I’d be tempted to just carry the soft flasks and re-fill them at the stations. 1.5 or 2kg is a pretty big saving on knees etc.

Bit late to this, but I’d do the same. Forget the big bladder, that’s a lot of extra weight you don’t need if you’ve got feed stations. There’s a secondary advantage – if it’s hot make sure you empty at least one between stops. It’s easy to get carried away in a race and not drink as much as you need, and with a bladder it’s very hard to tell just how much you’ve drunk. Making sure you’ve emptied a soft flask keeps you honest 🙂

@mrsparkle

Best of luck on Saturday. Do you have a tracker?

first 10k race tomorrow night. be interesting….

also the 4 week email came through for the lairig ghru race.

“by now you should have done your longest run and be on the taper”

my longest is 24k/1000m climbing done 3 weeks ago – – offroad at least and it was back to back with a 15k….. ive worked out that gets me over the watershed and into the boulder field.

from there on its unknown in terms of running – although at least i know the terrain well from there down

Survival is the name of the game !

I know the title has the word “ultra” in but there is a lot of focus on road and Fell (Fell disproportionately IMO) but, unless I have missed it, not a single mention of track running. Or “proper running” as I like to call it.

Here you go, have a look at one of the best we have ever produced, in his prime 🙂

That’s brilliant to watch!.

Track tonight, 8×600, 100 secs recovery.

Or ‘horrible running’ as I like to call it. 🤣

ooohh 600’s. We used to do 600 in around 1:30 to 1:32 then a 100 m jog followed by 300 flat out. Only did 3 – 4 then often vomited on the side of the track… Happy days 🙂

The book about Coe and Ovett – ‘The Perfect Distance’ is a great read.

Now that would be a war of attrition.

“Ultra” track running.

Like that usa lassie that did the 24 hours of laps of the track. She must have been demented by the end of it. Be like a 24hr MTB race only more boring.

Sounds horrific!

There’s a local race here this year, the K24, 24 hours of a 4km lap round a park in Kilmarnock. I’d rather talk politics with TJ for 24 hours tbqh…. 🙂

OS mate, 20 quid a year, it’s brilliant. Download 1:25000 map before you head out for offline use, shows your position and you can download routes to follow as well, or make your own.

Viewranger is good too, but you have to buy credit and use that for maps, I eventually got a bit fed up of that.

Backcountrynavigator is good too, IIRC it’s a tenner or so up front.

You can subscribe with Viewrange too, think it’s about £25. I much prefer it to the OS app, which was really flaky on my phone (downloaded maps not showing up etc) but ymmv.

OS worked great for me – don’t live in UK but I pay a month’s subs so I can print maps while I’m there.

my longest is 24k/1000m climbing done 3 weeks ago – – offroad at least and it was back to back with a 15k….. ive worked out that gets me over the watershed and into the boulder field.

from there on its unknown in terms of running – although at least i know the terrain well from there down

Survival is the name of the game !

I’m in the same boat TR. Done some very very slow, hilly 30k runs (think: walking pace for some of yous), four days this week resting borked hip flexor / tendonitis which isn’t getting better very quickly, race is Sunday after next. I guess my plan now will involve winging it and ibuprofen. My reccies have been at 8 hour pace, so there’ll be a man with a brush following me round.

Good luck Mr Sparkle, hope the weather turns out better than it looks!

Yeah, good luck – forecasters always get it wrong 😉

Ovett was magnificent…

I’ve got my first track race next month – the MK 5000 http://www.mkac.org.uk/mk5000/ it’s also the UK Athletics 5000m champs – although I didn’t know that when I entered. I have absolutely no top end speed at all – my 10k PB is my 5k PB twice! So I’m getting my bum handed to me on a plate – I’ll be complete dogs***. But I’ve got some spikes and some VERY short-shorts, and there’s a beer tent so bring it on! And I get to watch some proper runners after my terrible race ;-P

Well that nearly killed me

Although I nailed warming up. 39 mins In zone 5 hit 211bpm and the remaining 4 minutes were z4

Landed 43:40 for my first 10k race. A clear 10minutes off my training on

80/20 does work

Great stuff Terry, just came back on to see how it went. 💪🏻

Is this @MrSparkle? Good arrows, if so.Well done fella.

Done. And. Dusted. Excellent, Mr Fox. @darwendashers pic.twitter.com/x0Qi9x6Tgy

— Calvin (@CalFerguson) June 8, 2019

Hope so! Been checking in here regularly for updates as the weather in the NW was pretty grim yesterday!

