The upside to government cuts!

Speed cameras help in some places. Blackspots junctions etc but on motorways I doubt it.

Do they still have speed cameras on motorways apart from at roadworks? I didn't think they had for a few years.

I had 85 out of mine.

Off a cliff?

The heater was OK. It never broke down becasue I looked after it

No it wasn't. Don't lie. It was always bloody freezing in that camper, and you know it. In fact, everyone who owns a VW Camper van knows it's rubbish, they're just too ashamed to admit it. Slow, crap handling, acceleration of a glacier, and always falling apart. Cost more per mile to run than a Bugatti.

and a full service is only £5000

That's about right.

There were some figures released a while ago with a full breakdown of accident causes. The leading cause was inattention.

Sounds about right. I've had my fair share of knocks (Works vehicles every time bit one) and each time it was becasue I was just bimbling round not paying much attention to where I was going or what I was doing.

That said, when I was about 19 I did spin my parent's Nissan Micra in the middle of town, in the wet, trying to get round a corner where a schoolmate had crashed becasue I couldn't work out how he did it. That was just inexperinece and I got away with it, and I did end up in a totally different place to where he did, so I never got my answer!
I told my dad years later and he did say that Micra was the worst handling car he'd ever driven, and he's an ex rally driver and advanced instructor to be fair, so I believe him on that. 🙂

STW is far funnier than the Daily Mash, IMO.

LOL!!! This is true.. you are all so serious,tangled up in a fury of counter posting and googling facts.

Pure comedy gold… someone on the internet is wrong!!

Yeah I accept the GPS innacuracy thing, I was miles off course yesterday. It could be done by some other method, radio/rifid/ bluetooth – it seems to work in the pit lane in formula one. I am not trying to carry out a design exercise here I just think it is possible and is a good idea.

Yeah I accept the GPS innacuracy thing, I was miles off course yesterday. It could be done by some other method, radio/rifid/ bluetooth – it seems to work in the pit lane in formula one. I am not trying to carry out a design exercise here I just think it is possible and is a good idea.

You are of course right it could be done, but it would not be simple or cheap.

But before we spent money on that we might consider

Smoking related deaths are in the region of 100,000 a year, there are around 9000 alcohol related deaths a year in the UK. People killed in RTA's less than 3000

Where should we spend the money ?

Bazzer

Off a cliff?

Well it was downhill on the M62, but it would do 75+ on the flat. Mildy tuned 1641cc engine, see. 🙂

No it wasn't. Don't lie. It was always bloody freezing in that camper, and you know it. In fact, everyone who owns a VW Camper van knows it's rubbish, they're just too ashamed to admit it. Slow, crap handling, acceleration of a glacier, and always falling apart. Cost more per mile to run than a Bugatti.

Handling – It's a 30 year old van, what do you expect, eejit!
Very comfy ride though, and a nice interior.
Freezing – The 2nd night I slept in it it was -7 degrees, but it was fine otherwise. New heat exchangers and a properly serviced engine see to that. 🙂
Slow – So? Stop and sleep the night somewhere or have a cup of tea! And we shouldn't be speeding, right?
Falling apart? No. VERY well made. At 25 years old mine sailed through the MoT every time. It had it's first welding (2 x 2inch squares) at 26 years old
26mpg if I was careful though, which was expensive but….

and a full service is only £5000

…… No. £50. At a specialist. (Just Kampers who used to be based in Farnborough)
That's oil change (There's no filter), valve adjustment, lube the front axle and a general check round. There's nowt to go wrong.

I'd like very much not to have to deal with motorcycles doing 140 on Public roads thanks. Go to a track.

Smoking related deaths are in the region of 100,000 a year, there are around 9000 alcohol related deaths a year in the UK. People killed in RTA's less than 3000

Where should we spend the money ?

Bazzer

A valid point IMO, but others on here would say they should just not drink or smoke…….

But before we spent money on that we might consider

Smoking related deaths are in the region of 100,000 a year, there are around 9000 alcohol related deaths a year in the UK. People killed in RTA's less than 3000

Where should we spend the money ?

We I would make the manufacturers bear the cost for all new cars..

Other than that I completly agree with your analysis – I apply the smae tot he war on terror.

Terrorist deaths in the uk int he last 10 years = 100 ish?

Umpteen hundred dead uk soldiers, umpteen thousand dead iraqi's/afghans.
Billions of quid spent on defence. Seems crazy to me when people here die because NICE wont recommend spending money on X drug or Y diagnostic technique…

I'd like very much not to have to deal with motorcycles doing 140 on Public roads thanks.

