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Seems as if every day more and more jobs being lost to skilled workers, in construction and engineering, the skills Great Britain was built on, and today Tesco said theyre taking on staff to stack shelves and trundle trolleys,along with a bus company in the midlands,but how is that going to help construction and engineering.
Almost every retail shop you go into is empty of customers,staff who are working are fearful of redundancy or the sack,quite a few workers i speak to say theyre bullied and now worry about the above.
Whens it all going to end, and who else is affected and cant see any light at the end of the very long tunnel.
Rolls-Royce is looking for an extra 200 engineers. There's a nationwide shortage and they're ploughing money into developing apprentice academies. S'not all doom and gloom.
Sorry about that. Many apologies for disturbing your peace by employing people. I shall send them home immediately.
Kind regards,
Tesco.
In all seriousness, industry in this country has been stuffed for the last thirty years. It's not going to change now.
1000 new jobs at Nissan. They just started making steel on Teesside again.
Move out of the North West.
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17752753 ]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17752753[/url]
Lots of jobs in Banking appearing all over again.
There's a shortage of qualified engineers in Scotland apparently. There was some chat on the radio last week advising that students might actually want to choose their subjects with a view to future employment. I'm guessing that means too many [i]History of Art[/i] graduates......
There's a shortage of qualified engineers in Scotland apparently.
There's your problem.
So to qualify as an engineer, you need a degree, and experience, in an engineering firm, and few firms take on inexperienced engineers.
They do when there's a shortage..... 🙄project - Member
So to qualify as an engineer, you need a degree, and experience, in an engineering firm, and few firms take on inexperienced engineers.
But obviously no shortage of dicks in England.
I couldn't agree more.
Redcar blast furnace is back up again, 1200 there? Not engineers though.
Automotive engineers are enjoying the first real peak for at least 12 years!
but nowhere do the jobs listed above go anywhere near the skilled jobs lost.
I can't find high level IT engineers. Loads of jobs for skilled people in my experience.
I blame Thatcher!
...........when the capitalist scum start eating their own babies
(and we start kicking their arrogant self-justifying arses!)
So to qualify as an engineer, you need a degree, and experience, in an engineering firm, and few firms take on inexperienced engineers.
erm, no. As I said [b]IN THE FIRST REPLY TO YOUR POST AT THE VERY TOP OF THIS THREAD[/b], you could do an apprenticeship.
Y'know - the old way of learning a trade.
but nowhere do the jobs listed above go anywhere near the skilled jobs lost
Yeah you're right, investment in apprenticeships at Rolls-Royce, a huge british based manufacturer building world leading jet engines and more, training employing engineers from the UK. It's not like they've been doing it for long. In the UK.
But hey, don't let an educated and fact based response which goes against your view influence you.
jonba - Member
Redcar blast furnace is back up again, 1200 there?
Good news, but no net increase in jobs. Just those who used to work there going back.
Our division had ~50 space software/system engineers. We've lost 15 engineers to other companies in the last year.
It's always a struggle to recruit suitable engineers. We've just recruited a young software engineer who's starting next month. And we may be recruiting a more experienced one soon.
So I would say the sense of a down-turn varies across industrial sectors.
Pook i did an apprenticeship and worked in a large steelworks, till it was closed down and sold to china, dismantled and then sent to chung king and rebuilt.
And how many jobs are being created at Rolls Royce, very few i bet.
Enough - RR are short at the mo, and the academy should pump out 200 a year IIRC.
edit: and it appears other industries are picking up too from other's comments here.
ime its as per druidhs comment
I started as a bike shop mechanic with a degree in mech eng , 3 years later enjoying a varied career in oilfield now as an engineer just moved to the work.
Ymmv
17% up on last year and could employ more if we could find the right people.
Pook most large companies had well equipped training centres, so what rolls royce is doing is nothing new, where as the RAF at Cosford are closing theirs as part of a defence review, all those training skills will be lost then,along with all the highly skilled trainees.
Hahahaha!
As I keep telling you lot, assholes in charge shit is gonna happen.
