MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
It’s not economics, it’s a purpose built right wing fantasy.
Its odd because it can be used just as easily to justify a raise in taxes. The belief we are on the right hand side of the chart is what is a fantasy. As is the nice shape of the curve when in reality the shape of the curve is unknown.
Something terrible has just happened. I just read this Tweet and the true realisation of the state we're in became apparent.
James Cleverley is our Foreign Secretary
https://twitter.com/JamesCleverly/status/1572577325694472193?s=20&t=fJ28NxEhZbWjwSopReITrw
Then I remembered that Suella Braverman is Home Secretary and Kwasi Kwartang is Chancellor of the Exchequer too
And Liz Truss is PM
This isn't a cheese dream, is it? This is real, isn't it?
We really are truly ****ed!!
Imagine looking at the state of the country just now. The cost of living crisis, millions reliant on food banks and public services crumbling.
Imagine given all that a new Prime Minister coming in and saying "You know what will fix this? Lowering taxes and increasing banker's bonuses".
Stark
Raving
Mad
Imagine looking at the state of the country just now. The cost of living crisis, millions reliant on food banks and public services crumbling.
Imagine given all that a new Prime Minister coming in and saying “You know what will fix this? Lowering taxes and increasing banker’s bonuses”.
Imagine, given all of the above, that if an election were called tomorrow, they'd probably be re-elected.
Stark
Raving
Mad
the bankers bonus is a wierd one - it may be sensible (encourages bonus-lead renumeration packages - you can probably get 200% bonuses in sales?) but its just noise - it probably affects a few thousand people. Maybe its intended to distract from other things?
the bankers bonus is a wierd one
Its part of a wider lets get rid of those boring regulations which were put in place after 2008 (after those put in after the great depression were removed).
Problem with bonuses is it really gives an incentive to short term behaviour. To take the sales example it could lead someone to selling something at a discount or (as a code monkey my particular hate) something which doesnt actually exist yet and will be a nightmare to implement and given that I aint a cheap monkey never turn a profit.
It is questionable how well it works but the theory is if you restrict bonuses then it pushes it onto the salary instead which, in theory, makes the management think more since they dont want to overpay an underperformer so a short term blip in performance due to dodgy practices wont get a salary to match.
Maybe its intended to distract from other things?
Sends a signal that the Conservative Party is open for business, even if the country isn't.
The not-so-stealthy privatisation of the NHS is nearing its endgame, run it down until a critical mass of wealthier people are prepared to pay for their GP appointments etc. NHS Dentistry is the target destination, not some underfunded outlier.
BBC has a headline that claimed "Firms energy bills to be cut by half this winter".
Now that's some pro-Tory government spin on the reality.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/cljev4jz3pjt
However, they have changed the headline when you now click on the article.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62969427
I wonder if there has been some complaints?
Quick… do all the bonkers stuff asap…
https://twitter.com/journojane/status/1572669391921205248?s=21
Pensioners shivering on benefits around the country will be popping vintage champagne corks knowing that their supply of foie gras and mink coats can continue.
The Tories are merely acting out Tory ideology (they don't have anything else do they - they only understand Tax cuts.)
At least they have an ideology unlike our amazing party leader.
But the smart money is on what they offer the people that give them the majority - so you can take a position of look and laugh as the Truss makes some gains in the polls with just the right amount of handout - or you could give Labour some criticism for not offering a way out of right-wing solutions.
Mini budget should be fun - I will be giggling along at the Reeves response built around not spending and fiscal prudence - just what a nation needs on the cusp of contraction.
You can have scary sneaky u-turney Tory with Truss or old fashioned dim-wit put a jumper on Tory with Starmer.
What a time to be alive.
Reading around there's lots of suggestions that Truss and Kwarteng are still very very close. Doubtless lots of cheese and pork market discussions. Traditionally there has been a tension between the PM and chancellor, we are entering new territory.
see the pound is heading south again this morning against the dollar < 1.12, the markets aren't feeling Dizzy Lizzy's "confident" vibe. Can you imagine the vitriol in the right wing press if a Labour government had seen a 20%+ devaluation in the pound in the last year!
Can you imagine the vitriol in the right wing press if a Labour government had seen a 20%+ devaluation in the pound in the last year!
Not so much a ‘mini’ budget this morning, more a live brainstorming session by a collection of right wing thinktanks
Laugh my cock off at kwarteng - "unleash the power of the private sector." And here we are spending cash because the private sector is contracting.
