motorbike (mk2 – vintage, small) – should I?

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When I bought my first bike (a CG125 as it happens), training consisted of the guy at the shop showing me all the buttons, kick-starting it, then walking back into the shop to leave me to find my way home.

Btw our lass did cbt for 100 including bike hire then had two confidence lesson at an hour a piece for 25 quid each and felt much better for it

Yup, first time i rode a motorbike was just after I bought one. It was only kh100, but still a steep learning curve

druidh – Member
When I bought my first bike (a CG125 as it happens), training consisted of the guy at the shop showing me all the buttons, kick-starting it, then walking back into the shop to leave me to find my way home.

Same for my mum with her first Mini in the 50s…

GET MORE TRAINING THAN JUST A CBT BEFORE YOU HIT THE ROADS – OR YOU WILL HIT THE ROADS – FACE FIRST

What crap. I didn’t even do a CBT, nor did anyone from my generation, so you certainly didn’t either. None of us died.*

* Well, none of my friends died.

Get an eighties single cylinder, like say an Yamaha SRX 250, 400 or 600cc

Bow to such wisdom….

5th – personally I broke a collar bone and mashed an ankle – and the roads are rather busier than they were back then. The stats for new riders dying back then made nasty reading hence the CBT and I believe more than CBT training even if just a couple of hours makes a deal of sense

The CBT training is worthwhile but the difference is that Al already has road sense through cycling and driving a car + the older you get, the less immortal you feel.

Crucially, given the bikes he’s looking at, he’s not a Rossi wannabee and is definitely not out to impress the laydeez 😉

here you go
try this
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/YAMAHA-SRX-400-/140569610649?pt=UK_Motorcycles&hash=item20ba9a0999

The CBT training is worthwhile but the difference is that Al already has road sense through cycling and driving a car + the older you get, the less immortal you feel.

^ This.

A 16 year old on a FS1E doesn’t compare to an, err, mature gentleman who has driven cars and bicycles longer than a 16 year old has been alive. That’s worth more than any amount of training.

Oddly, I can’t think of anyone I knew get more than a grazed knee. There were a lot of idiotic near death experiences though.

Don’t buy the SRX in the link, it’s the pansy one, with electric starter, rugged and ragged men like you use the kick start one 😀

I had a KLR600 kick back once, it actual ripped a MX boot sole to ankle. A KTM495 kicked back and nearly sent me over the handle bars. I thought it broke my foot (for days). The same bike also coughed, spluttered and set of backwards… the joy of old 2-strokes.

TandemJeremy – Member
5th – personally I broke a collar bone and mashed an ankle – and the roads are rather busier than they were back then. The stats for new riders dying back then made nasty reading hence the CBT and I believe more than CBT training even if just a couple of hours makes a deal of sense

Ah, so you meant…

GET MORE TRAINING THAN JUST A CBT BEFORE YOU HIT THE ROADS – OR YOU WILL COS I HIT THE ROADS – FACE FIRST

😛

Get a vespa. Stick a 200cc kit on it 🙂

No Al – I meant I think you would be stupid to ride a motorcycle on the roads without getting some professional training – a CBT is not enough.

Still – it was clear from the first you were not interested in any advice that didn’t agree with your preconceptions.

Still – I only have hundreds of thousands of miles over decades on motorcycles – what do I know.

No doubt you know lots TJ, the difficulty is in separating that from the stuff you just make up

Still – I only have hundreds of thousands of miles over decades on motorcycles – what do I know.

But… even as a spotty yoof with no experience you failed to kill yourself.

Actually, as much as I hate training of any type, learning is better than training, but…

…a day at the Yamaha MX School is a good way to have some fun and actually learn something. A car driver trundling around on the road being ‘trained’ to ride a motorbike on the road will learn nothing they don’t already know and they certainly won’t be controlling slides by the end of the day (unlike an MX day).

TJ, get over it. I’ve heeded plenty of advice on this thread.

Of course you have lots of experience, but is yours the only voice I should listen to?

Particularly in the light of the numerous points we disagree on? And the numerous other people on here who disagree with you?

GET MORE TRAINING THAN JUST A CBT BEFORE YOU HIT THE ROADS – OR YOU WILL HIT THE ROADS – FACE FIRST

Only if you’re not wearing a helmet

If you listen to the advice from people who actually ride bikes you will enjoy it more and you will be safer.

But no – you will discard any advice you don’t agree with. Most of the experienced motorcyclists here are singing from a similar song book.

🙄 get over it.

We didn’t have training in my day – just rolled up for the test after surviving self teaching.

Absolutely the best training I did for riding a motorbike on the road was thrashing one around a muddy field. Learned (without realising it) how to handle diverse things like front end slides, how to hold a rear wheel slide, recover from locked wheels, control after hitting something etc. In other words, just went loony on a soft surface.

IMO if you already ride a bike on the road you already have the important skill, that of avoiding the swine out to kill you. 🙂 And if you have driven a car, you understand little things like clutch, gears, and throttle – all you need is to adapt existing skills.

Muddy field highly recommended.

Motorbikes do bite though. I lost 3 friends on successive weekends, and have several who crippled themselves by too much hero stuff.

Ta epi….I’m still curious as to whether bigger bikes are safer solely due to the better brakes or is there another reason?