We have leaders who have no ability or vision, on top of that there is this fundamentally flawed philosophy of every man for himself.
You can't work in an environment where there is no trust, also the asshats in this country want to charge as much as possible and put as little as possible in, perfect example scottish parliament building and the dumb ass trams.
New leadership and a new philosophy whereby we all look for situations that everyone gains from, proper trading and growth/ development, we are no longer a rich country, we need to stop all the ****ed up greedy me me me selfish shit.
We have people running the country who have never been on a bus,let alone seen one built and probably think that engineering is something poor people do.
Theyre totally out of touch with real people just like some of you above.
The UK has quite a strong Engineering led Export industry - BAE systems, Airbus, Rolls-Royce, car manufacture. Last time I looked it up we earn more from making things than from the City.
Two BBC series worth watching are Made in Britain (with Ewan Davies) and 'How to Build', they both make us Engineers quite proud to be British 🙂
JLR: just in the past year have taken on 350 graduates, getting on for a few thousand experienced hires (engineers), and 2000 production staff in Solihull and Merseyside.
They are holding daily assessment centres and are struggling to hire new people fast enough to meet business needs.
We're going thru one of the biggest shifts in power and wealth for centuries. We've had it rich since the industrial revolution and particularly since end of WW2 but the future doesn't necessarily look like the past for us...
Countries we used to give aid to and look down on are now gaining in wealth and political power.They're willing and able to do stuff for a lot less money than us in the 'rich' world. They've got it all to win and they're after the big prizes.
There's also a tonne of stuff which people used to do, which can now be automated/done by computers.
IMHO it's not a zero sum game, China still needs our creativity and innovation so they have stuff to make cheaply. They're a collective society, they don't do thinking for themselves like we do.
Doesn't mean we're going to be poor but the way we create our wealth is going to have to change if we want any...
But don't expect our wealthy lifestyle that we've got rather too used to, to be sustained.
Don't expect politicans to know quite what to do about it and give over blaming the bankers and the 'fat cats', they're as scared and unsure about it as we are. They didn't see it coming and just like us they'd like to have maintained the status quo. It was quite nice really...
Think carefully about where the ops to earn a living are, create opportunities for yourself, get the experience and quals you need to be employable, be resourceful and don't expect it to be done for you...
Quite interesting times really....
I work for a large diesel engine manufacturer as a design engineer, i did a year long placement with them in between my 2nd and 3rd year at uni and am now back as a full time employee.
Automotive industry is crying out for engineers. JLR (Jag Land Rover) cant get enough engineers through the door at the moment.
Im lucky in the sense that the industry i was aiming to work in is booming, but I worked my arse off at uni and think im reaping the benefits now.
I have been out to recruitment fairs representing my company and it is seriously scary how many students are only waking up to the fact that their MA in history isnt going to get them a job very easily.
Project we need control of our own lives more, however the rich are moving very quickly to consolidate thier power and give us less control.
If we haven't seen enough to know that something has to change at this point, we will simply never get it!
It's ok. Don't worry. The financial services industry will save the country. Like it did last time.
Oh... Ern... Hang on a minute....
I'm sorry Project but, speaking as someone whose job is to track the job market, there really are lots of jobs being created out there. Skilled people are increasingly difficult to find and large companies are bringing back appretice schemes to fill those gaps.
The "market" is as good as I have seen it for 5 years, there are jobs out there and there are more bring created. But, these jobs may not be where you live, you need to move around to find them.
So middleclasstrackworld is doing fine and the recession is a figment of somones imagination yes?
do we live in a different world?
Some odd employers may be employing a few more and there may be a shortage of engineers of the calibre RR want but lets be honest there are f all jobs about at the minute in general.
A few exceptions wont alter this fact
Anyone who argues apprenticeships is the solution doe snot understand the issue
How many "apprentices " leave college with the skills and unable to secure employment in the trade to which they have trained?
You wont get a figure it so bad they wont even look at it
Locally to me they produce more mechanics and hairdressers each year than their are people employed in those industries in the town the college serves.
the same pattern is repeated in construction and engineering [ to a lesser degree]
Aye it is hard times for the majority of the country and apparently this is only 20 % of the actual cuts 😯
Oh 'eck! It's all gone a bit Norman Tebbit!
