Wow – classifieds inflation??!

If I see something on Classifieds that I’ve seen elsewhere or new for a “reasonable amount less” (highly subjective I know) then there’s a good chance I’ll post a link to the cheaper item.

Ridiculous e.g. someone is selling an XT cassette for £50 and I know CRC are doing the same one for £40. I’d post a link to CRC in the FS ad.

Why?

Because it’s what I’d like to know if I wasn’t that familiar with all the various outlets / prices etc.

Occassionally it’s p1ssed a seller off. Bad luck. You want to ask a “high” price on a “classifieds” section that is largely based on goodwill then tough t1tty if someone else comes along and shows goodwill, whether it’s to you or the seller.

There’s an element of subjectivity in it and just because I see something I think is over-priced I’d rarely say anything. But if I know someone can buy new, cheaper elsewhere then I think it’s fair game.

For a coupel of quid though who cares?

How old is the “new” bike”
I edited my typos KingTut – think you can still get it though but my error

about 18 months Junkyard.

I think most of the buyers here are suitable plummed and cheeky enough to post what they want to buy the item for.

Turns it into a bit of an auction but the seller can then choose to sell for the true value or keep it in the garage for an eternity.

(not a bad option considering what my ‘retro’ scrap has been selling for recently.)

TJ reckons [ and I tend to agree] 33% what you paid – then 10% per year + adjustement for wear or tear [up or down]. Given unused in your case 40% ish may be fair. I would want more in your position though as it is bascially unused …the issue is whether you can convince the buyer of this.
I got 50 % of an orange pro New price when bought in similiarly good condition at 2 yr old

£300 when new, you might get £200? Depends on the brand and components, a bargain basement sale bike for £300 form one of the big brands will still be worth more than a £300 supermarket special road bike.

My wife paid £300+ for it, used it for 2 hours on a turbo trainer and hasn’t touched it since.

What should I ask for it?

Not more than £300

Hora:

Every so often if I spot a new poster selling something expensive I’ll pop on ‘ah, would love this but I’d need to collect and you are too far’ as a sort of sanity-check/hint for others.

vinnyeh:

How’s that work then?

I am also intrigued.

I am also intrigued.

STW rule # 10589: Never bother being intrigued by anything Hora posts.

😉

Would you just walk by if you saw someone getting their purse picked from their bag? After all, for every thief, there is a sucker who didn’t secure their purse / bike / house.

Southern Yesi

I recognise that the phrasing of my questions is problematic for some. As a result I have started using a little sign to indicate that it is a question. It looks like this ‘?’ Does this make things easier for you?

Not more than £300

dang, there goes Christmas…

Charlie – do you stand around bike shop tills saying ‘CRC do those for £10 less’ to their customers?

If not, why not?

On a related classifides note, if you sold something with part of it being worn out beyond use without an uneconomic service, but with a replacement for that part.

Would you post on the buyers FS thread where he’s now selling the worn out part ‘in good mechanical condition’ ?

has the replacement part been fitted?

No, because people who buy from bike shops tend to be be buying more than just the product, they are also buying convenience. However, if someone i knew, or afriend of someone i knew or someone in my ‘community’ were going to buy an apollo full sus from a store for £450. I would advise them to look elsewhere first.

Now,

1)if someone in your ‘community was going to buy an apollo full sus from a store for £450, would you give them any advice?

2) If you saw someone getting their pocket/bag picked in town on a saturday afternoon would you just stand back and let it happen?

1) it’s not quite the same as the person selling is also in ‘my community’ with the classifieds so who’s side am I on? I’;ve seen a number of people have the ‘it’s cheaper at CRC’ thing done to them and, often, I think they’re people who probably bought the item at their lbs at ‘full whack’ and are selling on at 60% of what they paid for it, not trying to rip people off…

2) Again – we’re not talking about theft. If I saw someone get their purse out and hand over money to someone in exchange for goods I wouldn’t intervene, no.

