New MTB Santa Cruz Vs Canyon

Hello,

I am looking at replacing my Whyte 901 Hardtail with my first full suspension bike.

I mainly ride around Innerleithen and Glentress and the odd bit of hill riding over the odd munro if I am felling fit..
Not interested in doing downhill routes.
One thing I do not want to loose going full suspension is climbing ability, I love nothing more than powering it to the top, which is easy going on the 901 currently.

The contenders are:

– Canyon Spectral CF 9.0
Love the look of this bike has far better spec for the money compared to the Santa Cruz options.
Demoing one of these seams to be a bit of no go around were I live, as if spending this much money I really want to try before I buy.
Suspensions wise is this too much travel for me needs, seams that the fashion now is to have lot of travel for trails bike.

– Santa Cruz Bronson S kit
Again am I over biking my self with this one.

– Santa Cruz 5010 S kit
This is the one that I think fit the bill best with my style of riding, though some of the spec is not as good as the Canyon for the price point of 5K almost.
With the new 140 front travel think this would fit the bill perfect for my needs.

Would like some help between my choices from people that have been in similar position and what they went for in the end.

Cheers

Why have you limited yourself to those two brands?

Also it sounds like you really want something with shorter travel

Not interested in doing downhill routes.
One thing I do not want to loose going full suspension is climbing ability, I love nothing more than powering it to the top, which is easy going on the 901 currently.

Sounds like something like a YT Izzo, a Whyte T130 or Transition Spur might be a better fit

Yeah shorter travel bike for sure, why limit to 27.5 wheels too? 29ers are great these days! Something like a Whyte S120 would be a good bet if you’re keen on value, a bit weighty but solid, my T130 has been a dream over the last 4 years. I do have a Spur (one of the bikes mentioned above) on order though and while I’ve yet to ride one, it is way, way lighter than the Whyte on paper and the geo is very similar. Stock on them is crazy at the minute, for a newly released bike there are very few around, I’ve had my pre-order in since before the official launch and even that is now not due to September/October last I heard… S120 would be a solid bet all the same, it’s a real cracker. I would have likely gone for one, but I was just too wooed by the Spur to say no!

Not interested in doing downhill routes.
One thing I do not want to loose going full suspension is climbing ability, I love nothing more than powering it to the top

Your real name is Opposite Man and this thread is a hoax.

You’ve picked a direct sales value brand against a high end premium band with nowt inbetween. So the obvious point is that the Canyon will be far better value for money. I think you need a wider list to start from and then narrow it down based on what you want and can afford. If you did this there is no way you’d end up with the two you’ve chosen.

You can’t demo a Canyon but you can return one if you don’t like it. They will send a courier to collect it. Whilst I wouldn’t buy one simply to give it a test ride, if you really like the specs then you can usually buy one with the confidence that it can be sent back.

Despite the travel the geometry is pretty conservative and I would say it is closer to being a trail bike than an enduro bike. I use it for plenty of XC stuff, often over my hardtail, and while it’s obviously not the perfect choice I still have a lot of fun. I only have my hardtail to compare it to but steady pedalling feels very efficient, you start to notice pedal bob when you are really cranking it.

Personally I don’t put much value into the perks of buying a Santa Cruz (reputation, customer service etc.) but I know others do which can make paying the premium worth it. If you are just concerned about specs then YT/Canyon etc. are a no brainer.

Wouldn’t the Tallboy be the most suitable Santa Cruz ?

I wouldn’t count Santa Cruz as a premium brand any more. They are a department within pon one of the largest bike companies in the world and their frames are mass produced in the Far East like everyone else’s. They aren’t even in the low volume boutique space either

I wouldn’t count Santa Cruz as a premium brand any more.

If they charge a premium (which they do) then they are a premium brand.

Doesn’t mean the products are automatically superior to cheaper brands though.

Anyway, I’m a plus one for a short-travel 29er – but make sure it pedals well.