Good job we've all got bikes to get on eh? 😀
I have got 3 vacancies in my team alone at work. Its a challenge getting suitable people for us. Science cro here
JLR: just in the past year have taken on 350 graduates, getting on for a few thousand experienced hires (engineers), and 2000 production staff in Solihull and Merseyside.
They are holding daily assessment centres and are struggling to hire new people fast enough to meet business needs.
JLR OR TATA as theyre better known as, had 17,000 applications for a thousand assembly jobs, strangely a fellow cyclist just lost his job for an agency delivering new cars at the same company along with aload of his work collegues.
Then we have the iminent closure of Vauxhall on the opposite side of the mersey, thousands of jobs going there.
I advertised for 35 Wind Turbine Technicians a few weeks back. The advert was open (so applications saved on the system) for about a week, and I got 1200 applications. Says a lot about the opportunities (or lack of them) out there I think.
Blaming the rich/bankers/policitians won't make you any more desirable to an employer or your life any better IME... I've seen quite a few people do it. And I've seen a lot of people not do it, and I know who's happiest...
Anyway, haven't the rich already consolidated their power, isn't that how they got to the top of the tree in the first place? Hierarchy exists in every social structure in nature, someone's got to be at the top surely? In global terms, and even within Europe, living in the UK actually puts us pretty firmly in the rich camp anyway!
When the world is changing around us, victimising/disempowering ourselves by blaming others strikes me as an unlikely recipe for personal fulfilment and happiness... I've not seen anyone pull that one off yet
" totally out of touch with real people just like some of you above."
Project. I realise your situation is a less than happy one and I sympathise. But this remark is a bit wide of the mark. Some technical / creative / knowledge sectors have staffing shortfalls, fact. Reporting that does mean the reporter is out of touch with the dire situation in other sectors.
I saw the effects of the recession almost two and a half years ago when I took (voluntary) redundancy.
Not experienced it since - just about to hit my first quarter of a million in turnover - working on my own, in the construction industry. Note I'm talking turnover (not profit) before anyone starts.
Saying that - although there is potential to increase turnover/profit by employing people, I won't be doing so - it's too much bloody hassle. Not the actual employment aspect, but the red tape, accreditation, administration and general jumping through hoops (and ergo increase in overheads/risk) that comes with it.
00soppd - Member
I work for a large diesel engine manufacturer as a design engineer
Just curious.
Peterborough based?
slainte ❓ rob
00soppd - Member
I work for a large diesel engine manufacturer as a design engineer
Or Shrewsbury...
On another note I remember a certain Tony Blair declaring that he wanted 50% of kids to go to University - forgot to tell them to do something useful. What we needed at the time was plumbers and electricians etc.
We (you now I have left) have an economy that was based on fake money a great chunk of which was in the housing market - my house is worth x more than I paid for it remortgage and buy crap we don't need.
High levels of personal debt remove confidence in the economy hence no spending.
As for job creation I gave one back! They were looking for 4 in my team after I left (skilled maths/IT based roles). If there is no work where you live and work in other places MOVE!!! Get off your arse and go.
As for other areas it was obvious that we needed less Public Sector middle managers and bull s******s and more useful and productive people.
As for job creation I gave one back! They were looking for 4 in my team after I left (skilled maths/IT based roles). If there is no work where you live and work in other places MOVE!!! Get off your arse and go.
By bike?
[i]Recession and job loses,whens it going to end....................[/i]
[b]When you lot start buying British !.[/b]
[i]If there is no work where you live and work in other places MOVE!!! Get off your arse and go.
As for other areas it was obvious that we needed less Public Sector middle managers and bull s******s and more useful and productive people[/i]
[b]THIS ^^^^[/b]
No recession around here.
Everyones out in there new cars,going to the pub or the shops.
Courtesy of Mobility of course !