Numpties.
Private sector is dying on its arse. It's nothing without the state.
The fiscal side of Conservatism is doomed. The fiscal side is the engine but the fuel is monetarism. And the BoE are making money expensive.
What a mess of logic.
see the pound is heading south again this morning against the dollar < 1.12, the markets aren’t feeling Dizzy Lizzy’s “confident” vibe. Can you imagine the vitriol in the right wing press if a Labour government had seen a 20%+ devaluation in the pound in the last year!
The pound has been tanking for a long time it's not simply because Dizzy Lizzy has done anything yet.
It's the Fed and their pointlessly aggressive interest lifting. Simply put our economy can't work along with that.
But yeah fair point Labour always get thsis sort of shit. But Brown made the BoE independent "to set rates" so what goes around comes around.
I ended up taking over the company I worked for during the pandemic. A difficult sector in that we were hit hardest first and were the very last people back to work.
Now I'm completely new to owning and running a business and this corporation tax non increase puzzles me slightly. The real challenge for us has been the fixed costs, business rates, what he hell are they all about, no relation to how well we are doing and what exactly do we get for them?
I'd rather see those go and the tax on our profits increase. Also it seems to me that if we have to pay more tax on profits that's more of an incentive to invest in more equipment and people to grow the business. So what am I missing? I'm now paid a small salary and make up the difference to what I used to earn with dividends. My guess is that this is why some tories want lower corporation tax so people like me can take bigger dividends instead of investing in growth. But hold on I thought this was all about growth.
Please help, I'm missing something, I must be.
Clueless Reeves has just cited the George Osborne Tory invention - the OBR as an 'institution.'
It's not an institution - it's a Tory mechanism designed to make austerity justified.
Let that be known.
She's an absolute disgrace.
So much repressive rubbish coming out of this debate. Twitching about bonds - they're 3 times over subscribed!
The OBR data is useful for getting an understanding of budget announcements. Without it we're at the mercy of self appointed internet experts when trying to understand the (likely) impact of the changes being made.
In the company and tax thing - my take is the investment comes out before the tax bill anyway. So the more you invest the less tax you pay. It's the other way around.
You don't need the tax incentive.
Like lots of tax tools they have it the wrong way around.
The OBR data is useful for getting an understanding of budget announcements. Without it we’re at the mercy of self appointed internet experts when trying to understand the impact of the changes being made
Their forecasting history is terrible.
It exists to keep Tory austerity on the ready and now Labour austerity it seems.
It was invented by Osborne for that reason.
It sees government spending as limited by lack of tax revenue. Number one problem.
my take is the investment comes out before the tax bill anyway. So the more you invest the less tax you pay.
Exactly, so a higher tax rate is an encouragement for us to invest in the business. Keeping it is an encouragement for us to reduce investment and with the profits pay ourselves dividends
Pound still falling.
1.10
https://twitter.com/david_milliken/status/1573261238636879874
The markets are delivering their verdict on our likely future as an economic basket-case.
Given Kwarteng's weird performance at Her Maj's funeral, one can only assume that the drafting of this 'strategy' was equally influenced by recreational substances.
1.10
That is truly shocking.
I'm really not sure that today's #BudgetForTheRich is going to help her
https://twitter.com/ElectionMapsUK/status/1573325565909766145?t=riIG4kU9DAoEJGMHSBCEkQ&s=19
That is truly shocking.
1.09
Once the unpublished OBR numbers have been worked out fully elsewhere, it’ll go lower.
Like a phoenix raising from the ashes I await his second coming.
I reckon Truss has longer than until Christmas but I do think that she is on shaky ground. She was never hugely popular with the Parliamentary Tory Party and got lucky with the elimination process to end up as one of the last two to be put before the membership.
If her "I don't give a **** if it's unpopular I will do what I want" backfires then I would expect a few more letters, especially from Tories in marginal seats.
I guess it depends how badly the polls become for the Tories, and how Labour react. An effective sustained attack on Truss from Labour will accelerate her demise in the polls, but it will also likely result in the Tories rallying around her more.