The YT Izzo is a decent suggestion.

Despite the travel the geometry is pretty conservative and I would say it is closer to being a trail bike than an enduro bike.

Are you talking about the new Spectral? Because at 160mm and pretty slack angles it’s fairly Enduro-y for a trail bike.

seams that the fashion now is to have lot of travel for trails bike.

Au contraire, in the last 6months or so, brands seem to be pushing ‘downcountry’ bikes which is probably what you want I’d have thought? I’m not sure what the official definition is, but you’re looking at perhaps 120-130mm travel, light weight, but progressive geometry.

From what you’ve said you enjoy, I’d guess you’ll have more fun on that sort of machine than anything with 160mm travel.

Discounted the whyte T-130 due to none being in stock or to get test ride either anytime soon, I suspect they will be bring new ones out soon too, as I remember before they came in October time last year.

YT Izzo will look it up.

What are peoples actual long term findings of Canyon or YT bikes and how do bike shops take to them getting them repaired or serviced and warranty claims?
As this one the key things I value on bike of this value long term.

I wouldn’t count Santa Cruz as a premium brand any more. They are a department within pon one of the largest bike companies in the world and their frames are mass produced in the Far East like everyone else’s. They aren’t even in the low volume boutique space either

None of this affects if it is a premium brand or not.

how do bike shops take to them getting them repaired or serviced and warranty claims

Repairs and servicing will be welcomed by pretty much all shops, because you’ll be paying. If they are busy, you might go to the back of the queue though…

Warranty won’t be handled by your LBS…

Don’t get why SC is loved/hated in equal measure. I don’t have one, but I am thinking about a Hightower to replace my Smuggler – looks bob on to me.

Are you talking about the new Spectral? Because at 160mm and pretty slack angles it’s fairly Enduro-y for a trail bike.

The lines are definitely blurred. I’m no geometry wizard but I thought the 66 head angle is closer to trail territory and the wheelbase doesn’t feel too huge for an enduro. Anyway I’m not one to get hung up on these classifications, they clearly market it for both.

What are peoples actual long term findings of Canyon or YT bikes and how do bike shops take to them getting them repaired or serviced and warranty claims?

I’ve never needed to use Canyon warranty but I spend some time on the Facebook page and get an idea. They seem to be pretty reasonable with agreeing to send replacement parts, however there is the odd story of it taking 3 months to receive the replacement. I think it’s normally 3-4 weeks but I would have a second bike at hand just in case. Sometimes they offer to pay a LBS for a full refit on a new frame, other times not. I think it’s email/live chat only.

I’ve ridden several Santa Cruz models, the Spectral and the Strive.

If it was my money, given your riding preferences, I would be seriously considering the Strive. It is an incredibly capable bike and the Shapeshifter tech makes a very noticeable difference to climbing ability. You can buy a complete bike with Lyrik forks for the price of a Santa Cruz frame. I was talking with a very well respected journo from another mag at a press launch and he too was very impressed by the Strive as a climbing bike. Quite simply, I found it to be a very fun bike that was as much at home on XC trails as on big mountain rides. I would not get hung up on travel. As a bike for everything, I found it fitted the bill really well.

I’ve owned 3 Santa Cruz’s in the past but would opt for the Canyon option every day of the week. I’m not just saying this because I have done sponsored articles with Canyon. I have no skin in the game here. The bikes I have tried from them have all been excellent. A wee link to a piece I wrote last year.

https://singletrackworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/there-and-back-again-putting-the-mountains-back-into-mountain-biking/

Hope this helps?

Cheers

Sanny

Love my v2 5010 and have ridden it everywhere over the past 4 years, but wouldn’t say it’s a climbers bike. It’s more of an over sized bmx. New version might climb better, but of the current Santa Cruz range I’d be looking at the Tallboy for what you’ve said your looking for.
Even as a very happy owner I’m not sure I could stomach the current pricing though.