In my field (geology) there's a good number of senior positions going but nothing to get people on the ladder. I'm very lucky as I got one, but for new starters there's nothing. So while middleagetrackworld will be doing OK, those who need to start their careers are ending up on the minimum wage down in a shop (which is what I did for 7 months) or claiming benefits.
This problem won't go away until we have a government that realises that austerity is not the answer, and injecting money into the system (like the US, where unemployment is falling, have done) for projects and to stimulate spending is the way to get people off benefits and into jobs.
Not very relevant but it made me annoyed so I thought I'd share!
Listening to the radio yesterday made me a bit sad. It was a report on how tough it was on the youth of today to get into work and featured an in depth piece by way of demonstration with a course leader and students in Liverpool on a level 1 BTEC in digital media studies. The course leader was saying it was such a shame very few of her students ever left the course and went on to employment in the profession and she normally recommended they stayed on and got further qualifications (in media) if they couldn't find a job but then admitted that didn't seem to help much either. Then they interviewed a student who said he didn't expect to be able to get a job - there were jobs in Manchester but nothing in Liverpool so he didn't know if he could be bothered any more.
Just struck me as lunacy all around - why have a crappy course in media that there is obviously little call for in terms of preparing kids for the world of work and giving kids false hopes and expectations. Of course it will be full - dicking around with video editing kit sounds cool when you are 17; but sadly work is often not very cool - that's why it's called work not play. And then to have potential work available 35 wholes miles away and not consider moving to be able to start a career.....spanners!
By bike?
Probably better off using a removal company.
So unemployment owes much to the fact that so many silly buggers are now living in the wrong place ?
It seems to me that we could perhaps wipe one million off the unemployment figure if everybody just moved back to where they were living 10 years ago. And they concentrated on not living in the wrong place in the future.
We have people running the country who have never been on a bus,let alone seen one built and probably think that engineering is something poor people do.Theyre totally out of touch with real people just like some of you above.
What absolute tosh. So people who have money are not 'real people' is that what you are saying?
By 'real people' do you mean anyone born with a big chip on their shoulder because they didn't have private education?
Trouble with 'real people' is that if they do have grand ambitions to become the PM, then it's going to be doubly hard for them to convince the public to vote for them if they can barely string together a cohesive sentence 😉
Taking Mr & Mrs T Blair from Islington as examples of real people.....
if I'm not mistaken we spent about 15 years under labour building s*** and that didn't exactly do that much for our current position.
People who had state education can't "string together a cohesive sentence" ?
This place really is a mine of information.
Captain_Crash - Member
If there is no work where you live and work in other places MOVE!!! Get off your arse and go.
Really - there are millions of unemployed - where are these millions of jobs? in jeopardy? Wheres that?
Maybe not millions but they are out there
http://www.nrl.co.uk/index.php/employment/vacancies?view=vacancy&ref=&sortby=&page=1&limit=0
http://www.capitaresourcing.co.uk/nuclear-engineering-jobs
http://www.capitaresourcing.co.uk/water-engineering-jobs
If there is no work where you live and work in other places MOVE!!! Get off your arse and go.
Exactly, couldn't agree more. All the time you hear people whinging about how there are no jobs in their area, yet they stay there and keep claiming the dole regardless? Talk about crazy!!!
That's why these people often complain that all the immigrants have 'stolen' their jobs. No, the immigrants have taken the jobs because they got off their arses and have moved to find work. They also tend to have the motivation to work hard and to turn up on time.
Some of these jobless British think that the lower paid work that immigrants often take is 'beneath them'.
Well firstly surely being on the long term dole is about as low as you'll ever get, and secondly why can't they see that a job - even a menial low paid job can be the first rung on the ladder to bigger and better things.
so, I've responded suggesting that a British based company is creating skilled jobs, mainly through apprenticeships in the UK. For the UK based business.
That's a fact.
Funny how in the world of STW that makes me 'out of touch with the real world'.
That 17 year old apprentice I was chatting to on the bus the other day must have been a figment of my imagination. So too must the 15 year old lad who I talked to about him following his dad into engineering cos its a 'good future'.
