Anyone challenged an Ombudsman decision?

I realise that they are effectively the last port of call but would be interested to hear of anyone that has strongly disagreed with a decision and taken it further.

Thanks. 🙂

I used the insurance ombudsman when the insurance company took the piss and wrote off my van with a scratch.
They gave some great advice.
I re-contacted my insurer and told them what the ombudsman said and my van suddenly became repairable.

Quite a stressful time until that point.
Last resort but worth a chat to them if your banging your head against a wall.

Thanks for the reply. I disagree with the Financial Ombudsman’s decision.

Part of the T&C’s with the estate agent one is it’s final and you can’t take another route once you go that way.

How badly wrong do you think they are, does anyone agree with you?

I believe that your complaint is dealt with by someone who works on behalf of the ombudsman. If you disagree and wish to appeal the decision then you can but you need to go in guns blazing with as much information as you can possibly get to support your case. It will be be sent direct to the Ombudsman who will review the case once more and make the final decision, which you cannot appeal.

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/faq/businesses/answers/decide_cases_a2.html

Interested to see a link to those t&cs Mike. Wasn’t aware you could sign away your rights to using the UK court system.

I’ve seen Financial Ombudsmen decisions changed in regards an Insurance claim after complaint. You have nothing to loose.

I have regular (work, and no not PPI) dealings with the FOS. If the decision has been made by an acutal Ombusdman not just an Adudicator you can push for it to be reviewed by the lead Ombudsman. If it’s just a Adudicator decision you can ask for it to go to a Ombudsman for their decision.

Following that your only redress would be to take the business to Court.

I have to say though, most Ombudsman services tend to be weighted in the public’s favour rather than the big bad business.

Thanks for the replies. The decision has been made by an Adjudicator.

My other alternative is the Information Commissioner’s Office as it’s a data protection breach by an insurance company who’s been in the news recently.

I got reamed by Barclays mortgages and took it to the ombudsman and lost in an irrational decision but decided life was too short to pursue. So instead I just have all my valuable (i.e. income generating) products with other financial providers and keep all my expensive (premier current accounts with overdrafts x 3) at Barclays for the next 40 years.

Financially the decision probably would cost me something like 30k over the next 15yrs. But the costs to pursue in terms of time, fees and cold hard cash, with no guarantee of success would far outweigh that figure.

On the flipside RBS lost out to the tune of about £5k because their mortgage monkey cant read contracts as well as wot I can.

The t&c should be published on their sites. I think the deal is it’s a final resort rather than a step on the along the way.

cinnamon_girl – Member

Thanks for the replies. The decision has been made by an Adjudicator.

My other alternative is the Information Commissioner’s Office as it’s a data protection breach by an insurance company who’s been in the news recently.

Push it to an Ombudsman as you have nothing to lose doing this. But unless the Adudicator has missunderstood your complaint or you have further information to add to your case, in my experience the decision is likely to stand.

As for the ICO, the will only look at what’s required under law where as the Ombudsman should be looking at a wider brief than that.

Stoner – yes, I understand your ‘life’s too short’ comment but I find it hard to accept blatant lying and no accountability as well as a matter of principle.

Even when the media picked up on it, A*iv* blamed somebody else yet they failed to ensure that customers’ data was protected and secure. My complaint went up to CEO level.

The thing is, how many coincidences are allowed?

Have you suffered a financial loss as a result of the data protection failing ?
If not probably time to walk away. Your ” matter of principal ” comment throws up a warning signal. When your very passionate about a wrong its easy to get carried away. Step back and gave a re think maybe ?

Up to 5 calls per day, 6 days per week for 13 months thanks to a data protection breach. I don’t take kindly to my personal details being sold for money.

Yes, I am passionate about injustice and, yes, it would be easier to walk away.

Who caused the data breach (in Law)? The Insurer or someone else that the Insurer legitimately shared it with?

If it’s the second you are on a hiding to nowhere with the Insurer.

Other than the cost of the calls, did you suffer a loss from the breach itself?

If you’ve not fully pursued the matter with the Information Commissioner, or Ofcom for that matter (aiming at the nuisance callers), then I’d suggest that might be the most fruitful approach.

This may help:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-26291075

I suspect they did nothing about any of my complaints that were made before the above came to light. Calls started the day after I reported to them that a car had crashed into mine in a minor accident.

I’ve suffered no financial loss but they will not say whether my financial information was compromised. All my personal details have been sold, ie name, address, date of birth, car registration, previous accidents and mobile number.