Like I said before, you won't see me becasue I shall wait until you are gone.

You know, we're hopefully getting another bike to go touring on next year. We need something big enough for the 2 of us and camping gear. I've mostly discounted a Honda Blackbird though. Not because it's not a good bike, but becasue it does 180 mph and I don't think I could be trusted with that sort of power. I'd have to max it out, see. But when people give me crap like that, ohhhhhhhh, it's sooooooooooo tempting….. 8)

Handling – It's a 30 year old van

Based on a 60 year old design…

Are you bored? Find yourself with lots of time on your hands? Happy to spend hours fixing things? Have lots of money to throw away? Not too bothered that the end result will be a pointless pile of junk anyway?

Then buy a VW Camper Van! Many wasted hours of frustration and sorrow! Grief for all the family!

Only £62,499!

Jesus wept, GPS speed limiters and automatic cruise control.

Why don't we just let the government remove our balls and brains and then we can borrow them back when they tell us we might need them!

Jesus wept, GPS speed limiters and automatic cruise control.

Why don't we just let the government remove our balls and brains and then we can borrow them back when they tell us we might need them!

I think it depends on whether you see vehicles as dangerous or not. I'm sure if aliens landed here tomorrow and stood on the pavement adjacent to cars doing 50+mph they would think we were all mental. In industry you have guards to protect you from moving machinery, but on the streets we all rely on experience and common sense.

Toys19 – Do you honestly think car manufacturers would absorb the cost? Consumers would end up paying it in increased prices, costs don't disappear that easily.

We don't have any fixed cameras here in Co Durham

we do OK without them

http://www.sundaysun.co.uk/news/north-east-news/2008/08/10/force-s-low-cost-of-cutting-road-deaths-79310-21504497/

Toys19 – Do you honestly think car manufacturers would absorb the cost? Consumers would end up paying it in increased prices, costs don't disappear that easily.

Yes, and? This was done quite successfully with cat converters and fuel injection.

Anyway keep your hair on, I dunno if its the right idea, but I find cars/lorrys/mcycles very scary and I dont think people realise the devastation they can cause. Maybe enforced video nasty watching of the results of accidents would do it. Although the resulting PTSD might be expensive to deal with..

I am with you to some extent Toys – if anything else killed thousands of our citizens each year there would be outcry about it.

Maybe enforced video nasty watching of the results of accidents would do it

Been there. Got the t-shirt. I just got bored of the message, it was on a Bikesafe Training day……

if anything else killed thousands of our citizens each year there would be outcry about it.

That's a very easy thing to say and a very simplistic PoV, as I'm sure you realise TJ 🙂

One can never, ever remove all risk from everything. It's just not possible. Whatever we do, people will die and there's no getting away from that. We could stop all actvities that carried the slightest risk, but then we'd have to sit and do nothing at all. And then we'd get fat and die of a heart attack.

Everyone dies. But not everyone lives.

I find cars/lorrys/mcycles very scary

Do you drive? If so I recommend you stop as of now becasue I find you more scary than someone who's speeding……

Inattention, being silly, lots of things cause accidents. Speed makes them worse, and increases the chances of it actually happening rather than being a near miss.

How many times have you had someone pull out infront of you as a cyclist, because they didn't realise how fast you were going? Same works for cars. If you are going really fast – much faster than people anticipate – you're going to have accidents.

Sure, 140mph on an empty 3 lane motorway is probably safe as houses. However in other cases it's not too bright. Doesn't take a genius to work out that you've got half as long to react to anything, and OTHER PEOPLE have half as long to react to you. Plus they won't be expecting it.

Road safety isn't about what YOU do, it's about what WE ALL do. If I ran full pelt around a supermarket, someone'd stop me and tell me I was going to knock someone over or cause an accident, I'd get dirty looks all over the place.

One can never, ever remove all risk from everything.

No, but you can minimize it. Slowing the f*ck down is a pretty good place to start, you'll agree. That is not a sound argument, be honest.

Everyone dies. But not everyone lives.

Living isn't buying an expensive bike and going fast. That's just being dangerous. Not the same thing at all 🙂

Do you drive? If so I recommend you stop as of now becasue I find you more scary than someone who's speeding……

Why exactly?

PP you are justifying your position because you like going fast, it's time to realise that it's not just your life on the line.

Do you drive? If so I recommend you stop as of now becasue I find you more scary than someone who's speeding……

Well I recommend you stop now too.

No you stop driving.