I know that times are tough, and I both sympathise and empathise with people who have been or are out of work - but its not all doom and gloom.
Maybe not millions but they are out there
I think most people understand the concept that unemployment doesn't mean that there isn't a single job vacancy in the country.
In the same way that famine isn't caused because there isn't any food at all.
I think most people understand the concept that unemployment doesn't mean that there isn't a single job vacancy in the country.
But this is STW... 🙁
It will end when the big corporations behind most of the media decide its over and start giving out positive news. Its very easy to make the public believe in a down turn, just promote negative stories, most of what you've stated are from newspapers etc. Drive a recession and the rich get richer, shares go down, house prices drop etc etc and those with money buy more at rock bottom prices. Its sad but we are controlled by the media and the huge fingers in all the pies corporations that probably linked with mp's investments, board members etc. This may be a load of bull though
now we got onto housing it would probably help if houses were 30% cheaper (or closer to what they are worth) so that people could afford to buy them
Yay. lets all move to London, where the streets are paved with Louis Vuitton Handbags.
We can take advantage of the extensive high-quality, affordable housing and marvelous infrastructure. What better future could one want for ones offspring than enrolling them in an education system that, by the admission of a certain Mr B Johnson, farts out 25-50% of children lacking basic literacy and numeracy skills.
There are enough homes and infrastructure to support the 2.7 million people who'll be on the next train with their flat caps and whippets in tow?
That 17 year old apprentice I was chatting to on the bus the other day must have been a figment of my imagination. So too must the 15 year old lad who I talked to about him following his dad into engineering cos its a 'good future'.
this is brilliant its the same as people mistaking weather for climate, keep it up chaps its amusing me during my convalescence.
Just heard yesterday that my company has been selected to be part of an exhibition in the Science Museum which celebrates British manufacturing. I am so proud 🙂 Thought I'd post this as a balance to all the negativity. I am a realist and almost certainly biased but I think this country should be proud of its engineering excellence.
[url= http://www.naimaudio.com/news/article/naim-chosen-british-great ]Make it in Great Britain[/url]
Edit: I should add that our company has grown approximately 50% since the start of the recession 🙂
arvensis/Robert peston.... my point is that there is some positivity out there, and a drive in some of our youth to do something constructive.
I'm not commenting on the wider economic climate, just giving an example of growth in one of the areas the OP implies is dying on its arse.
Going back to the OP - much fun as cross border slanging is - there was an interesting statistic behind the unemployment figures yesterday
The figures quoted on Channel 4 news last night, said the number of people who have lost full time jobs, but have only managed to find part time positions to replace them, is 1.4 million 😯
Now this is pure conjecture on my part, but I'd reckon a good proportion of those lost full time positions will be classed as 'skilled'. And I'm also prepared to go out on a limb and suggest that the 1.4 million jobs they've been replaced with, aren't
I've been out of work since last September after being made redundant. I was working in the service industry which was soul destroying anyway. It's been tough watching my savings slowly disappear and having to consider mortgage breaks etc.
It's taken a while but I was offered a job this week for a small, local company as a trainee designer/production operative. I have no educational background in design but the company director saw potential I guess and has given me a great opportunity.
I'm on a high at the moment, especially after having an awful and depressing 6 months of worry and stress.
This post isn't really relevant specifically to the thread but opportunities are out there if you are willing to think out of the box, try something new. In real terms it is difficult but just keep plugging away.
we need a big war (WW3) to break things up a bit that'll stimulate the economy. lots of infrastructure that'll need replacing and rebuilding. It will also keep the population in check
Some technical / creative / knowledge sectors have staffing shortfalls, fact. Reporting that does mean the reporter is out of touch with the dire situation in other sectors.
There are a very few sectors with skills shortages [ I suspect it is because they don’t actually train their own staff anymore and just moan that we should pay for the training] but no one can actually suggest the current situation is anything other than dire overall. A few exemplars of good news cannot negate the fact the overall picture is very bad.