Prior to the introduction of LAPSO there were no restrictions on the sale of your personal details as far as i’m aware, although possibly avoided if you tick a little box somewhere on whatever form you completed.

Edit I suspect you are being called by representatives from Quindell who operate as a provider of all services (legal, car repair etc) to a large proportion of the insurance industry. They get round the LAPSO regs by keeping your personal data in house albeit I would assume their separate divisions will call you. No sale of personal data, no reg breach and, assuming your details were not in with those that were stolen, you won’t have a leg to stand on. Do the calls vaguely relate to your accident?

In response to the OP, last week I had a letter from “the ombudsman” that ruled against me in my initial complaint, having read the response thy have completely missunderstood what i was trying to say. I went back to “the ombudsman” and today i have received a letter saying that my complaint will now be passed to an Ombudsman, signed xyz “adjudicator”.

Looks like they get an adjudicator to reject your claim, and only pass it to the Ombudsman if you complain again as a tactic to get rid of people who dont realise the person they have been dealing with for 2 months is not actually an ombudsman. I certainly didnt.

Todays letter says the decision of the ombudsman will be final, and if I agree with it i can lock it in by signing something, or if i disagree and want to go to court then dont sign any agreement

steve-g – that’s interesting and useful, thanks. Sounds as though it will be worth another go with the Ombudsman so shall do that.

Gotama – LAPSO? Never heard of Quindell so how come they’ve got away with doing that?

When I was a claims manager a policyholder managed to convince the ombudsman that their front door was a “fixed domestic heating or drainage installation” as it had a drainage groove around it which was allowing normal rain to leak in and ruin their hall carpet.

It was worth paying the claim just to see the reaction of my counterparts at other companies 😆

cinnamon girl – DPA is my specialist subject at the moment. Email me privately if you think I could help, in terms of what counts as a DPA breach. helen@innerleithenmtbracing.com

LASPO rather than lapso, new rules around referral fees and what not.

I had a complaint declined by the Financial Ombudsman and the final resolution letter was signed by an “investigation officer” Is this the same as an Ombudaman or an adjudicator?

I have tried to challenge Ombudsman’s decision (different Ombudsman) but decided to give up after a while. Not worth my time as they were stressing me up with their bureaucratic prowess.

Essentially, nobody in this world is totally unbiased to be frank. We may see things our way but others may not.

My “career” was totally destroyed by some zombie maggots but after a long period of appeals, adjudication etc my last port of call was Ombudsman. The decision went their way and they won.

I could go to the court to challenge all the decisions but life is too short and I am not getting younger so I ended my challenge there. I have been working part-time for many years since I got back to UK, but unfortunately my career totally kaput after this episode (no chance of full time now). Now I just have start everything from zero again by setting up my own business.

They are all in the same click to some extend so don’t waste too much of your time trying to challenge them. Check the case worker background as some of them are just working for the same people.

The outcome of the Ombudsman is usually against you with very high probability. Not 50/50 or whatever. It’s more like 98% against you from the start.

Ombudsman etc they are all zombie maggots that will one day decompose like all the organic stuff and they deserve all they get.

👿

You need an Ombudsman Ombudsman.

allthepies – Member

You need an Ombudsman Ombudsman.

You need powerful bureaucrats.

With the financial ombudsman you always get two bites of the cherry, adjudication via an adjudicator and then an appeal to an ombudsman. If you go on to accept the ombudsman’s decision you (and the other party) are legally bound by it and have no further referral rights. If you do not agree then you retain the right to pursue the company you are in dispute with via the courts.

Given that it was a breach of Data Protection I am not entirely sure what redress the ombudsman could offer as their remit when I have dealt with them previously is to deal with financial losses.

Just to be clear, I have never asked for financial recompense. I’ve been offered a sum and have ignored it. All I want is for this to be investigated thoroughly and the guilty to be dealt with appropriately. If that means a criminal record then good as it will send out a message.

chewkw – I understand exactly what you’re saying and, yes, it would be easier to give up. Someone has to rattle cages and unfortunately this is not the only cage I’m rattling right now. 😐

I’m sorry to hear that your career has been hugely affected. It must be hard for you to move on knowing that you’ve been unfairly treated. Can relate to your cynicism but I’m getting more of an argumentative cah the older I get. 🙂

All very noble CG but do you know legally if there is something to answer, was there an explanation with the initial response. As a few have said there may be a number of legal loop holes that they are working through which makes what they did legal even if it wasn’t moral or in the spirit of the legislation.

