Living beyond your means…

It is just me, or has this thread become the same argument we had about a week ago?

We do the same thread once a quarter, there are some T&C’s in STW that state “a thread on debt and how people spend thier hard earned cash must be raised every 12weeks”

I think a newbie is next in line for the post Xmas “I’ve spent me cash, and in loads of debt how the berjingus do I get out of this hole?” Thread..

🤣

Or it could be you?

😜👍

Wow.  I am 50 and have only ever owned 2 cars that were under £800,

I think they were talking per MONTH. Which is completely bonkers.

Depends how you factor the car cost.

Lets say for arguments sake they’ve gone newish.

£300 a month

Insurance at £60 a month

Tax at £30 a month

Petrol at £200 a month

Upkeep/servicing/tyres at £75 a month

We’re up to £650 a month for just a decent newish car doing 75 miles a day and upkeep etc….

I took loads of measures to reduce bills within the last year – but using Sky as an example – TV went down from £84 a month to £44.   With no changes I saw yesterday the monthly DD is now at £58.99.   Wtf.

Freview/Netflix £7

I think they were talking per MONTH. Which is completely bonkers.

I know Bikebuoy was but thought Rusty Spanner was talking about outright cost of the car.  If not then I have never owned a car that cost £800 a month and can’t imagine I ever would as even though I like cars they are not worth paying £800 a month for.

I know Bikebuoy was but thought Rusty Spanner was talking about outright cost of the car.

I was.

I’ve only owned 2 cars that cost more outright than BB’s monthly payments.

It’s not ‘all relative’. That just absolutely boils my piss.

The £800 per month for cars is ridiculous. Completely unnecessary.

The £1000 per month for schools is a choice, if you can’t afford don’t do it.

From what people have said about their actual expenses, it appears that a typical family, even outside of the South East needs an income of about £40k gross to cover basic expenses.

Mortgage £1,200.00 (£200k house)
Council Tax £150.00
Car £600.00
Heat and Light £150.00
Phones/BB/TV £60.00
Food £400.00
Water £30.00
Home insurance £20.00
Life insurance £30.00
£2,640.00

That’s without any property maintenance, appliance repair, etc.

Mortgage £1,200.00 (£200k house)
Council Tax £150.00
Car £600.00
Heat and Light £150.00
Phones/BB/TV £60.00
Food £400.00
Water £30.00
Home insurance £20.00
Life insurance £30.00
£2,640.00

Much off those costs seem reasonable apart from (as you state it’s a family) the cost of clubs (we pay quite a lot on these as our girls both do lots of musical activities, one does horse riding and they both do athletics/swimming/gymnastics too – although I accept these are all optional), the water cost seems low (we pay more than double that for a family of four), savings accounts for further education (we save £200 a month for our two girls), we also pay £70 combined a month on eye care (contacts) and dental health plans. Fortunately we don’t have much in the way of car costs as the car is paid for (and old and knackered) so that only costs about £100 a month to tax, insure and run.

the water cost seems low (we pay more than double that for a family of four)

varies massively depending on what water authority you live in.

Fortunately we don’t have much in the way of car costs as the car is paid for

I don’t either but from other threads on here, a lot of people seem to think a new (<5 year old) car is an absolute necessity. Just have a look at the car lease threads.

varies massively depending on what water authority you live in.

Yeah it probably does – but over 100%????

The £800 per month for cars is ridiculous. Completely unnecessary.

Extreme bangernomics? you could buy a new car (with a tank of fuel) every month, drive it until the fuel ran out, or something fell off it, and then just get another one and sell the last one, and probably make most of your money back.

“Extreme bangernomics? you could buy a new car (with a tank of fuel) every month, drive it until the fuel ran out, or something fell off it, and then just get another one and sell the last one, and probably make most of your money back.”

is that before or after a few days of missed work due to broken down car at the side of the B966 ?

Yeah it probably does – but over 100%????

Not a complete list as my water company isn’t on it….