I’m not just saying this because I have done sponsored articles with Canyon. I have no skin in the game here.

Maybe, maybe not.

I love my Canyon Strive. Best bike I’ve ever had, and it was great value (perhaps better when I bought it, in 2015, than now, though). But it was a PITA to speak to Canyon. My shapeshifter broke, like everyone’s did, and I couldn’t get spare parts for months. Fortunately I could fit it myself when it finally arrived, but that was a full strip down of the rear sus linkage which a lot of people won’t want to do. And the replacement didn’t fix the issue fully anyway. Having said that, I recently ordered some spare frame parts (to have another (successful!) stab at fixing the shapeshifter, as it happens). The spares were very reasonably priced (custom forged replacement linkage – under a tenner!) and came quickly.

I’d buy another for sure (I’m tempted by the new Strive) but I might not recommend to a less mechanically minded newbie, for example. If something goes wrong the support might be difficult. It’s just the nature of direct sales. Fine for the most part, but not if you have an issue.

Shirley the Neuron would meet the brief better?

I think the Canyon (or YT and other direct brands) vs Santa Cruz (and other premium brands) debate boils down to the question of what you can afford to spend.  If you can afford to pay more for a bike with a similar spec (ie money is not an issue), then buy the bike you like/want regardless of the brand (of course based on a test tide if possible).  If you want bang for buck, then direct sale brands are hard to beat.  If you want an SC don’t be put off by people that (having often never ridden one, and even more likely not one of the newer platformed bikes) telling you not to just because they are comparatively expensive they make great bikes which are exceptionally well finished, with a good dealer network and warrantee to back it up.

I ride a current model SC as have built the bike over time based on what I can afford after coming across a brand new C level frame.  It still wears a few parts off another (Alu) SC bike I bought s/h off here a couple of years ago, plus some parts scoured off the s/h market or on sale.  I now have the bike I wanted with far better spec than what is available off the shelf and it rides like a dream.  It’s a Bronson and FWIW I think you’re right in terms of it being too much bike for your needs (it’s no slouch on the ups but it’s not a whippet).  As posted about I’d be looking at the Tallboy (especially with the 5010 looking like it is being aimed more at the rowdy ‘downcountry’ crowd).

If I was buying new off the shelf with my current budget I’d find it hard to buy the SC at full RRP (I’d want at least the mid range S spec).  In this case I’d be looking at Canyon or a more ‘value’ shop based brand like Orbea who make some great bikes (the Occam is another one to add to your list).

Thanks everyone for your input and suggestions.

I’ve got a demo booked for 5010 so will take it from there, I suspect I will be opening my wallet after the demo…
Have watched a lot of videos on the new 5010 and seams to be ticking all the boxes.

With regards to direct bike sales vs shop, for me it comes down to the back up if neededed repairs / warranty work done this adds value to it over ownership not just the initial cost savings when buying the bike. Though I am pretty sure most bike shops would carry out repairs regardless, as someone has already mentioned you’re paying at the end of the day for it to be repaired.
The other one is demoing these bikes is no go unless you live near the factory or a demo event which isn’t happening any time soon unfortunately.

After thinking about it more and more the Canyon Spectral CFR 9.0 was going to be to much travel bike for my style of ridding and routes I ride.
Did look at the Canyon Neuron and the YT Izzo though 29″ wheels are not for me especially on tight trails I feel I would be at a disadvantage there and what I have seen about these on reviews online and talking to people about them.
Might be as well I am used to the 27.5 wheels of my Whyte so don’t want to go any bigger just yet…

If 27.5″ is a definite then something like the 5010 will be pretty much up around the top of the bikes in that travel, for all the complaints about cost and so on, they do seem to back up their product over its lifetime and quick turnarounds compared to others, if i was looking for something in this mould i’d probably look at trying a nukeproof reactor, as they are seriously nice and just work, like all nukeproofs.