There's no smoke without…..Farah?

Well basically its says that 2000 and 2001 where baron years for 10000m running and that may be for a number of reasons.
What is significant is the fact that Haile and the Kenyan/Ethiopian rivalry had really pushed the boundaries of what was achievable up to 98 and it was not until Bekele came along in 2004 that it was forced down further. I dont think there is any controversy surrounding him?

From 1993 to 2005, a time period that we know drugs were rife in the peleton and unfortunately become the norm for professional cycling, the 10,000 metre running record was reduced by a massive 50 seconds.

If you believe that distance running was somehow different to cycling in that period you are believing in fairytales.

As I said that 50 seconds was down to 2 men. Neither of who as far as I am aware have been accused (in any credible way) to doping.
So unlike all of the athletes involved in drug taking in the peleton that (even after significant delays) have largely all been found out. Why after over 22 years has passed has nothing of significance come out about those 2?

Bear in mind the 10000m record for non African runners remained relatively static between 89 and 2010. If drugs were the reason for this massive progression then why was this the case? Also blood doping was well known about during the 70’s and 80’s. Also Ron Clarke reduced the WR by 39 seconds single handedly in 2 years! Maybe he was doping as well?

What explains the 6 year period where no one broke it then?
Or the 6 year period where only one person broke it [ twice]
Bad drugs?

FWIW Haile Gebrselassie got circa 10 seconds faster every 2-3 years ish..or 0.08 seconds per lap faster
Not outlandish gains and just because people in one sport cheated its not actually proof people in another sport cheated
TBH why have I had to write that ?

DO you have any proof any of the athletes cheated?
Perhaps they just got lucky as everyone was looking at the 100 m

Come on Noones going to win a your sport is shittier than my sport between athletics and cycling. We both are catching some, still embarrassed by others, have some people doing it the right way and we all hope we will end up clean one day but are under no illusions. Footballs the freak show we should both be pointing at.

just because people in one sport cheated its not actually proof people in another sport cheated

It stretches believability to beyond breaking point to think that cycling was somehow isolated in its moral vacuum.

America has been quite successful in taking down some of their biggest name athletes, quite a few never even failed a drugs test. Because they decided to follow the doubt, go after them and find the evidence.

The IAAF didn’t do it, or the Olympics, it took their home country to do something few if any other country would ever contemplate.

What is significant is the fact that Haile and the Kenyan/Ethiopian rivalry had really pushed the boundaries of what was achievable

Kenyan middle distance running has been suspect for years…

John Fahey, president of the World Anti-Doping Agency (Wada), said there was a “cloud hanging over them”. He said: “For some time, we have been very concerned about the accusations of doping there,” going on to describe Kenya as “a location of choice for dopers”.

There is no Kenyan anti-doping agency and just one laboratory for that purpose in the whole of the continent – based in South Africa.

There is no Kenyan anti-doping agency and just one laboratory for that purpose in the whole of the continent – based in South Africa.

I think its fair to assume they are tested when they race abroad.

I think its fair to assume they are tested when they race abroad.

I think it’s been long established that current drugs testing won’t catch anyone with half a brain.

EPO’s “glow” time is 2-3 days and it time of effectiveness in the body is 15-20days.

And it isn’t as if using PED’s while training has any impact is it? They only work when racing 🙄

It stretches believability to beyond breaking point to think that cycling was somehow isolated in its moral vacuum

Well we know this is true because , for example, they caught lots of 100 m runners. However, to repeat myself here, just because athletes in one sport cheated its not actually proof athletes in another sport cheated

Did we get an explanation for 6 year failure to break it?

Did we get an explanation for 6 year failure to break it?

Do you need an explanation that a record set with the aid of PED’s can be as hard or as easy to break as one set without. You seem to think that question proves your point, it proves nothing other than a record stood for 6 years.

just because athletes in one sport cheated its not actually proof athletes in another sport cheated

I didn’t say it was proof, I said it is unbelievable. Two sports with similar demands that would benefit from the same PED’s, both see incredible advances, one is known to be dirty, you would have to really really want to put your fingers in your ears and shout lalala to believe the other was clean.

I think it’s been long established that current drugs testing won’t catch anyone with half a brain.

Then the fact that the African continent only has one agency matters not one bit.

it time of effectiveness in the body is 15-20days.

Yes and it can be traced in post event testing.

You seem to think that question proves your point

I think it weakens your point
I dont need proof as you cannot prove your point you can only use extreme hyperbole and weak caricature to suggest that anyone who may have different view you from you is going “lala”

TBH if hyperbole one arguments you would be doing great as it is we just have you have two independent events and you think they prove something.

FWIW if you look at the record you will seep leaps in the time of a similar magnitude in similar time frames. I bet this jut makes you think they going always cheated rather than reconsider and of course anyone who disagrees is going “lala”

Amusing and a pointless debate as its not me going lalala and ignoring the absence of proof.

Just like Marion Jones (I can see that becoming a meme for me again), and depending on your definition of testing positive, just like LA.

Meanwhile, doper Gatlin just keeps on winning and posting excellent times.

Twice caught and still cheating

Amazing how he has posted faster times as he ages and as he runs clean
Either something is not right here or PEDS are really rubbish.
MSP you can have your lalala argument on this one 😀

Did you hear his interview on 5live pre race
What a ****

And in other news the Kreuziger case gets dropped at the 11th hour.