Toys – I haven't got any hair to keep on! I don't think I was particularly aggressive, I try not to be on here or anywhere else for that matter – hence my absence from the Street Fighting thread. The point I was making was the cost will not disappear and consumers will end up bearing it (indirectly) as they will have done with catalytic converters etc. That said, because the cost is indirect it would certainly be more politically palatable, like the subsidies paid for generating green electricity which are passed on through higher utility bills.

I haven't got any hair to keep on!

Sorry wasn't aimed at you, I meant that more generally.. I know nothing of your state of hirsuitedness.

but becasue it does 180 mph and I don't think I could be trusted with that sort of power. I'd have to max it out, see. But when people give me crap like that, ohhhhhhhh, it's sooooooooooo tempting…..

Not sure what you mean there Pete Have you not been claiming that speed did not kill so what exactly is the issue here it cannot be any more dangerous than a moped …you have not bough that BS about speed killing now have you ?

Road safety isn't about what YOU do, it's about what WE ALL do

Oh yes. Totally agree.

So why aren't we ALL doing some extra training then? Why do most of us stick out head in the sand and think that once we've passed a test, we can stop learning? And that it's a given RIGHT to drive a car and to keep taking the test until we pass, rather than giving up when we realise we're crap at it?

I don't know if I'm any good, but I do know I'm better than I was and improving becasue I take an interest in driving, and strive to get better at it. I know I can improve more, so why aren't we all doing that?

The car test and licensing procedure is a JOKE. I know people that can barely see their hand in front of their face, but are too proud or plain thick to get glasses, yet they're still about on the roads. WHY are we nor retested every 5 years? (Say) WHY do we not have to pass a strict medical, eyesight and reaction test at similar intervals? People change, they get better, they get worse. I'd glady give up driving if I got too old/slow/myopic to do it, becasue I've been in cars with people like this and it scares me absolutely rigid, even at 20mph or so. I can think of about a dozen or more people off the top of my head who I've come across over the years who really shouldn't be on the roads. But they are…..

Sorry. Rant over

Toys – well you do now.

Not sure what you mean there Pete Have you not been claiming that speed did not kill so what exactly is the issue here it cannot be any more dangerous than a moped …you have not bough that BS about speed killing now have you ?

Fair comment, cheers! I'll put Blackbirds back on the list then. 😀

Why do most of us stick out head in the sand and think that once we've passed a test, we can stop learning?

I don't think that. Perhaps other people do because they're thick?

However, your rant is entirely justified, and it's mainly because of those people being on the roads that I would never drive 140mph unless on a very straight very deserted motorway. And even then I'd probably not. 120mph tops maybe. Cos I know I can make mistakes, even though I don't know what they are until they happen.

Sorry. Rant over

lol – your concern over road safety is really inspiring.

Slowing the f*ck down is a pretty good place to start, you'll agree

No I don't. I think being a better driver is the pace to start.

PP you are justifying your position because you like going fast, it's time to realise that it's not just your life on the line.

Nope. Not at all. If you're scared by cars, you shouldn't be driving one. Get off the road, or get some proper training, it's not just your life on the line…… This works both ways.

I'll put Blackbirds back on the list then.

I will sleep safer knowing the roads are safer as a result 😉

There were some figures released a while ago with a full breakdown of accident causes. The leading cause was inattention

Suspect you are correct but hopefully the inattentive bfool hits me at 30 rather than 70 that is the point here. We know accidents are not pre planned and often due to bad driving but the laws of physics dictate that faster = more force = more damage=more injuries/deaths

However, your rant is entirely justified, and it's mainly because of those people being on the roads that I would never drive 140mph unless on a very straight very deserted motorway. And even then I'd probably not. 120mph tops maybe. Cos I know I can make mistakes, even though I don't know what they are until they happen.

You'd be pretty fecked if there was a speed camera every 100 yards though!

Nope. Not at all. If you're scared by cars, you shouldn't be driving one. Get off the road, or get some proper training, it's not just your life on the line…… This works both ways.

This is bollocks, I don't shy away every time I see a car. I just have a healthy fear of the damage they can do. Are you saying I would be a better driver if I thought that cars were jsut safe as daisies? What a crock of sh*t, you are just using this to shoot me down as you haven't got any real justification.

I will sleep safer knowing the roads are safer as a result

LOL!

Well, imagine the same 180mph bike (Or car for that matter) falling into the hands someone that's scared of them. Think of it as a public service! 🙂

We'll probably get a Ducati ST3 to be fair. Pokey enough to be fun but light elough for Mrs PP to ride whilst I'm asleep on the back as well. Plus we like Dukes more than Hondas. 🙂

We know accidents are not pre planned and often due to bad driving but the laws of physics dictate that faster = more force = more damage=more injuries/deaths

Exactly.