buy from premier members then you’re free to make that choice at the moment, no need for a change- just don’t try to dictate to others. I’d prefer a broader base to the market, and am happy to rely on my own nous as to who to buy from.

Not sure why Ton keeps popping up saying ‘look at me, check out my feedback’ – we all know what he’s like to deal with- he’s either got a huge ego and can’t function without attention, or is planning a massive scam in the near future.

If someone is selling what you want at the price you want to pay then you take that as a start point and use common sense and care to do the transaction. There’s always a point at which you feel exposed, but who in their right mind would trade >£100 with someone they either hadn’t heard of or didn’t know of, or who they had failed to make any kind of connection with?

Of course the best scammers will be very convincing, I’m sure. Caveat emptor and all that.

Feedback on the FS post is a good idea but only if people use it.

vinneyh and igm – The premier members idea is just that,an idea.

If you’re happy with the way things are at the moment, then that’s fine. All this thread is doing is discussing improvements to the way that trading operates at the moment. There are a couple of people who are significant amounts out of pocket at the moment. My guess is that you guys haven’t lost out on a deal yet. If you had it may colour your opinion.

Is there another way that people who wish to use the classifieds can be protected a little more than they are currently?

There’s really no need to be having a pop at Ton though is there?

DrP – I wouldn’t necessarily distrust someone because they are not a premier member but it does help if they are. Now, wether there is another visual indicator that people could have by their name to signify that they are verified in someway? That couldn’t be a bad thing surely?

The only thing I’d change on the classifieds is I’d introduce a ‘3 strikes & you’re out’ policy

If something hasn’t sold after it’s been posted up 3 times, move on to ebay or something, I’m sick of seeing the same over-priced tat recycled every day for fortnight 🙂

Some kind of Feedback system is a very good idea.

I’ve bought and sold stuff for years in the Classifieds- and only lately had a VERY bad experience with a regular seller that ‘trades’ on STW.

I sent several emails to the STW Moderators about the fact that this seller was selling broken, damaged and defective goods on STW plus stuff that was older than claimed in his ads – yet passing it all off as in perfect working order. Effectively, he’s abusing STW with fraudulent goods/selling practices.

I got NO RESPONSE WHATSOEVER from the STW Mods – the impression I am left with is that they just don’t give a toss.

By the way, the seller was Freeform5Spot and after investigation, it transpires he has previous negative history selling on this Forum.

If you’re reading this Peter – you are welcome to contact me to finally settle the matter.

I have a list of people I wont deal with, either because they have previous or they’ve made it clear in other posts about how they deal with issues

Freeform5Spot is on my list purely because of previous complaints [rightly or wrongly] people have made against him

mmm. Freeform5spot is top of my list to not trade with. I remember the bustafajones problems.

Just a quick response to show that we do care…

The Classifieds is an interesting monster. One one hand, it’s a hugely busy trading area where thousands of people happily trade stuff from their sheds. Although we encourage people to make donations towards the server costs of running this all for free, far fewer than 1% do so. Considering that there is, on average, around £60,000 of goods on every page of the forum, it seems odd that we get around £30 a month in donations. It’s not surprising that our volunteer moderators can’t follow up every complaint about a potentially suspect dealer – and many of the ones that we have spent time looking into have turned out to be a slack seller who took a week or two to get to the post office.

Sites like ebay charge a fair whack for people to list products, for which you get a feedback system and some kind of buyer protection. Free classifieds, like Loot, or in your local paper charge the buyer (via buying the thing) or the seller (for listing it) and offer no come back at all.

To instigate some sort of feedback system is going to cost us a lot in programming time. Anyway, keep those suggestions coming. We are listening…

“sc-xc – Member
mmm. Freeform5spot is top of my list to not trade with. I remember the bustafajones problems.”

Ditto, where does he get all those bikes and parts from?

I’ve bought a couple of things from freeform5spot and never had a problem, in fact he has been very business like. I assume that is because selling bike parts is his business and considering he looks to have broken about 10 or 15 bikes in the last month for parts I’d say that conclusiion seems valid.