Let me try #1 again
1)if someone in your ‘community was going to buy an apollo full sus from a local store for £450, would you give them any advice?

2) Just answer ‘yes’ or ‘no’ then tell me why.

Charlie – I’m stopping now.

I stated my view in my first post.

There is no theft going on here, only grown ups making purchasing decisions that you might find questionable.

Let’s make this clear..

The ad as posted in the classifieds is posted by the seller. As a potential buyer you can reply and enter into a dialogue with the seller. If you are not one of of those two then you must not add to the post. If you do we will remove your post and send you a warning.

The relationship is between the seller and the potential buyer. There is no room in the classifieds system for any other parties to express their opinions.

If you simply must say something then contact the potential buyer directly but do NOT use the classified to express your own opinion on the price of something. It’s not a behaviour we want to encourage, no matter how well intentioned, as it’s far too arbitrary and easily open to abuse and potential bickering. A large proportion of the complaints we receive are from people who are upset about others adding ‘unnecessary’ comments on classified ads. If we sanction the posting of comments from so called ‘arbiters of fairness’ then the level of complaints and incidences of bickering and general bad-will will undoubtedly increase.

And how many Apollo bikes have you seen sold on here for £450? I know you were making an exaggeration to get your point over.

What get’s my goat with this argument is the only concern is for the buyer and none at all for the seller. Have you ever considered that they might be selling some very good kit for a reason other than changing to a new frame/wheel/jockey wheel to get in this months trend?

And to be honest how many novices would find the STW classifieds tobuy kit rather than go to their LBS or an internet retailer. Whenever I have been new to something, photography, HiFi etc I tend to go for new from a retailer for safety. The only “novices” using STW classifieds I would suspect would be doing so with guidance of someone in the know.

wwaswas
just answer the questions. I answered yours.

Mark,
The rules are clear. No one is questioning your right to impose them, merely the consequences of them, and their moral standing.

charlie – I’m pretty sure we all would in an extreme case like that

However, have you seen any classifieds asking prices that might equate to selling an apollo for £450 ?
If so, you SHOULD intervene IMO

If you saw 2 blokes who you knew to chat to in your local pub and one was selling the other a used item at about 120% of it’s going rate, would you jump in ?

I don’t see any issues with the morals at all Charlie and I find myself rather insulted that you should imply that there is. The idea that you are proposing smacks of some overseeing committee that gets to decide on the ‘fairness’ of a particular deal based solely on the reading of text in an ad. Classifieds have been run on the principle of caveat emptor for a very good reason and that is to sustain their simplicity and viability. The very worst solution to any perceived problem is to allow a group or individuals who remain mostly anonymous to be able to post on any classified ad if they deem that something about the deal is not to their liking.

Ok then, what happens if something is priced ridiculously cheap?
Same rules apply, surely?

No, because people who buy from bike shops tend to be be buying more than just the product, they are also buying convenience.

Depends if their LBS is Halfrauds. If it is, would you mind standing at the door and letting everyone know not to go in? Just to make sure it’s fair and all like….

Mark,
The rules are clear. No one is questioning your right to impose them, merely the consequences of them, and their moral standing.

There’s a door, feel free to use it…

(Or start your own highly successful MTB forum, and moderate your own classified section with as many morals as you choose)

charlie – I’m pretty sure we all would in an extreme case like that

I’m not so sure

However, have you seen any classifieds asking prices that might equate to selling an apollo for £450 ?
If so, you SHOULD intervene IMO

Apparently not directly, such are the rules of the forum, which i respect and will abide by.

If you saw 2 blokes who you knew to chat to in your local pub and one was selling the other a used item at about 120% of it’s going rate, would you jump in ?