Well, stalking MrSparkle’s profile suggests his first name is Simon so I’m betting that’s him. If so, awesome work that man.

EDIT: Yep, that’s definitely him. He may be having an extended snooze.

Very well done Simon!

I’m sure he’ll be along before too long. Quality effort on a pretty grim day (a mate did the first stretch with him). Nice work squeaking under the hour in that wind and rain! I was due to be helping on the final stretch of a Sandstone Trail double – he more sensibly bumped it to today! Just off now – hope I don’t need the headtorch 😀

Hello there! Yes, it’s me. So, after all the blathering on about it in here I finally did it. The forecast was pretty bad but it was the only time I could get all my pacers/helpers lined up so decision was made. Didn’t sleep much the night before with rain hammering on the roof of the van parked up in pub car park. To cut a long story short the weather was bloody grim for first two legs but I was going well. Leg 3 was claggy but the rain was stopping. The cumulative effect began to weigh on me and at Bowfell I had a low point and had to dig deep. After that it got to harder terrain and was a slog. Leg 4 heading into the finish and I was losing the very few minutes I was up in schedule. By the very last hill, Middle Fell, it was touch and go whether I’d make it. My legs and feet were ruined by now but my support were screaming at me to keep going. I managed to get to Greendale Bridge with 2 minutes and 3 seconds of my allotted 15 hours remaining. I was delighted to be welcomed in by Joss Naylor. I am in a bit of a state now but I’ll recover and it will be an epic day that lives long in the memory. I have also raised about £1500 for Prostate UK.

Excellent work MrSparkle.

Fantastic sparkles! 💙

Awesome effort MrSparkle – well done that man

Awesome effort! 🙂

Amazing achievements from many people on here, and the latest one is quite incredible.

The thread title does say “beginners” so can I add to the thread? Just would like a bit of advice if possible.

Been trying to run, off and on, for a couple of years now to help with fitness. Haven’t been out since last year after I hurt my achilles and it took ages to heal and got annoyed with just general pain. Decided to go out on Saturday and did nearly 5k around the local park. Took it easy, lungs were fine, but my word, my legs didn’t half give me some grief. Back of the calves didn’t feel too bad while running, unlike the rest of my legs, but very tight today – they’re not injured though, just shocked. Apart from what is mentioned below, legs just feel well-used today which is a good feeling, isn’t it?

My main concern, and I got this before, is knee pain. Outside of knee (both this time), starts as a dull ache then slowly builds to a overbearing throb that means I have to stop, the alternative is certain death. I get it sometimes cycling longer distances, but not to the same extent, so it seems like a usage problem rather than impact. It will be fine if I stop moving, and ok afterwards if I’m still, but will hurt for a few hours after if I walk. Also hurt on Sunday walking a bit, but ok today (Monday). I can deep massage the tendon behind the knee and that seems to help. Is there a name for this problem and any way to alleviate it?

Maybe I’m just too old and knackered at 46 to start running more. It’s a shame because it seems like a really good way to get some good exercise into a short space of time, and it’s quite pleasant, if you can ignore the agony of the experience.

Please ignore if an irrelevant problem. Cheers.

Not at all, I was a beginner when this thread started, and in terms of some of the others on here, I still am!. And I was 43 when I started too!.

One of the hardest things for beginners is knowing when to run through it, and knowing when to stop. In my own experience, I had a fair bit of knee pain at the start – I’d had a meniscal tear repaired 3 years ago and that swelled up and gave me a bit of pain. I kept going and it eased off after a few weeks, but tbh I mibbe got lucky!

I reckon running is the best thing I’ve done for my knees, the strength that’s resulted is definitely a bonus, all this nonsesne about running being bad for the joints is generally peddled by folks that don’t run and need a wee excuse IMO.

Good luck, don’t take my advice as gospel, just offering my experience.

The thread title does say “beginners” so can I add to the thread?

These are the posts I like the most here.

Starting at the end and working back…

Maybe I’m just too old and knackered at 46 to start running more.

Sorry, ‘fraid not. You’ll have to find a different excuse. :o)

Not sure what the pain you’re experiencing is – maybe try a physio – I have a few male and female friends who seem to be suffering ITB pain – which sounds similar to what you’re discussing, but beware of internet diagnoses. If it’s giving you trouble and it’s stopping you doing the shite you want to do, then go to a pro and get it sorted.

