Riding MoD land in the South…. Words of warning!

The problem is mainly with dog crap, fly tippers,

So the 14/20 Street Sweepers will be sent into theatre next time before the Marines et al deploy?

Why on earth should anyone in the MoD possibly have to offer justification about how the land is used and when? It’s the MoD’s, not yours, therefore they get to say who gets in, not you.

No its OURS funded by our taxes and administered by the MOD for the good of the citizens of this fine country. The political cadre seem to be losing sight of the fact that they work for us, as do our armed forces.

No its OURS funded by our taxes and administered by the MOD for the good of the citizens of this fine country

If by ours you mean the MODs, then yes it is. If you mean the general publics, then you’re plainly wrong.

Completely agree that all non soldiers, dogs walkers and MTBers should be kept out of training areas. I mean, in war zones, there are never civilians, shit and grot for the squaddies to know not to shoot at, deal with or crawl through are there? Oh wait…

Actually, the MoD should probably wind its neck in. In light of recent events surrounding the national forest, its evident that potentially massively increasing public recreational access to wilderness areas could be a massive vote winner. It was common land before, it could be again.

Bloody hell guys, stop whinging! “The MoD has a big garden that I want go and ride my bike in, but they say I can’t because it’s theirs.” Tough titty! Why on earth should anyone in the MoD possibly have to offer justification about how the land is used and when? It’s the MoD’s, not yours, therefore they get to say who gets in, not you.

Whoop Whoop!! Good point.

Get over it guys and gals, if you don’t like it ride some where else, simples!!!!

Completely agree that all non soldiers, dogs walkers and MTBers should be kept out of training areas. I mean, in war zones, there are never civilians, shit and grot for the squaddies to know not to shoot at, deal with or crawl through are there? Oh wait…

Actually, the MoD should probably wind its neck in. In light of recent events surrounding the national forest, its evident that potentially massively increasing public recreational access to wilderness areas could be a massive vote winner. It was common land before, it could be again.

The MoD have guns the FC don’t! Common land it may have been in the past, but NO chance it will be again in the currant climate, recent events, so CIVVIES should wind ones necks in and get over the fact that they are lucky to ride on said land and play nicely, as the Army have for years, end of!

Eerr, this is in surrey. There isn’t that much open space. Most of the land around here is private golf courses.
The surrey hills are already massively over used, with the associated problems.
So we should leave thousands of acres of land empty, so a couple of sqauddies can run around once a week?

The MoD have guns the FC don’t!

Your point is, exactly? Plenty of guns in civilian hands in this country, being perfectly responsibly handled in areas open to the public. The FC may not feel the need to shoot stuff often, but they do operate some fairly serious machinery in the course of their operations, yet still manage to not have to ban all and sundry from ‘their’ land…

Pants, you’re just being silly now. The MoD have guns? So what? unless the new drafts of the bylaws include a shoot on sight policy that’s a pointless comment. The FC or the MoD – both are using decades old legislation that is not relevant now, which will be challenged if a negotiated solution can’t be found.

As for the ‘if you don’t like it go and ride somewhere else’ – surely if we don’t like it then we should continue to use the land in the same co-operative manner as we have for the last 15 years and prove that both parties can co-exist happily. Go and ride somewhere else is giving up.

Anyway, Here’s an idea; The MoD gives back the tracts of common land that it took from the people and instead leases a swathe of desert from our pals the Saudis to train. Tans for the squaddies, more realistic battleground simulation, UK public happy. Everyone’s a winner!

anyone have links to official MOD position? what’s changing? i’ve heard today about confiscation of bikes and £1000 fines. this makes no sense to me as i’ve passed dozens of soldiers/cadets and all sorts of other users for years in Longmoor and had zero problems, even some friendly hellos. so my plan for now is to continue and be wary, avoid exercises, respect instructions etc as i’ve always done. getting caught in fire (live or not hard to tell) isn’t fun anyway. nor is running over a landmine or something.
all this talk of who owns the land, who has guns etc is completely unhelpful. if i’m ever told i shouldn’t be there by someone who looks official, i will probably not go back. hopefully i get out with my bike.. as i said though this isn’t how it feels so far, fingers crossed. i’ve had way scarier encounters with farmers and weirdos in shacks near footpaths.

so CIVVIES should wind ones necks

And there we have it gentlemen and ladies the squaddie assuming he is better than the rest of the populace. I seem to remember I had to put my combats on one leg at a time as does every other trouser wearer, and sit down for my morning dump like every one else.
No better and no worse than anyone else. In some instances worse than most people because empathy is trained out of you to do the job effectively.