Depends very much on the context. If i was friendly with them, I would more than likely point out that it was an unfair price and one was taking the advantage of the other. I’m sure that in the spirit of goodwill one owuld not like to cause ill-feeling such as when the buyer discovered the going rate. Nevertheless, if the buyer, then said how much easier it was buying in the pub and how he knew he could trust the sale, such that it was worht the 120% then i’d let it go.

yes of course I would. Leaving this thread as STW towers has stated the rules for here and as it is there site they can do as they please [ said in a nice way not stropping off with my ball].

You need to appreciate the vehicle of a public forum and how it is used and perceived by the users.

By intervening and posting on the actual ad itself is a different kettle of fish and does NOT equate as you may think to taking the seller to one side in the pub and having a quiet word with him about the wisdom of the deal.

It has much more in common with standing on the bar and shouting your ‘opinion’ not only at the seller and the buyer but also to everyone else in the pub. A forum is very public medium and everything you say on it has a much wider audience than the people you may think you are addressing. In that respect you can’t just wade into a thread, no matter how well intentioned, and come to the aid of an individual without thinking first about the wider audience that will also be ‘watching and listening’ and the implications for the seller or the buyer.

There’s a door, feel free to use it…

Yeah buddy, love it or leave it, huh!

I don’t see any issues with the morals at all Charlie and I find myself rather insulted that you should imply that there is.

Clearly there is an issue, that’s why we are having a discussion. But there is nothing wrong with discussing is there?

The idea that you are proposing smacks of some overseeing committee that gets to decide on the ‘fairness’ of a particular deal based solely on the reading of text in an ad.

Not really and overseeing committee, just general concensus

Classifieds have been run on the principle of caveat emptor for a very good reason and that is to sustain their simplicity and viability.

I can see the valuse of that argument, but that does not make it perfect. I’m merely pointing out and discussing some of the problems that arise as a result of that system

The very worst solution to any perceived problem is to allow a group or individuals who remain mostly anonymous to be able to post on any classified ad if they deem that something about the deal is not to their liking.

Yes, that would be problematic, but I imagine if it happened at gorup level, then there would perhaps be some general agreement that the ad was problematic and if at individual level then there would be a number of posts which counter that opinion. Of course, I can see that extended discussions would tend to obscure the original ad. But I imagine some alternative to the two solutions you propose might exist.

Charlie – I’d let it drop now mate as your making a bit of a tit of yourself.

only answering the questions

has the replacement part been fitted?

Yup, he’s fitted the replacement part and is selling the old one.

They are Mark/Chipps’ forums and rules and, yes, we don’t have to be here

… but part of the reason I come is that there’s a sense of being a small part of some sort of community and wouldn’t want to lose that, nor feel that the classifieds are not somehow also part of it. I think that’s pretty generalised, evidenced by the moaning about sellers/buyers who aren’t forum regulars.

While we’re on, the classifieds rule that says ads must state a price seems a bit odd to me and I don’t really see any benefit to it. If it is worth having, shouldn’t there be a corresponding rule that “offers” are also banned and it’s asking price or nothing ?

Having no price on an add is an irritation to most users of the classifieds. That’s why the rule is there.

OK, Mark. Have you ever asked sellers whether it’s irritating to have somebody low-ball their price ?

I’d guess anticipation of that probably leads to unrealistically high initial asking prices, which is why this thread is here at all !

thisisnotaspoon – maybe an email to the seller?

ChurlishMungo – sounds like you’ve been well and truly told so I’ll not tempt you with anymore questions.

Junkyard – Member

TJ reckons [ and I tend to agree] 33% what you paid – then 10% per year + adjustement for wear or tear [up or down]. Given unused in your case 40% ish may be fair. I would want more in your position though as it is bascially unused …the issue is whether you can convince the buyer of this.

Not my idea – merely quoting what I thought was the consensus – and it was 50% of value – 10% per year +/- 10% for condition?

I thought this was a generally accepted way of establishing a fair prioce for a second hand bike bit

As for the woarning posts – the Mods have made thisr view clear but you still have 2 routes if you feel strongly. Email the buyer or report the post.

Posting “its too expensive” is just going to lead to public bickering