As for other areas it was obvious that we needed less Public Sector middle managers and bull s******s and more useful and productive people
Ah the CMD the private sector will rescue us all retort/act of faith [ going well so far would you say?] ..could you evidence this with respect to unemployment figures ? Have all the unemployed come from the public sector …a polemic view [ entitled to it if you wish] but it ignores the actual facts of the unemployment rate to make a political point.
If there is no work where you live and work in other places MOVE!!! Get off your arse and go.
Is your claim there is enough jobs and housing to go round and if we were all just a little bit more flexible we would have no unemployment?
Do I need to explain why this is complete and utter BS or it not self evidently the case ?
This may be a solution for a few people but it is clearly not a solution for all the millions of unemployed people.
Well firstly surely being on the long term dole is about as low as you'll ever get, and secondly why can't they see that a job - even a menial low paid job can be the first rung on the ladder to bigger and better things.
Really so you can start of working as a production operative for the minimum wage and really the world is your oyster. I cannot believe all the rich people waste their time sending their kids to Eton and to Oxbridge when this is the actual route to success. Perhaps you could tell us what percentage of people doing these jobs end up a "success" and what percentage end up doing that job for the rest of their lives. I am sure the percentage will help illuminate the truth of your polemic.:roll:
I
'm not commenting on the wider economic climate, just giving an example of growth in one of the areas the OP implies is dying on its arse.
Yes one example of one company does not prove growth and the debate is about the wider economy not one person or one company. No one thinks no one has got a job recently but the overall picture is dire by any economic indicator you choose to use
All this talk of doom and gloom, and loosing jobs.... yet half of STW splashed £3k on a bicycle.
well I apologise for sprinkling a tiny bit of positivity on to the thread. Naive? Nope.
Wow thats all a bit depressing...in my out of touch world i set up my own company almost a year ago and employ six people at a pretty good level of technical expertise, pay above average and where possible use local suppliers. All of our income comes from outside the UK so we net contribute. But of course its would have been much easier to stay at my old comfortable job and bitch about the state of the country...
Really so you can start of working as a production operative for the minimum wage and really the world is your oyster. I cannot believe all the rich people waste their time sending their kids to Eton and to Oxbridge when this is the actual route to success.
Much as I also like slagging off people that are richer than me out of pure spitefull jealousy. Oxbridge applications are looked at based on ability not money. Whether the kid had a better head start by going to Eaton first is a different matter. But there's no money involved as ultimately they get the same money whether the undergard pays it or the government does.
I managed to get an offer and I went to a middle of the road comp (well it was a comp, but it wasn't a bad one). And friends who actualy went got wayy more in bursaries/grants etc than people in other uni's, so arguably Oxbridge are doing more for undergraduates from poorer backgrounds than the rest of the system.
Oxbridge [b]has[/b] to offer places to poor people.
Not sure how they class someone as 'poor' though. My wife was offered a place at Cambridge, fully funded, as apparently she was from a poor area and the only one from her college to apply. Her folks live in a nice house, in a [relatively] posh area, and they have a reasonable income between them!
A certain percentage of places have to be offered to 'normal' comprehensive schools, in particular those from 'poor' areas.
Jobs in production control. At Nissan we've been short staffed since I started, going to be down one more once I leave in July 🙂
Oxbridge applications are looked at based on ability not money.
Really? I was under the impression it was based on power. Oxbridge seems to be a wash with money so that's not going to be an overiding factor, connections and who you know is going to swing it more than ability surely? If someone comes from a background of heads of industry/political leaders are you really suggesting their application is assessed purely on ability when being compared to someone like you from a middle of the road comp?
I don't know if I'm being cycnical or you're being naive. Just interested as this was my default opinion!
I'm afraid the recession doesn't appear to be coming to an end anytime soon, entrepreneurship is one of a few things that can prosper in this time. Anyone with a business idea, passion and drive should get started now!!
Oxbridge enteries are dominated by the wealthy, its a pretty daft thing to say its on ability. Its on exam succrss the two are vastly different.
There are thousands of highly paid, highly skilled jobs in the IT sector which are struggling to be filled. My workplace always struggle to get decent UNIX admins, they all seem to be employed at the banks or the big telcos 🙁