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No pension, no worries.
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TheLittlestHoboFree Member
My basic maths went something like this.
I have a pension pot I paid into when I first started work and got a sizeable portion paid by my employer. Think it sits at about £25-30k in the pot.
I then have had no pension since. My wife has one which she also paid into when she started but since the kids came along she has also neglected.
Then this recession hit and all manner of finance went to the wall. People who had saved their entire lives were out of pocket. People who had done everything by the book ended up the worst effected.
Then the government try to force you into these employers pensions where the employer must also contribute a massive 1% (Wow). So this gets everyone back contributing…..to what exactly? Then we get down to calculated figures. The guy who gave a presentation to us basically said that I, having about 30yrs worth of work left in me would have to save £300 per month to get a fund big enough to gurentee £12000 per annum income at 70. So I did a few sums. £300 x 12 = £3600 x 30 = £108000. Now if I get to 70 and feel like blowing £108000 I will not really be that well fixed to spend it tbh. If I live to 80 I will be satisfied and just use the money in the bank, at least I have control. Now the biggie. If I live past 80 I don’t really give a toss. I have paid into the system more than most and I really don’t care if they have to fund wiping my arse at 80 or throw me into an incinerator.
My household has an income above any benefits available so I am not going to be due anything if I become unemployed. I am coming up 40 so I am in that bracket where I will have to provide for myself anyhow when retirement hits at, what is it, 70? I will be mortgage free by the time I am 50 and I intend to use the 50-70yrs to try to back off from working hard and enjoy my bloody life.
Then we bring into the situation that we are also going to be the inheritance generation. My parents, my wifes parents, our aunts and uncles etc etc all own their properties. We will end up with a decent chunk of money for our 50-70yrs.
Finally, my plan. I will enjoy those 50-70yrs. By the age of about 60 I will start to funnel every single penny to my children. My house, my pension pot(What there is of it), my savings. I will basically take an allowance of my well off kids & grandkids. I will go cap in hand to the government to fund a flat for me and the wife (Not that I will live there much as my kids will treat me to lots of holidays). They will regard me as basically penniless and probably reward me with a government benefit of some kind to top up the kind donations from my kids.
My wife works at a solicitors so we are cluing up on what the time scales etc are for doing most of the above legally and if I had any trust issues with the kids having all my money, well tbh I would just give up now and live on the street.
scotroutesFull MemberIt’s not that there will be no state pension, it’s a question of how much it will be. The state pension isn’t sitting in a big pot waiting to be paid out, it’s funded on an ongoing basis by taxpayers. As the number of non-taxpayers (pensioners) increases, there will be less to go around.
Of course, one way out of this is to increase the number of taxpayers. We could, for example, increase the amount of immigration we have.
chunkypaulFree Membercan I ask, why people presume that there will be no state pension in the future?
has this fact ever been published or stated anywhere.i don’t know – but i do LOL when binners ALWAYS comes out with the ‘pensions we’re all DOOMED’ statement on threads such as this….
thats some crystal ball he has…
binnersFull Membercan I ask, why people presume that there will be no state pension in the future?
has this fact ever been published or stated anywhere.Its the elephant in the room. The self-evident truth that dare not speak its name.
Its just a pyramid scheme. And the thing with those is that at some point, they all unravel. That will happen a long time before we reach some hypothetical retirement ‘age’
Tom_W1987Free MemberOf course, one way out of this is to increase the number of taxpayers. We could, for example, increase the amount of immigration we have.
Yeah but that would be the rational thing to do…..can’t have that can we?
molgripsFree MemberMy parents usually take one overseas holiday a year and probably three or four week long breaks around the country. They have a decent house and spend money on updating it now and then. Try that on a state pension.
NB they were never rich, just saved like hell after us kids had left home.
P-JayFree Memberton – Member
can I ask, why people presume that there will be no state pension in the future?
has this fact ever been published or stated anywhere.The Tories have quietly tried to kill it off every time they’re in government – they’ve recently increased the age in which it’s payable – although it’s not been admitted it’s thought that auto-enrolment will one day replace it completely for people under a certain age – but it will never been taken away from people who are already claiming it or even are working now – it’s likely to ensure they’re not blown out of the water next election any party who stop it, will only do so to new people entering the workplace.
yourguitarheroFree MemberWe could just kill all the old people.
Use some kind of neurotoxin in M&S’ beige fabric dye?seosamh77Free Memberbencooper – Member
I’m not overly consider, if i’m starving, I’ve no qualms about stealing shit!