Learned (without realising it) how to handle diverse things like front end slides, how to hold a rear wheel slide, recover from locked wheels, control after hitting something etc

none of which is as important as planning your views, avoiding nutters and anticipation.

I wouldnt have liked to ride after just having done a CBT, I mean the other bloke doing it when I did it went trough a red light and still passed.

still curious as to whether bigger bikes are safer solely due to the better brakes or is there another reason?

on a little motorbike everyone will want to race you away from the lights, then cut you up when the road narrows, on a bigger bike they still want to race but cannot get close enough from 0-30 or 40 so its not a problem, on smaller bikes you will be ragging it to make 60mph and will have nothing in reserve if you need it, if your not doing 60mph people will be barging past.

Ah OK ta.

anagallis_arvensis – Member
none of which is as important as planning your views, avoiding nutters and anticipation.

An experienced cyclist already has those skills, or he’s pushing a wheelchair. The most important skills after that are the bike control skills. Best learned offroad IMO.

cynic-al – Member
…I’m still curious as to whether bigger bikes are safer solely due to the better brakes or is there another reason?

Brakes and suspension.

The ratio of sprung to unsprung weight is one of the critical factors in making suspension work properly.

A small bike does not have much weight, so getting the unsprung weight to an optimum amount is difficult. It can be achieved by a bigger spend on the unsprung components or by having a highly sophisticated damping system. That is unlikely to happen on commuter style bikes.

A fat lardy rider can improve this ratio. In fact some bikes have suspension so woeful that the riders have to pack on great big beerguts to make the suspension work – check out any Harley-Davidson rally. 😆

It is easier to get a decent ratio on a bigger bike because the suspension can still be reasonably basic, but because there is a better sprung/unsprung ratio, it will work ok.

My opinion is probably out of date, but I used to reckon on about 320lbs as about right for a single cylinder bike.

The best suspension in small bikes is usually found on trail bikes.

Actually apart from race replicas, that is probably across the board.

For example, I had one of the first Ducati Monsters in Oz (right after Barry Sheene who got the very first 🙂 ) and while it was a great bike, I was much faster on tight rough winding roads on my Suzuki DR650SE trail bike because it could cope with the frequent potholes and corrugations on corners much better.

Mass too… helps with wind buffeting and stability in general.

An experienced cyclist already has those skills, or he’s pushing a wheelchair.

not true, the use of the road is completely different on a motorbike

not true, the use of the road is completely different on a motorbike

Slightly different.* Not completely.

The main difference is attitude. Things like “it’s my right of way” and “they’re supposed to look” don’t apply to motorcyclists. Don’t apply to cyclist either but it’s amazing how many people insist on trusting other people with their lives.

*EDIT: assuming he’s a car driver too!

anagallis_arvensis – Member
‘An experienced cyclist already has those skills, or he’s pushing a wheelchair.’
not true, the use of the road is completely different on a motorbike

Of course it is different, however it’s a translatable skill, but if you haven’t learned to keep/regain control of your motorbike in extremis you’re at higher risk.

anagallis_arvensis – Member

“An experienced cyclist already has those skills, or he’s pushing a wheelchair.”

not true, the use of the road is completely different on a motorbike

I’m in the “very different” camp. road position is different to both cars an cycles, cornering lines are different. Braking technique is different. There is even a deal of dispute that the road positioning taught for CBT is not what you should be adopting after CBT.

A couple of hours over and above CBT would be well worth doing IMO – apart from anything else it would improve enjoyment

TandemJeremy – Member
…A couple of hours over and above CBT would be well worth doing IMO – apart from anything else it would improve enjoyment

A couple of hours? – don’t be stingy 🙂

A whole day in a muddy field will teach you things you’ll take years to learn (painfully) on the road.

A lot to be said for muddy fields. 🙂

Trouble is you immediately realise how tedious road bikes are and the next thing you know you’re racing enduro and/or MX. 😉

Well i do disagree with TJ most of the time, but not when it comes to riding motorcycle, you may not like him al, but I would take his advice very seriously, riding a bike is not cycling.
Cornering is different, road position is different, speed is differnet and so on and so on.

if you haven’t learned to keep/regain control of your motorbike in extremis you’re at higher risk.

your much better off learning to avoid those situations as much as possible first IMO

I don’t dislike TJ and I am not ignoring all his advice – but he’s not the only person I am listening to on here, and I want to learn stuff myself rather than be told what to do by experts.

Making (minor) mistakes – like buying a 125 then perhaps thinking it’s not fast enough and selling it – is how one learns, no?

I stayed clear of motorbikes (I don’t drive cars) until my early 30’s.
I bought a 125 in the summer and moved to Wales with it in the autumn.
My little CG125 did 12000 miles from June until the following easter when I got a full licence.I was doing stupid trips from Swansea to MK and back each weekend(400 odd miles)

It was a horrible winter and a horrible journey on that little bike but I glad I put the miles in on a little bike and took the little spills at lower speeds.A bigger bike straight off and I don’t think I would have made it as far as the bridge.

Now go book your CBT and have some fun 😀

Whatever you choose enjoy the freedom and huge smile it will bring!

My little CG125 did 12000 miles from June until the following easter when I got a full licence.I was doing stupid trips from Swansea to MK and back each weekend(400 odd miles)

I did the same kind of stuff, admittedly I was 17, but it was great.

An even more barking journey on a small bike… Sydney to London on a step-through