The outcome of the Ombudsman is usually against you with very high probability. Not 50/50 or whatever. It’s more like 98% against you from the start.

Ombudsman etc they are all zombie maggots that will one day decompose like all the organic stuff and they deserve all they get.
Got anything to back that up?
Playing devils advocate most individuals loosing cases believe the system is against them, especially if you have invested a lot of time, energy and anger into the process. Legal decisions get made on legal points, not whats right or wrong, sometimes people have done everything right no matter how cynical they were doing it.

We put a lot into our case against a clearly negligent letting agent, it was found in our favour but they could only award damages pro rata as he was only part of the scheme for part of the time the complaint covered and they wound the business up by the time we got a response. The reply basically said they were completely wrong but there is not much more we could do about it.

The outcome of the Ombudsman is usually against you with very high probability. Not 50/50 or whatever. It’s more like 98% against you from the start.
Ombudsman etc they are all zombie maggots that will one day decompose like all the organic stuff and they deserve all they get.

The FOS find approximately 60% of the time in favour of the complainant.

michaelbowden – Member

The FOS find approximately 60% of the time in favour of the complainant.

Not in my case as I was forewarned (another independent adviser) that the chances of success against the bureaucrats were very slim from the start. Not saying which Ombudsman but I gave up after I got negative outcome.

My complaint was against some sneaky bureaucrats who embedded information into one report rather than separating them into two reports (rules say two reports but they twisted their words).

My job required me to work closely with those reports in order to get my result but after many attempts requesting for two separate reports which I did not get, I thought following the guideline of one report was sufficient to get my job done which evidently did not. I got penalised severely for failing to comply with information in the report, which I only got one but not two, hence my appeal. The Ombudsman decided that one report was sufficient for me to complete my work and the bureaucrats was right. My argument was that the bureaucrats did not follow the rule of providing me two reports but that argument was dismissed. In a way I was working with a “moving goal post”.

I was very stressed for a while but the moment I gave up challenging my stress level subsided.

Now it’s a matter of down but not out by starting new.

😡

Just thought I would update this …

Financial Ombudsman has not upheld my complaint. Funny that. 😐

I worked closely with the FOS for a time and met some of their senior staff to discuss how they work and what information they take on board.

Their stance was that if a company could prove they were in the right they would not uphold the complaint.

Any flaws at all or gaps in the file that would have been relevant to the case and they find in favour of the consumer.

In essence they are not pro-consumer as such but because so many financial organisations have such piss poor record keeping they find in favour of the consumer quite often (they publish a report each year which goes into great detail about how many complaints they have had, how many they uphold etc).

Your issue though C_G is that they only rule on cases where there has been actual and pure financial loss e.g you house was broken into and the insurance company has not paid out or your were badly advised about a mortgage and are paying more than you need to or should be paying.

They very very rarely (I have seen on case in hundreds I have reviewed and even that was only £50 or so) where they award any punitive amounts for stress, inconvenience, upset etc so unless the sale of your data has cost you actual money they are not the people to adjudicate on the matter.

Further, whilst technically you could pursue the matter through the courts the FOS’s test is whether a firm has been ‘fair and reasonable’ whereas a court will decide on points on law only. More often than not the FOS will be more lenient toward the consumer than a court would.

Really, the sale of personal data is not a matter for the FOS in any event and should be raised with the Information Commissioner and / or pursued through the small claims court if you are seeking damages beyond that of indemnifying a purely financial position.

Again, the FCA may be interested in any firm that has breached DPA obligations but they would take a stand against the firm and are not in a position to award compensation to an individual on an a single case like this.

If the case is well known then it is likely the FCA will have or are investigating it in any event.

With all this in mind I can unfortunately only echo what others have said. Register your phone number on the TPA, go ex-directory and move on.

Thanks for your reply Danny. I’ve spoken to the ICO several times, the first they were very interested but the second they weren’t. Just to be clear I’m not looking for financial recompense, what I want is for companies to be accountable and to stop lying through their back teeth.

For all these so-called Regulators, transparency and openness we seem to actually be worse off. I regularly report silent calls, nuisance calls and spam texts to Ofcom etc.

One thing I would like to know is whether Av*va have cameras in their call centre. It is entirely feasible for an operator to have written down my name and mobile number rather than going into the system where they claim there is no record of it being accessed.

At the end of the day one has to stand up and be counted. There is absolutely no reason why anyone should put up with lies and shoddy business practice.

Thanks again. 🙂