And if you go get caught and sent to prison, then you’re sortedAye, win/win, I’ll probably need some housing as well! 😆
franksinatraFull MemberThen we bring into the situation that we are also going to be the inheritance generation. My parents, my wifes parents, our aunts and uncles etc etc all own their properties. We will end up with a decent chunk of money for our 50-70yrs.
assuming all of that capital isn’t sucked into care costs during the last few years of their life….
binnersFull Memberi don’t know – but i do LOL when binners ALWAYS comes out with the ‘pensions we’re all DOOMED’ statement on threads such as this….
thats some crystal ball he has…
You don’t need a crystal ball, just a grasp of very basic maths.
Anyone imagining a retirement similar to the one 70 year olds are enjoying at present is laughably delusional. You see those foreign holidays, and weekends in the lakes they’re enjoying, and all those nice meals at the golf club? Well we’re all paying for it. And then some!
TheLittlestHoboFree MemberYou also assume they don’t have a similar plan to my own to offload the money over then next decade or so
monkeyfudgerFree MemberI was discussing the “state pension pot” at work today with one of the olds actually, she seemed to believe as she’d paid in all her life she deserved a cushy state pension but wasnt impressed when I suggested as she’s got no kids she’s nothing but a drain on society and come retirement really should kill herself! Teehee!
mudsharkFree MemberYeah but that would be the rational thing to do…..can’t have that can we?
Like any ponzi scheme it’ll only work for so long, then we’re in even more trouble. At the moment immigration works nicely as they mostly nice young types busy working. Then they get old and start costing more. Plus there’s there ever present housing issue to sort out.
ahwilesFree MemberTom_W1987 – Member
Yeah but that would be the rational thing to do…..can’t have that can we?
but it’s not rational, it (immigration) would only serve to hold up the pyramid just. a. bit. longer.
(those hard-working immigrants would then want/need pensions, requiring more immigrants, etc. etc. etc.)
peterfileFree MemberYou don’t need a crystal ball, just a grasp of very basic maths.
My pension % contributions are matched by my employer. Based on current contribution level (ie not taking into account my salary will increase), I should be able to retire at 60 with 50% of my current salary. Obviously that age and % is ball park.
Those maths are basic enough for me to want to contribute.
moshimonsterFree MemberNo meaningful pension for me, but have quite a few assets to hopefully keep me in old age e.g. several houses, decent level of savings, investments etc. I’m just working on the basis of acquiring enough capital along the way to keep me going. It might not be as tax efficient as a pension, but at least I know what I have.
But if I was on a modest wage, living in an average 3 bed semi I’d definitely want a private pension and would be shitting myself at the prospect of old age poverty. I certainly wouldn’t want to be relying on the state to look after me!
binnersFull MemberMy pension % contributions are matched by my employer.
Congratulations! You’re in a privileged but tiny minority
TrimixFree MemberIts quite sad and amazing that people find it so hard to deal with their future when its more than a few years away.
Rather than save up for when they have no job, they find reasons not to save, find reasons to think a Pension is a bad way to save, find reasons not to be able to afford to save. The list goes on and on.
Perhaps young people should spend some time with those who have retired with no savings.
epicsteveFree MemberI only started paying into a pension a year back, and only then because my new employer matches contributions up to 5% of salary. Prior to that I’d been investing in property. My wife has a reasonable pension from her work so I’m hoping we’ll be able to retire well before the state pension kicks in.
binnersFull MemberI should be able to retire at 60 with 50% of my current salary.
Congratulations! You’re in a privileged but tiny minority
PemboFree MemberP-Jay – Member
ton – Member
can I ask, why people presume that there will be no state pension in the future?
has this fact ever been published or stated anywhere.The Tories have quietly tried to kill it off every time they’re in government – they’ve recently increased the age in which it’s payable – although it’s not been admitted it’s thought that auto-enrolment will one day replace it completely for people under a certain age – but it will never been taken away from people who are already claiming it or even are working now – it’s likely to ensure they’re not blown out of the water next election any party who stop it, will only do so to new people entering the workplace.
The previous Labour government implemented a plan to increase the state pension age based on Lord Turner’s work, which the coalition subsequently accelerated. But go ahead, knock yourself out and blame Fatcher.
peterfileFree MemberMy pension % contributions are matched by my employer.
Congratulations! You’re in a privileged but tiny minority
Tiny minority? Really?