Quite surprised really. I was pretty sure he was going to get a ban. Be interested to know what new information came to light at this stage. Maybe the UCI decided they didn’t want to risk a CAS verdict against the bio passport?

I’d be surprised if there are any elite athletic T&F types who haven’t/don’t take naughty.

This phrase has been running through my head on this morning’s run. It’s been bothering me, I understand the sentiment and where you’re coming from but think you’re very wrong.

I’m strictly at the donkey end of club runner spectrum but you’re still basically slurring a lot of people I rub shoulders with and some of whom I’m proud to call mates. People who competed at County up to International level and right at the top Olympic and Commonwealths.

Where are you drawing this line? People who improve too fast for your liking, people who get their England vest a little too easily? Or is it just say the Top 10 in a discipline? World Record holders?

Once you start spraying mud that broadly, there’s a lot of collateral damage and your denigrating the hard work of a lot of people who’ve worked their nuts of to get where they are.

Irish Times Article

Thread with list by country, numbers of banned athletes

In the same way that I’m sceptical when I read Astana and Doping in a headline, when certain countries do well outside expectations in Athletes, I personally think it’s probably fake. Which is pretty sad, when you think about it, but when there’s so much money in sponsorship these days I’m not alone in thinking it I reckon.

Money + Sport = cheating.

Ross Tucker slaying Farah on Twitter

@scienceofsport

Aye where theres money/sponsorship to be made the top finishers will always be tainted. Im really sceptical post-Lance.

Sprinters who look like they could enter body building contests, etc etc.

Rugby, what other sports are there?

If people like Mo are top of their game clean then they are truly unique in our species against those who are talented/one of the best, then dope ontop.

surfer – Member
I think it’s been long established that current drugs testing won’t catch anyone with half a brain.
Then the fact that the African continent only has one agency matters not one bit.
it time of effectiveness in the body is 15-20days.
Yes and it can be traced in post event testing.

First point: http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/apr/16/kenyan-epo-tv-documentary-wada

Second: watch the original Panorama investigation, available on iPlayer. EPO use not detected for purposes of blood ‘passport’.

To get to the top really doesn’t require a lot more than a good diet, very hard structured training and good conditioning. Most top athletes know what training to do, and there is little more a coach can add. It’s not rocket science! Why on earth would an athlete associate with a coach whom many are alleging illicit practice? Hmm I wonder…
It’s just like Armstong/ Ferrari.

To get to the top really doesn’t require a lot more than a good diet, very hard structured training and good conditioning.

Bullshit, if that was true then you should be able to pick anyone at random off the street and they would be able to compete and win at international levels.

Right. So the only point of coaches is to act as pharmacist? Nice broad brush slur.

Bullshit, if that was true then you should be able to pick anyone at random off the street and they would be able to compete and win at international levels.

Utterly, totally and completely agree. Did the fast kids at school get training? No, they were just fast. Or strong, or good at jumping or throwing or swimming or kicking or sliding or riding….

EPO use not detected for purposes of blood ‘passport’.

As long as the cheat dopes below known levels.

And is not detectable out of its “glow time” despite surfers claims. Which means that the only likely way to catch someone using it is through random out of competition testing, and that is rather dependent on the national anti doping agencies ability and willingness to test and prosecute accordingly.

And rather like recreational drugs (bath salts) with new “performance peptides” there is a bit of a battle going on between chemists and the doping laws.

Bump

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/33178292

Who was the female British Athlete who ‘forgot’ to attend 2-3 tests?

To put the missed tests in perspective- if yours or my job/pay cheque depending on tests you’d be there. To miss 1 is bad luck, to miss two? You’d be bricking it with the missed first if you were genuine.

Who was the female British Athlete who ‘forgot’ to attend 2-3 tests?

Christine Ohourogu (sp?)

You seem to think it was done accidentally on purpose. Can you tell us how you know this? Your infallible spidey sense?

Three times. Just bad luck I guess.

Cheers binners, just snotted a proper ‘number 11’ when I saw Rio giving the thumbs up.

Or a faulty doorbell, according to MoFa.

If only they had a more robust system…

All I could think of when I heard that he ‘hadn’t heard the doorbell’ was Tyler Hamiltons admission in his book that they used to hide behind the sofa when the testers came knocking.

I really hope he’s clean…

This news report from a couple of years back makes interesting reading in light of recent developments:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/athletics/9647354/Wada-says-there-is-no-blood-testing-for-EPO-in-Kenyas-big-training-centre-for-distance-runners.html

I really hope he’s clean, I really do. But, I’ve seen far too many sports people prove to be dopers to be overly surprised if he’s not.

Being brutal, he did seem to turn from a good but not great distance athlete to a world beater. Now this could be training, it could be others losing speed, a new coach or it could be something else, we don’t know. In fact, you can add Froome into this train of thought as well…

There is a fear that the systemised culture of doping within cycling, as starkly revealed by the Lance Armstrong US Anti-Doping Agency dossier, has spread to track and field.

Haha, this amused me. As if somehow cycling is the root of doping and it’s not been in athletics all along! 🙂

Froome into this train of thought as well

Froome rode for years with bilharzia and started winning once healthy

FFS look at Berties and Nibbles at Astana for the smoke in cycling at the moment