V980,

There’s more to combat than just the desert! The training areas wouldn’t be held on to if they had no use. The MoD isn’t in the business of hoarding land it doesnt need, it simply doesn’t have the money.

But it does have the money too chase out mountain bikes?

Sandwich….. Not at all!!!! Why should the MoD wind ones necks in?

Bloody Hell a throw away comment taken out of proportion like this Thread!!! Get over it peeps!

You may continue to ride on MoD land, but if you get stopped and warned off or your bike confiscated don’t start bleeting about it on here, as a polite warning in advance has been given well in advance!!!!!!!!

not have to ban all and sundry from ‘their’ land…

The MOD isn’t doing this. The ROWs are unaffected, they’re stopping MTBers trespassing purely because some are acting like dicks. there has been stories that riders have been telling the squaddies to **** off, riding purposely through ambushes and building north shore and jumps. Did anyone think that the MOD would just take that level of piss taking on the chin? The MOD and MTBers could cohabit and they probably still would if some riders had towed the line.
No ones banned, just stick to the ROWs.

There’s more to combat than just the desert! The training areas wouldn’t be held on to if they had no use. The MoD isn’t in the business of hoarding land it doesnt need, it simply doesn’t have the money.

Indeed and the sole reason it sells off surplus land!

wrecker, that’s very sad to hear that some MTBers have done that. but which bit of MOD land has this happened on do you know? also “trespass” is a strong word when as yet there are no signs or anything that i’ve seen.

What I will add and I will not mention what group yet!!

A certain group of riders who ride on MoD land think it is rather funny when they encounter the Army and ride straight through a exercise area and get shouted at and continue on to disrupt training these are the people we are dealing with!!!! This has only recently come to light such as the group name, as this has been reported b4. 🙁

All the no rth shore got knocked down a couple of years ago, and hasn’t been rebuilt.
If you want stories of people being dicks, try the squadies who tried to run me down in a land rover…… 😯

pants…
Name and shame….

Report them it works both ways!!! The NS was a request and it has been rebuilt in a secret location as it got well known!
😀

not naming yet, need to chat to the shop first

Sorry to hear that useless hippy. It’s not really surprising that there are dicks in the army, just are there are dicks who ride bikes. The group mentioned by pants need a bloody good hiding IMO.

But you said you know who’s been pissing off the army….
Name….

umm if one group is being abusive surely those individuals should be banned or something, not everyone on a bike. if one group of walkers or horse riders were mouthing off at soldiers, would anyone try to ban all walkers or horse riders from an area? this makes no sense. if i wanted to abuse a squaddy i could do that with a loud-haler and no bike. are there not existing laws about interfering with military or military exercises that would allow individuals to be prosecuted?

and.. which land are we talking about?

I’m sure others have that I don’t know about such as DOAMTB or PP or and many others or …………………

Pants; if that’s the case that’s disgraceful. We’ve had a great access relationship in the past – more recently through the work of groups like ACU and TAG – so if these groups do disrupt wilfully then they need to be hauled up for it, as they will compromise the relationship for all of us.

And I for one would like to know who because I wouldn’t want to support a shop or org that doesn’t support local MTBers in return.

I’m sure others have that I don’t know about such as DOAMTB or PP or and many others or

Please explain this.

but if you get stopped and warned off or your bike confiscated don’t start bleeting about it on here,

Take my bike of me? You and who’s army? 😉

Oooh, this could be interesting: come June, it looks like I might be one of the people politely asking you to kindly remove yourself from the middle of my exercise in the Pirbright area!

And if it’s a nice one, I might have to confiscate your bike back to my garage as well!

Theotherjonv.
Spot on.
I’ve been riding tunnel hill and other areas for years, with no problems, and I wouldn’t want someone else ruining my fun by being an idiot.
I do think people need too remember mod land isn’t the best place to build trails, north shore or drops.

BLOODY HELL.

I’m amazed that there are so many here who don’t get the damage that they do to the realism of an exercise when they come wheeling through without a care..

If I’ve got to explain it to you then, hell, you’re more stupid than the guy who thought on the video the other day who thought it was a good idea to check the amount of petrol in his tanker with a lighter…

🙄

The Marines do a lot of exercises on a popular Devon MTB spot.. it’s always good fun to encounter some of the pyrotechnic effects and groups of booties..

I never seem to be carrying a camera at the right time though..