If Labour do little and don't exploit what are clearly wide open goals then given time Truss might ride this out. In politics people forget things very quickly. However Truss will still remain under threat from her parliamentary colleagues though if the stated aims of her economic gamble fails to deliver. IMHO
Can't wait to find out how you spend 2grand in the Norwich City shop
https://twitter.com/BBCPolitics/status/1573324442733879298?t=Ff1YzuBfkf6OEDjqWHzQuw&s=19
We'll know the gig is up when the stuff about her affairs gets on the front pages
Interesting to see if they U-turn on this budget
1.086
Continuity Johnson
https://twitter.com/Gabriel_Pogrund/status/1573738991685353473?t=uyvJb-K9fnz_qv06n7j_Rw&s=19
Well, they clearly aren’t working for us, there’s something honest in some of their payment structures reflecting that I suppose.
[ dark humour, I don’t mean it, it stinks ]
It's now a day and night choice at the next election, if "we" vote Tory again then we frankly deserve what we get.
I'm now hoping for an early election to limit the damage to the country but I think it's unlikely.
There is no chance of an early general election, not now. They will be hoping that the mini budget will result in a (mini) boom sometime before January 2025 which is the latest they can hold out for.
IMO the opposition parties should have exploited Kwarteng's claim that we had entered a "new era" by agreeing with him and pointing out that it meant a new mandate from the voters was needed as the old mandate was no longer valid.
Obviously the Tories wouldn't have agreed but it firstly would have undermine their legitimacy and secondly just the talk of a general election would have made voters impatient to pass their verdict on Kwarteng's reverse Robin Hood agenda.
He would have been hoisted by his own petard for calling it was a new era requiring a new economic direction. As it would hard to deny that it needed a new mandate.
Can't seem to link up Cold War Steve. Conspiracy I tell yas.
Anyone else noted Truss is going to loosen immigration rules to import workers for low paid temp jobs. Quite an admission that brexit has effed things up. What she is suggesting however I am sure will not work as its still is unnatractive to most people
Anyone else noted Truss is going to loosen immigration rules to import workers for low paid temp jobs
The Sunday times story? Seems a plan designed to annoy just about everyone.
Any reciprocal arrangement sort for British workers…?
Any reciprocal arrangement sort for British workers…?
I very much doubt it.
Now the never-going-to-happen-anyway US trade agreement was kicked into the bushes just about the last reasonably sized market will be India and they will almost 100% certainly want easier access to the UKs jobs market and we are so desperate (and incompetent) we'll just agree anything to get the headline. So whilst the Tories will triumphantly announce the deal allows us to export Yorkshire Puddings now to India they won't mention the large numbers of johnny foreigners being allowed to come across to work in the UK.
We have literally hollowed out the UK and given it to every country that wants a piece without any advantage for us just so we can 'protect our borders'.
Oh wait, we're likely to get more people coming in.
[And just to clarify, thats sarcasm not me being a frothing brexiteer]
Truss is now called Daggers in the City. Dagenham. Three stops past Barking.
All the racists who voted for Brexit are going to go apeshit when all these brown people start arriving
This wasn’t the Brexit I voted for etc, etc…
That Kwarteng fella has very done well for himself since those Halifax ads.
Loads of clever Indians, would be great to recruit without going through all the tier 2 visa madness.
Agreed. Not read what the government is proposing, but a quick India trade deal is likely to include a greater number of visas being made available, and some of the hoop jumping lessoned… but it won’t do away with visas, and will still favour the big outsourcing and consultancy businesses more than SMEs and the people wanting to try a life here.
What a farrago, the brexiteers will be bleating to bring back the eastern Europeans. Will Labour become anti-immigration and the Mail pro? Truss already seems to be pissing off a lot of different people.
That Kwarteng fella has very done well for himself since those Halifax ads
I had wondered what had happened to Howard...
This shit show can get much much worse...
Seen this before courtesy of Thatcher, its the same abandonment of working people wih a thin veneer of government gruel ...
I have no answers,my kids all adult's are politically unaware (my fault raised them middle class) 3 of 4 have mortgages and i have told them to be prepared.. i can help them but many won't have that kind of support.
I am angry, very ****ing angry.
I think Howard may be the voice in his head. Whoever it is, they're clearly very amusing.
When you watch his antics at the Queens funeral then his insane budget becomes a bit more explicable
When Suella Braverman is staring at you with a look on a face that says WTF? then you really are in trouble
https://twitter.com/nazirafzal/status/1572560150715826177?s=20&t=wzOwXTqNHqgpMdI_qba4Rg
Is he gurning there? Been at the Gary Abletts?
mp for tooting?