75% of FTSE 100 and FTSE 350 companies offer matched contributions.
tonFull MemberPerhaps young people should spend some time with those who have retired with no savings.
my mother had no savings when she got to retirement age.
heck, she even manages a month in spain every winter.TooTallFree MemberNot planning for your own future is either daft, ignorant or arrogant. You know that you will some day stop working. You know how much you earn to keep you to the lifestyle you are currently leading. You know that money someone gives you will stop.
What then?
Are you currently being paid the same as the state pension? Then you might just about break even. If your current pay is more than the state pension, what provision have you made to make up that shortfall?
Nothing?
Oh well.mudsharkFree MemberPrior to that I’d been investing in property
Ooh are you one of those ‘evil’ BTLers?
badnewzFree MemberAs others have said, most people under 40 will be working until they drop.
molgripsFree Membershe even manages a month in spain every winter.
I’d love to see a budget for that. As I’m sure would all the pensioners freezing to death. How do you think she does it and they don’t?
Tom_W1987Free Memberbut it’s not rational, it (immigration) would only serve to hold up the pyramid just. a. bit. longer.
(those hard-working immigrants would then want/need pensions, requiring more immigrants, etc. etc. etc.)Not really, they’d just have to have enough children to replenish the numbers sustainably.
The issue is when you have baby booms followed by massive drops in birthrates.
weeksyFull MemberCongratulations! You’re in a privileged but tiny minority
Mine are doubled by my employer.
tonFull Memberhow many pensioners do you know who have froze to death molgrips?
chunkypaulFree MemberYou don’t need a crystal ball, just a grasp of very basic maths.
you quote no mathematics though…. just DOOM predictions of what WILL happen in the future
we can forecast, but we don’t really know do we? or perhaps the tm’ed binners crystal ball franchise is on a roll…
can i have the winning jackpot numbers for the next euro lottery binners plz? 😆
binnersFull MemberPeterfile – second paragraph of your link
Its FTSE 350 DC pensions survey 2014, which questioned 98 FTSE 100 and 241 FTSE 350 companies, found that 75% of respondents now offer matching contributions. However, while there has been a moderate increase in contribution levels, these have not kept pace with increasing longevity.
Anyone forsee a problem here?
It goes back to the whole ‘basic grasp of maths’ thing, as opposed to any use of crystal balls 😀
molgripsFree Memberhow many pensioners do you know who have froze to death molgrips?
Just the ones I read about in the mail. And, to be fair, lots of other media outlets.
I have known a few pensioners who could in no way afford to go to Spain, and were similarly not profligate with money.
By my reckoning your mum must be living on about £350/mo. Does she own the house she lives in?
mudsharkFree MemberNot really, they’d just have to have enough children to replenish the numbers sustainably.
Is there no max population we have room for?
glasgowdanFree MemberThose who think there will be no state pension in 40 years – can you explain exactly what you think is going to happen? Will the country see a government allowing hundreds of thousands of elderly people starve to death? Will it become the norm? Seriously
Maybe it won’t be called state pension, but there will be a way of people getting by; that’s one thing you can guarantee.
And what about those who are self employed? There’s no benefit in a private pension. I see my strategy as property and savings – own another property or two and take an income from the rent. Already mortgage free and considering the property ladder – scale up while money is coming in to keep the extra cash saved and used on something that’s likely not going to go bust, scale down when it stops to free up cash.
Anyone above bemoaning their public sector or final salary pension – line up for a slap please.
peterfileFree MemberAnyone forsee a problem here?
I see a problem with you stating that employer matched contributions put me in a tiny minority, when I have just demonstrated that I am absolutely not 🙂
moshimonsterFree MemberI will go cap in hand to the government to fund a flat for me and the wife (Not that I will live there much as my kids will treat me to lots of holidays). They will regard me as basically penniless and probably reward me with a government benefit of some kind to top up the kind donations from my kids.
Wow, that’s an extreme way of making sure you get your money’s worth out of the state pension! Not sure if it would actually work as any guaranteed regular income you have from your kid’s trust fund will probably be taken into account. I suspect you really would have to give the money away to them and rely on their goodwill to give you some of it back on the quiet. I’ll ask my wife tonight, she will know. She deals with that sort of thing quite a lot with her accountancy clients.
binnersFull MemberI see a problem with you stating that employer matched contributions put me in a tiny minority, when I have just demonstrated that I am absolutely not
You think the majority of people nowadays work in permanent jobs for FTSE 100 companies?
Anyway… that wasn’t really the point i was making. If they’re the very best pension schemes, and they’re predicting shortfalls, in a situation we all know is only going to get progressively worse, year on year …. how long before the whole house of cards comes falling in?
Like I said…. maths
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