Average yearly water bills by company:

South West Water: £943
Wessex Water: £728
Southern Water: £673
United Utilities: £652
Dwr Cymru Welsh Water: £636
Anglian Water: £619
Scottish Water: £600
Northern Ireland Water: £596
Yorkshire Water: £562
Northumberland Water: £539
Severn Trent: £502
Thames Water: £440

My £800 for the car included Tax/Ins and running costs and the car loan/pcp or however you fund it.

And as said it could be one or two cars for the family.

For what it’s worth my car doesn’t cost me £800 pcm to run.

And again, my figures quotes are straw man and not relative to me or my situation.

Fairly on point though.

My £800 for the car included Tax/Ins and running costs and the car loan/pcp or however you fund it.

And as said it could be one or two cars for the family.

1 or 2 cars doesn’t really matter.

£800 per month on cars is an extravagance by any means.

South West Water: £943
Wessex Water: £728
Southern Water: £673
United Utilities: £652
Dwr Cymru Welsh Water: £636
Anglian Water: £619
Scottish Water: £600
Northern Ireland Water: £596
Yorkshire Water: £562
Northumberland Water: £539
Severn Trent: £502
Thames Water: £440

Crikey – so my supplier (Yorkshire Water) is one of the cheaper suppliers too!

CBA.

£800 per month on cars is an extravagance by any means.

When you write it down as a cold, hard number, it sounds like a hell of a lot of money.

But when you cost up the ‘average’ cost of ownership (truely factoring in everything) on a run of the mill £7k car, which your average family has borrowed money to buy you are on the wrong side of £500.

Even if they pay for it outright, it’s easily north of £300. Scary really.

A family of 4, running a second hand Ford Focus & a second hand SMax with a bit of finance would be well over £800 a month in true cost. Not what most people would call ‘extravagant’ – that’s just normal for a lot of people (equally I appreciate it’s totally unattainable for some too).

But then there are also places in the UK where you can buy a couple of houses for the same price as the aforementioned run of the mill cars.

But when you cost up the ‘average’ cost of ownership (truely factoring in everything) on a run of the mill £7k car, which your average family has borrowed money to buy you are on the wrong side of £500.

Not sure where you are getting such high numbers from?

I have a s/h Lexus I paid about £6500 for 5 years ago. Not really “run of mill” but so far very reliable and has needed little maintenance. Maybe I have been lucky?

Annual costs are about £3000 per year, £250 per month.

Depreciation £700
Tax £180
Fuel £1,500
Insurance £250
Maintenace £350
£2,980

the water cost seems low (we pay more than double that for a family of four

We have a water meter, currently below average for a family of 4 in London paying £194 a year.  It surprised me too.

Which is why the financial and philosophical divide displayed so eloquently on here is  unhealthy for all of us.

My car is borked again. It’s Christmas. If I can’t drive I’ll be kicked off my course and lose my job. I can’t sleep because of this, which is affecting my mental health and performance at work, my relationships, my whole life.

I’ve never claimed a penny and owe nothing.

There are so many people worse off than me and I’ve always fought and voted for equality of opportunity.

Hearing some of the attitudes displayed by people I respect undermines my faith in humanity.

Society is finished. Compassion is a luxury. Minds are closed and lines are drawn.

Put Thatcher on the £50.00 note and admit that the evil bitch has succeeded in engineering the social divide she always wanted along with eliminating the best, most worthy aspects of our nature.

Bollocks to it.

I blame the motor car and the British love affair with it.

is that before or after a few days of missed work due to broken down car at the side of the B966 ?

I see you’ve taken my tongue in cheek comment seriously, oops

But for those who’s only option is actual bangernomics breakdowns are a genuine fear, and buying or leasing a more reliable car isn;t always an option. Back in my first job that required me to commute by car I had a crap car (bought for £300 outright) because that’s all I could afford, yes breakdowns were a risk, but even paying £100 a month on a loan/pcp/whatever to have a more reliable car simply wasn’t an option as at the end of each month was lucky not to be overdrawn let alone having ‘spare’ money for a more reliable car.