Gary Ablett? As in the Aussie Rules goat?
Tooting would be my guess
Liverpool and Everton defender
Can there be insider dealing at government level? Some guy on youtube (okay, not completely watertight investigative journalism) was strongly hinting some rich friends of the government shorted on the pound literally just before the mini budget announcement and made a fortune.
Don't know if thats believeable or not, but I wouldn't be surprised with this lot.
Two years left to get as much money for themselves/their mates until the gravy train all collapses at the next election?
Rees mogg did i read
Can there be insider dealing at government level? Some guy on youtube (okay, not completely watertight investigative journalism) was strongly hinting some rich friends of the government shorted on the pound literally just before the mini budget announcement and made a fortune
Would anyone be remotely surprised?
They don’t even bother to cover up their corruption any more, it’s so blatant
What’s terrifying is how cheap it is to buy off this lot. They’ll literally happily bankrupt the country for the sake of a 50 grand bung
Two years left to get as much money for themselves/their mates until the gravy train all collapses at the next election
Brexit and everything since has been bought, funded and gift wrapped by and for Disaster Capitalists
They’ll walk away as billionaires from the smoking wreckage of the UK economy, laughing their tits off that they got a lot of shit-thick racists to actually vote for this bollocks with just some old bullshit written down the side of a bus
Yep, this.
And it cost them the change they found down the back of the sofa.
Liz Truss and Kwasi Kwartang literally cost them ten benson, a bottle of cider and a packet of monster munch
These Brexit ‘patriots’ happily sold us all down the river for that
Useful idiots who are still too dense to realise they’ve been played.
With ‘former remainer’ Truss it’s the most extreme case of Stockholm syndrome I’ve ever seen
Tory MPs are thin if non existent on Twitter currently... no flag waving or cheering on of Kwasi...
Krazi Kwarteng
Kamikwasi
Anyone else noted Truss is going to loosen immigration rules to import workers for low paid temp jobs. Quite an admission that brexit has effed things up. What she is suggesting however I am sure will not work as its still is unnatractive to most people
Well... maybe not as unattractive as you'd think. Sometimes taking something away has opens people's eyes to how valuable it actually is - Since the referendum attitudes to immigration have steadily become more favourable
Has Graham Brady had any letters in yet 😉?
The low point for the Tories under Johnson was about 30% in the polls
I'm betting Truss can hit 25
If she fires Kwertang & tries to blame him, that'd get the letters incoming
Seen this before courtesy of Thatcher, its the same abandonment of working people wih a thin veneer of government gruel …
This is way beyond anything Thatcher did and what she did had reasoning behind it (even if you violently disagree with the reasoning), this is wholesale destruction for some backhanders. In Thatcher's case we were known as the sick man of Europe for good reason, the last 5 years have seen us move from being in a relatively good position to totally screwed due to government policy and Truss is doubling down on it.
I’m betting Truss can hit 25
We haven't seen half of this yet, people are still going to be a lot worse off than they think this winter, all the caps and tax cuts are either avoiding things that were coming or reversing stuff recently enacted. People will still be way worse off than they were this time last year. Fixed rate deals for both energy and mortgages are still in play from before this all blew up, people have gone to paying energy bills monthly thinking they are being clever, if we have a cold winter a lot of people are going to be very exposed to a lot more cost and people think it's bad now. Couple that with Ukraine producing about 50% of the grain they normally do and food prices will continue to rise.
Yep,its not like they have set the caps to get the bills down to the original last year values and the winter is always more expensive.
Well....
https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1574339701493858306?t=v5tdGXydXU-t5XQv48rCjg&s=19
Tory MPs not being that quiet. My previous comment a while back that she might not last til christmas looks pessimistic!
https://twitter.com/BestForBritain/status/1574325285700472833?s=20&t=CAFM3-mPrUj7wOQXMOuOvQ
Agree. Waiting for the rumours to start circulating.
I still think the chance of another leader taking them in to the next election are high. How relevant is it though? The Tories have failed again and again, for years... we need them out of office, not shuffling around the jobs.
we need them out of office, not shuffling around the jobs.
Just been discussing recent events amongst my (working class) Tory voting, office workmates.
Apparently, we need to give Liz Truss time, she's only been in power for a few days and she's already had the death of the queen to deal with.
I just despair 🙁
She's certainly hit the ground from day one, as she foretold. I guess the markets will decide whether she breaks through that and starts tunnelling.