@Yunki, don’t get your camera out. That’s begging to be grabbed, kicked senseless and then carted off to the nearest base to face interrogation along the lines of terrorism.

I’ve been on the odd range where when the targets go down in the distance there are still a couple of white blobs, that seem to be wavering, waiting to be knocked down. Helps if the army isn’t renting the land off farmers, who put their sickest sheep near the ranges hoping they get a round through them so they can claim for the max value. “Searn’t Major, should I take the last two down?” “No son, they’re sheep.”

Blanks can kill btw. That stupid yellow screw-on adaptor you see on the end of the SA80 series rifles during exercises is dual purpose, to help reload the rifle as the gas operation is different with blanks, also it attempts to prevent shards off the end of the round casing coming out the business end. There was a minimum distance to aim a rifle and fire at a fellow soldier and this expands something like 5x for firing it anywhere near civvies. It’s quite hard to keep calm when two women with dogs off the lead slowly walk through a clearing whilst chatting, totally oblivious to the 30-40 soldiers who’ve just been blatting away at each and throwing thunderflashes around. Cue multiple screams of “CEASE FIRE!” and stern looks from your commanders, daring you to vocally air a grievance in front of the civvies. I’d imagine coming up on an exercise on your bike and finding yourself in the middle of it might produce red cheeks for the rider and a fair bit of annoyance for the military.

My own feelings, if it’s not a firing range and you keep your distance from the troops, I don’t see why the military is going to get arsey about riding round their land. When you’ve sat motionless on a hill not moving for a day and finally exhausted turning clouds into animals, and trying to figure out why sheep think the grass is greener on the other side of the fence they’re all leaning on, the odd burst of colour and interest as some MTBer buzzes through the area helps you pass the time of day.

@Yunki, don’t get your camera out. That’s begging to be grabbed, kicked senseless and then carted off to the nearest base to face interrogation along the lines of terrorism

20 odd years ago an old girlfriends mum (a greenham common vet, cnd activist and general militant hippie) got almost that treatment when she stopped outside CTCRM Lympstone to photograph some unusual daffodils.. 🙄

STOP

Perspective time. The MoD owns vast tracts of land across the UK. Much of it isn’t remotely attractive to mountain bikers or other outdoor types. Some of it is.
Some of it has problems with people straying off the accepted (legal, permitted, whatever the definition) trails and being where they should not be. This causes huge problems for the MoD who have a Duty of Care to anyone on their land. We’ve seen this with the Forestry Commission and access issues over the years, but the MoD fires guns, drives tanks and actively undertakes far more dangerous practices than felling trees. Which is why it has to deal with people being where they should not be more firmly.
This is a small minority on small parts of the estate. Rather than posture and postulate on a forum, obey any signs you see, stay away from troops you see and we’ll see what comes out officially (it will be officially, the MoD likes official).

there has been stories that riders have been telling the squaddies to **** off, riding purposely through ambushes and building north shore and jumps

so why don’t the squadies, and hopefully a local MP, take the opportunity to strongly enforce the wording of the bylaws at this point – fine the riders or confiscate bikes – the latter being the best way to get round the probable problems with the riders not carrying identity.

The vast majority of contributors (all except one I think) understand that when an exercise is underway then we shouldn’t use the area and should get out of the way asap.

The issue is when the land isn’t being used for exercises. Quite a few people on here would like to enjoy the level of responsible access that has existed for years (albeit contrary to the 1970’s bylaws which govern the land access).

so why don’t the squadies, and hopefully a local MP, take the opportunity to strongly enforce the wording of the bylaws at this point – fine the riders or confiscate bikes

It isn’t their job. They are there to undertake training – training essential to their remaining alive when in nasty places. Suggesting they then distract themselves by learning about the legalities of access and doing that in the middle of an exercise is not a solution.

learning about the legalities of access and doing that in the middle of an exercise is not a solution.

It is not very hard, is it? I know that the average attention span of a squadie is only something like 15 minutes but even so…

Any public that are not on a ROW (which is pretty obvious) should not be interrupting an exercise. If they do not politely respond to a request to remove themselves then you come down hard on them.

After a few such incidents and publication of them then you would start to find the problem dissappearing.

This would be a lot better than a blanket ban where the resourcing required to enforce it is impractical and would mean that the ban would be seen as toothless.

As I remember things the person who can order you off the land has to be duly authorised by the Commanding Oficer to do so; that is the CO of the area, not the excercise. I’m not sure how that works when the training area has been hived off to a private company.