Are we doomed?

Secular Stagnation

Not looking too rosy…

I couldn’t care less as realistically there’s nothing you or I can do about it so there’s zero point in worrying or stressing over it.

I can’t see how ever more people can all produce ever more stuff, while corporations find better ways to streamline production.

I can’t see how ever more people can all produce ever more stuff, while corporations find better ways to streamline production.

This, we will need to start thinking about nationally guaranteed incomes when AI and highly efficient production methods really starts to kick in.

Anyway, the answer is, bring in people from 3rd world nations to economic centers that need more workers and at the same time try to stabilize birth rates so we don’t get spikes.

There’s no point in damaging our own economy and wasting the livelihoods of people in poverty, when those people can go to work and benefit themselves and us.

We’ve gone so far down that road now that it would take a world war to change it.

And you claim the economist is a doomsayer.

When our biggest problem is too much of everything I fail to see Growth as a good thing.

edit; quote of the day…”so by accident it’s been agreed that the west buys shit and the east makes shit”

When our biggest problem is too much of everything I fail to see Growth as a good thing.

+1

Especially in a world of limited resources, a growing population (primarily in developing countries) and increasing energy demands.

I can’t think who said it, but it’s a great quote: “Perpetual growth is the strategy of a cancer cell, not of a responsible human.”

we need to expand off planet quickly before society collapses.

Especially in a world of limited resources, a growing population (primarily in developing countries) and increasing energy demands.

I can’t think who said it, but it’s a great quote: “Perpetual growth is the strategy of a cancer cell, not of a responsible human.”

Whether we can achieve what Drexler is always banging on about is another debate, I love to think that he might be onto something though.

Are we doomed? Yeah, of course we are!

According to my neighbours (who live on a Sun, Daily Mail, Express and Telegraph news diet), if the terrorists don’t get ya, Ebola will, and if that doesn’t some Eastern European migrant workers will, and if that doesn’t the European Court of Human Rights will!!

I just tell ’em not to worry, ‘cos we’re all screwed when the climate changes and makes human life unsustainable on Earth 😆

tbh I think this austerity thing may do us some good. We’ve got kindof materialistic over the last generation and a readjustment is healthy IMO

However, that graph isn’t very jolly and I suspect there’s a lot of Western expectations about continued wealth going to be rather dashed over the next few years as people realise what we have now re flat/falling living standards is the new normal for the 99%.

If all the clever people who’ve been staring at the problem since 2008 haven’t been able to solve it yet, it kindof suggests they’re not sure what the solution is, no?…

Not doomed, but condemned to a period of low growth ahead.

My (adult) life saw growth based on the mirage of debt ie leverage. By borrowing (massively) people bought forward consumption and delayed payment. This is an unsustainable game and the tipping point was the financial crisis. We are now entering the reverse process of deleveraging, Consumption will be delayed this time while payment will be bought forward. The pace and structure of this payment process will determine how long this subdued period will be.

It will be longer in Europe that in the RoW due largely to the folly that is a fixed exchange rate.

The key question is whether politicians will be able to survive the contempt, distrust and unpopularity that will accompany this process. And will Europe adjust properly to what it was/needs to be or will it break up under the weight of popular process?

The current generation are paying for the follies of our generation. They will not thank us for it……

The key question is whether politicians will be able to survive the contempt, distrust and unpopularity that will accompany this process.

And that’s why no clever minds have been able to fix it yet. It will be a massively unpopular thing to do in the short term. The question is, do we have time to fix it gradually?

There is no alternative other than the odd bit of tinkering. It has to take time. Politicians will continue to be dishonest and pretend that have solutions but they do not.

Even the Tories can’t face real austerity!!

Even the Tories can’t face real austerity!!

Gideon’s manipulation of the housing market this time last year is increasingly looking like an admission of defeat in being able to tackle the real problem of where to find growth. Even then it looks to have gone pear-shaped as London prices are falling already…

Being born in the early 70’s my experience has been that the Tories have a track record of being stronger on the economy than Labour so this really isn’t a good sign… more of a lost generation than a lost decade IMO

Being born in the early 70’s my experience has been that the Tories have a track record of being stronger on the economy than Labour

you don’t remember Black Wednesday and 3m unemployed? or you think Labour did even worse?

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/sep/13/black-wednesday-20-years-pound-erm

It’s not party political anymore they all use the same advisors. The conclusion when you think through the problem is democracy doesnt work cos Turkeys won’t vote for Christmas.

I can’t even begin to parse that.

cough..try that.

If we can get the turkeys to vote then labour might still have a chance.

tbh I think this austerity thing may do us some good. We’ve got kindof materialistic over the last generation and a readjustment is healthy IMO

Hmm Im not really seeing the austerity thing – In Brisitol/Bath they’re still just throwing money around on unwanted Bus routes and overpriced err pavement improvements…

Can we not give us all a bigger mission, a la “start trek” or “contact” where we all drive to something completely new? Like interstellar travel or somesuch?

Vote Russel Brand!

🙂

tbh I think this austerity thing may do us some good.

Shame it only affects the poor. The rich haven’t seen any austerity yet!

wider inequality means more income in the hands of the rich, who save more than the poor and central banks have also accumulated vast reserves

That there is the problem, we don’t live in a capitalist trickle down system, we live in a hoardist system were the rich accumulate more and more and more.

That’ll reach breaking point eventually, it’s unsustainable.

teamhurtmore – Member
There is no alternative other than the odd bit of tinkering.

😆