Eventually I got a job within walking distance which solved that problem, not always an option for people though so when you’re stuck between the rock of having a crap car and a risk of breakdowns, vs the hard place of not having the car at all, you’ll often have to take the rock.

My extreme bangernomics comment was just pointing out the extreme juxtaposition of paying, per month, what a lot people pay outright for their cars.

Not sure where you are getting such high numbers from?

I have a s/h Lexus I paid about £6500 for 5 years ago. Not really “run of mill” but so far very reliable and has needed little maintenance. Maybe I have been lucky?

Annual costs are about £3000 per year, £250 per month.

Depreciation £700
Tax £180
Fuel £1,500
Insurance £250
Maintenace £350
£2,980

You selectively only picked part of my post, if you read it all, I said average family probably financing the car at £200 a month. I’ve also included some breakdown insurance, and a little more on emergency maintenance. Based on 12k miles a year doing 45mpg. Excluding finance, assuming ownership for 4 years & it being worth £3k at the end, it’s £333 a month excluding the finance. £500+ with the loan, a month, without really considering it.

Your costs are obviously lower as you have (had) the luxury of being able to pay for it outright. It’s pretty obvious even in this thread not everyone is in the position to be able to do that. The majority of people will be financing a car in one way, shape or form.

1 or 2 cars doesn’t really matter.

£800 per month on cars is an extravagance by any means.

By whose standards ? Yours ?

I think you’re gonna find that that opinion is in the minority 🤡

As someone who’s views I genuinely look forward to reading, your inability to see other’s point of view is the most depressing thing I’ve read on here in ages.

Thanks, I’ll rein it in.

Didnt mean to offend.

By whose standards ? Yours ?

I think you’re gonna find that that opinion is in the minority

So spunking the best part of £10k a year on a car is considered normal?

That’s £14k gross if your a higher band tax payer.

Non taken. 🙂

Next time you’re up in Harrogate, pop over to Burnley and I’ll buy you a pint. Always good to meet decent people.

Right – sod all this theoretical stuff for a minute – Rusty, what can we do to help?

Indeed, but i’m only pointing out what others actually do in my world.

Anyway, sometimes I get carried away and this looks to be one of those moments where my fingers tap faster than my brain and i’m pissing people off.

That (surprisingly to some) isn’t in my nature, so…

Sorry if this whole topic has pissed forum members off, I certainly didn’t mean to do that just wanted to point out how some other segments of society view income and spending.

I’ve stepped too far over that demarcation line and I apologise for my attitude on this topic.

I will, in future, not comment or get involved in Money threads from now on.

Just keep on being yourself Ed 🙂.

Just having a bad day – I’m supposed to be revising today, but it’s probably time for a bike ride.

Give us a shout if you fancy a pint over New Year.

And it’s an open invitation – we’re usually in the Bay Horse in Roughlee for Britain’s best pub quiz on a Tuesday.

ok will see what we can do !

Honestly, we’re fine. Off for guitar lesson tonight with a mate, it’s brilliant. 🙂

Be great to see you though – you Hit the Northing next year?

Couldn’t make the December date (is it still going ahead?) but proper looking forward to next year. The beard is now Biblical. ☺

bikebuoy I have to say I get v confused as you do come across as a decent person and original thinker….then you come out with stuff like this.

I get that it’s “normal” for some (including a sibling of mine) but for those of us who live or work with those who live at the other end of the income spectrum, so what?

Anyone who can afford that is incredibly privileged, and to not see it is utterly depressing. See also comments re Thatcher.

bikebouy reported for breaking STW rules by actually apologising for something and admitting he may have taken things too far.

WTF were you thinking man?

And it’s an open invitation

This could go horribly wrong – mass STW NYE party at Rusty’s everyone – yay!!  #Twatter #Faceplant

Another individual I’d genuinely love to meet. 🙂

None of us come over well on here.

What’s up with the car Rusty?  Might be able to help remotely or put something together maybe.