Depending on what you were doing before you took the year off, your legs may not have a good memory of something to which to return when you start again. So, as frustrating as it may be because you’re generally fit, your lungs and brain are saying “5k yeah, pièce du pisse…”, but your legs might be saying “Whoa there tiger, give us a chance!” Maybe take it easy for a bit. Do a bit of run-walk-run-walk. Always warm up with a brisk walk/slow jog (something I’ve had to force myself to do as I’ve aged). Avoid static stretching before a run…some dynamic stuff post-warmup-pre-run might be ok. It’ll probably feel weird at the beginning because you want to do more, but just ease yourself in. By the end of the year, you’ll be trying to figure out how to do a sub-20 parkrun.

Welcome to one of the best threads on STW.

Yip, Mr Darcy speaks sense, apart from the last bit….

Tis’ the best thread on STW (and about the only one the bawbags haven’t infiltrated yet!) 🙂

45 here, running for 6mths. If you can stretch to a monthly physio appointment, that’ll help keep some of the nastier stuff away. I have really struggled with injury, mostly due to ramping the volume up far more than was wise, but it has helped to know what strengthening exercises to do. Eg., she got me doing knee exercises that have so far (touch wood) kept the knee issues more or less at bay after being laid up with them at the beginning.

Thanks for the replies people!

Lots of good stuff there, and I think basically the advice to take it easy is golden. I hate stopping and always want to run through it, so need to adjust my brain to that one.

Big shocker I’ve just learnt – static stretching! Had no idea that was bad. Have things really changed since 1987? I thought I was bang up to date. I’ll be reading up on that but why is it bad?

Sub-20 park run, Hmmmm. How to? EPO? bicycle maybe? I did a 25.30 a couple of years ago so if I can get down to sub-25 I would be happy.

The run I did on Saturday (not quite 5K) was 28:30. I did it last year in 24:30. Gulp.

Cheers.

Stretching cold muscles isn’t a great idea, tbh I don’t stretch at all, even afterwards, but that’s mainly due to the fact I just canny be arsed rather than anything scientific!.

20 minute 5k isn’t easy, I’ve not managed it yet – club monthly 5k TT tomorrow night, I’ll be having another go then! Track sessions have been great for building pace, and also longer slower runs, that definitely works although it seems counter-intuitive.

I don’t stretch often either. There’s pro’s and cons as there is with everything.
Re the sub 20 ParkRun. Don’t get hung up on it. Keep chipping away with gradual improvement. Choose your ParkRun (this one is important!). Learn to suffer.

Sub 20 PR is hard, btw! I didn’t mean it that seriously. Just enjoy it for now – when you’re running comfortably, then parkruns are great fun – plus there will be loads of people you’ll easily beat. :o) But sub-20 is running 5 x 4 minute kms. Best I’ve managed is 21.07 PR and a few sub 21 self-timed via watch, so I never really trust those as much. As Mr Sparkle says, really don’t get hung up on that, for now.

Maybe I’m just too old and knackered at 46

Nope. But if you have a lot of niggles best just to ease right back until you find an intensity and frequency that you can manage, then build from there. I will be 55 in October and not ruling out a sub 18:30 if I can stay injury free.

Sub 20min 5k is something I’m maybe aiming for next year.

I wouldn’t be thinking about that at this stage. It’s a goals that many folk will never achieve.

My pb is 20:45 and I did 20:49 in the first half of a 10k on Friday night.

I wouldn’t expect to go sub 20 in a 5k any time soon my self. Let alone going from 24mins.

Pushing to that too quick will see you injured just let it progress don’t push too hard you’ll just end up going backwards waiting for injuries to heal

I am in no way going to go for anything like a sub-20 5k. If I get back into it and I start doing park runs again, sub-25 is my aim. Just need to take it easy for now I think. Thanks for all the advice!

I’ll keep you posted on the pain after the next run.

A 20min 5k is unthinkable for me. Mechanics are all wrong, I can hit 4min/km downhill and it feels terrible. I’ve done a fair bit of running this year (1100km and 45,000m climbing according to Stava) but still feel very much like a cyclist 😅

My OH tells me I just look wrong running, in fact she says I look very awkward off the bike in general, like an old sailor on land (her analogy).

I’d like to enter a 10k just to see what I can do if I push. I’ve only run 10k on tarmac once, in trail shoes, and was miffed to not even break 50m.

@nobeer, have you seen Saturdays forecast? Early days yet but not looking great. If it stays like that we’ll be on the low courses especially given that woman getting killed by lightning in the Mamores.