Removing load bearing walls upstairs?

Our house has an extension above the garage; at the top of the stairs there’s a doorway knocked through the cavity wall into the new bit.

I’d like to have the doorway widened to merge a corridor in the extension into the rest of the landing. It basically involves expanding the doorway from about 0.9m to up to 2.3m.

Is this possible? If so, how much of a job is it? I’ve found loads about removing load bearing walls but they are always on the ground floor, not on the first floor next to the stairs. Would you use acroprops? If so, where would you put them?

The wall holds up the roof but no floors, so could you put the beam in the loft space to make a completely flat ceiling? I did see a video about a clever way of installing a beam by using a thing that held a row of blocks from above which didn’t use acroprops; is this a thing?

I’d like a rough idea before getting someone out to look as to whether they may say “yes, it’s easy” or “yes, but we basically have to rebuild your whole house”…

It depends so much on what the wall is holding up – it could be nothing, it could be holding the entire roof. If it used to be the external wall then its probably hold the roof up. what sort of lintel was put in for the doorway?

I’m sorry but I don’t think there is any way in which you can garner sensible advice from an internet forum on work that could potentially see your roof fall in (especially without any pictures).
I’m pretty handy around the house but when we had our loft done I had to except that no amount of internet research would qualify me to fully critique a professional.
If I was you I’d get a good selection of tradesmen in to discuss and quote and also look out locally for any loft extensions so you can question the house owners on who they used.

To get a building warrant you will need drawings and calcs, to that end, go to a professional and discuss your needs. No offence but you haven’t got a clue so leave it well alone.

As for your flush ceiling idea,that depends but I’m inclined to say it wouldn’t work, with the chance falling to zero if you have any ceiling joists resting on it.

Flush ceiling can work if you use a cavity lintel, you could even BAT strap off a concrete lintel if needed.

Depending on how the roof is supported this may or may not be simple 🙂

Anything is possible subject to cost, so I’d suggest getting a builder in to give you a quote and get an engineer in to check what needs to be done.

Get a structural engineer involved as above, you will most likely need to speak to building control too, a good SE will possibly even suggest a builder and work with them to make sure its done properly.

Load bearing walls don’t just provide vertical support, they also stabilise the walls at right angles to them. So even if the roof doesn’t load the wall, it will be keeping the front and back walls upright. Wind can be quite a significant load. You need a structural engineer. See findanengineer.com if necessary.

Don’t worry, I’m fully aware this is waaay beyond my capabilities, but I would like to know more about how this kind of thing works if you can’t use acroprops (or can you?) so I know a little more about it before getting people in to look properly. The internet is full of people removing walls downstairs, but I haven’t found any doing it upstairs at all so I have no idea how it could work.

The wall is parallel with all the roof trusses, so am I right in thinking it’s not holding up much (any?) more weight than they are? It’s got no joists or anything hanging from it.

I’ve no idea what kind of lintel is over the existing doorway, but presumably the process of putting a short lintel like that is much easier than a longer one as you only have to hold up the weight of a few blocks. Maybe that’s why they didn’t make the hole any bigger originally…

We had a load bearing wall and chimney breast (and he chimney above) removed between two bedrooms upstairs. To meet building regs we had a structural engineer to do the calculations and as said above the back wall at 90 degrees to the aperture required a substantial steel wind post to provide integrity to the work. The top of the steel is flush with the ceiling so projects down into the room but is not intrusive as our ceilings are high.
They used a number of acro props with the load spread with boards as well as the fittings that go on acros to support under bricks for which I can’t recall the name

I removed most of a wall in my top floor flat. Very simple as nothing rested on it except at the ends. What was done was that the wall was removed and a lintel put in. A friend in the same block removed and entire wall. the stuctural engineer in his case tried to tell us that it needed a steel. We removed the ceiling to show him absolutely noting rested on the wall and it was just removed in total.

Structural engineers like everything else in life there are good ones and others
An A4 sheet with some hand drawn drawings and calcs can pass building control if the engineer is qualified
Other maybe larger firms send out anyone to take sizes and photos, given to a new out of uni engineer to gain experience and often everything is way over the top and may cost you quite a bit more, the drawing gets signed off by a more senior engineer sometimes many drawings with pages of obvious spec and passes but the company wants to make money with site visits etc
So like solicitors, dentists,architects,garages word of mouth recommendation rather than just a good web page unknown
I’m expecting to get hit back by the se and there are one or two here

Is this existing opening on the original gable end? If yes then it’ll (likely) be supporting the bricks above and could ‘in theory’ be widened with a wider lintel. That’s all pretty straight forward. But
As greybeard says, there’s also wind/twisting to take into account. That’ll need an engineer to advise, taking into account roof design, how long the original wall is and what percentage of it will be removed, is it central or offset etc.
Some photos would help from inside and outside.

Structural engineers like everything else in life there are good ones and others
An A4 sheet with some hand drawn drawings and calcs can pass building control if the engineer is qualified

We used an engineer recommended by a number of people, as we were advised he had a very good reputation with the local authority.He did hand written calculations and drawings. Our builder, who also had a very good local reputation thought he had been a bit cautious, but we were happy with that!

Jeremy – just because a wall isn’t holding something up doesn’t mean that it’s not doing a job. It could be providing lateral stability and stopping racking.

That’s interesting about forces other than downwards. This would be a gap of just over two metres in the centre of the original end gable wall of about ten metres or so, so hopefully shouldn’t complicate matters too much.

Jimw, that’s really useful about upstairs acroprops, thanks.

Jimw, that’s really useful about upstairs acroprops, thanks.

I forgot to say that they had additional acros and boards supporting the kitchen ceiling on the ground floor underneath the joists to transfer the loads downwards. Sorry-quite an important detail

Jeremy – just because a wall isn’t holding something up doesn’t mean that it’s not doing a job. It could be providing lateral stability and stopping racking.

Very true.

My wall had a structural engineer to assess IIRC and my friends once we showed the engineer nothing was on the wall then he was happy for it to be removed completely. this wall was not even supporting the ceiling and had nothing on top of it at all.

I wasn’t suggesting doing without the pros opinion just trying to show that sometimes its easy, sometimnes its not

Sorry-quite an important detail

*voice from under pile of rubble that used to be a house* Oh, NOW you tell me…

🙂

Just get a structural engineer round to take a look and do you a design for a wider opening; they’re pretty cheap as it takes them all of 5 mins to do the calcs (they do so many almost identical designs). You can then use their design as the spec for getting quotes from builders etc.