Why is Intentionally hitting a person with a car not attempted murder?

Surely its attempted murder? I mean its not an accident is it? He is guilty of “dangerous driving, drink driving and assault by beating” but surely these are not reflecting the full gravity of intentionally driving a car at someone at speed?

Dangerous driving suggests his driving falls below the expected level of a careful and competent driver but this was an intentional use of a car as a weapon. FFS

this case?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-dorset-46520000/bournemouth-nightclub-crash-cctv-shows-car-hitting-doorman

because intent wasn’t proven is my guess ‘the car just lurched to the left, honest’

Although never put anything involving a car in front of a jury should be the CPS’s motto – acquittal is almost a certainty.

Need to be able to prove they were trying to kill rather than just hurt – if the prosecution don’t think they can prove the intent they need to go for the safer bet to ensure something sticks

Seems the Jury wasn’t persuaded beyond reasonable doubt that he didn’t just lose control because he was drunk.

Need to be able to prove they were trying to kill rather than just hurt

That doesn’t follow if you shoot or stab someone with the intention of wounding you would be very lucky to get away with manslaughter. Its the familiarity of the weapon being used which is the difference (and you can’t get the kids to school on a handgun (although sometimes one would be useful for getting them out of the back door in the morning))

Murder is pre-meditated. If someone stabs someone they had to have the knife there for a reason – to stab – and therefore it could be reasoned they wanted to murder. As a car is not a weapon as such it could be argued (in the case above) it wasn’t a pre-meditated event.

Murder does not have to be premeditated at all, and people have been charged with murder for driving into crowds.

Not clear from the video that that driving was intentional, I don’t know if recklessness through drink would count, or if so what the test for that would be.

That’s completely wrong johndoh

Everyone knows cars go out of control regularly….

Nothing to do with the nut holding the steering wheel apparently.

This comes up all the time, for attempted murder you need to show the accused was trying to kill. Which he probably wasn’t IMO. He was however trying to seriously hurt and deserves a more serious conviction than he’s got.

for attempted murder you need to show the accused was trying to kill

In Scots law I think recklessness as to whether the victim might die or not is also sufficient.

This happened after he was thrown out of the club and punched a bouncer, so plenty of motive, not sure how he was also cleared of attempting to cause GBH. Must be the ‘sorry I was drunk’ defence.

Cheers Neil, whole different slant on it there.

With the back ground info I’m amazed he was cleared of attempted GBH. He quite deliberately drove at the bouncer !! With the speed involved it would be hard to prove attempted murder, but he clearly ment to hurt the bloke seriously.

Police intentionally hitting thieves on scooters is not considered attempted murder.

Well nor was hitting miners round the head with a truncheon.

Need to keep those stats looking good. Can’t do that if we go about calling things what they are. You can stick a knife into someone’s chest and get away with it not being murder.

Fair enough cynic-al looks like scots law is slightly different there. Though it wasn’t in Scotland 🙂

If the police hit a scooter rider with a car is that attempted murder?

I’m not sure, but, the doorman is probably not a violent criminal that makes a living by demands with threats, using a stolen vehicle, possibly also obtained by threats of violence, who will attempt anything possible to avoid capture.

Also the police drivers are generally trained to a better standard and, probably, don’t use these tactics when drunk.

As a car is not a weapon as such it could be argued (in the case above) it wasn’t a pre-meditated event.

A knife isnt necessarily a weapon either. I would have also thought going and getting a car and driving it at someone has a certain amount of premeditation to it. If he was just exiting the carpark maybe not but that doesnt seem to be the case. I assume he had some good lawyers to confuse things.

If the police hit a scooter rider with a car is that attempted murder?

I suspect it would depend. If they just hammer into them at top speed then yes. If its a specially trained driver nudging the bike then no.

If the police hit a scooter rider with a car is that attempted murder?

No, they follow a procedure to try to minimise injury / risk and so the intent is the exact opposite. Plus the Police have powers that the general public don’t, for example they ran criminals in cars on occasion and have done for decades, obviously a car is much safer thing to driven into than a scooter but it’s not without risk.

For it to be attempted murder your have to prove that he wanted to kill, not just hit or hurt, the bouncer. If you can’t prove, beyond all reasonable doubt, that he was making a genuine attempt to kill the bouncer then you can’t expect a jury to convict him of it.

Ok I get that you can’t prove that the intent was death but dangerous driving seems a bit understated. Is there nothing in the scale between that’s provable?

He was cleared of attempted murder and attempted GBH by trial. The evidence was strong enough for the charges to be made but the jury decided not provable.