Legal advice please – cancelling a new car dispute

martinhutch – Member
Obviously. But if that had happened there would have been no transaction because Ling obviously wouldn’t take on a higher risk customer at the same monthly fee as a low risk customer.
It’s not her risk, she’s simply helping to set up the finance application and car supply. The only risk to her is if it could be shown that her team knew the exact nature of the arrangement (which would clearly be regarded as fronting by the finance co.) but somehow failed to pass it on or advise the customer to bugger off at that stage. The finance companies would be raising an eyebrow at that.

As I put in my last sensible post, she does bear an element of risk due to proposing a defaulting client. It’s not her job to tell clients no, but continued poor proposals are punished by the finance company through increased rates for all further proposals, good or bad.

Ling makes a big point of working on ‘Trust’, finance companies work in a similar way, though it often appears otherwise from outside.

I was very careful with my wording….

Why? Not like anyone adheres to the written word anymore.

Get you trying to feign disinterest and then repeating back exactly what happened!

Damn, I’ve been rumbled.

I’m only here wasting time until someone else replies to the pumpkin thread.

As I put in my last sensible post, she does bear an element of risk due to proposing a defaulting client. It’s not her job to tell clients no, but continued poor proposals are punished by the finance company through increased rates for all further proposals, good or bad.

This.

The OP has zero chance of arguing in court that Ling was involved in the “fronting”. What jury is going to believe that a total stranger went to a random car lease firm and convinced them to commit a fraud on their behalf.

So Mick should have applied for the finance with Simon as a guarantor right??

Car leasing for dummies:

Mick owns a three legged donkey.
Ling owns a racecourse.
You are the punter.

Mick puts his donkey in the stalls.
Ling waves the start flag.

Did you bet on that bollocks donkey to win? Maybe, if you didn’t study its form. Then you’d be pissed off and not visit that shitty racetrack again. So you study the form and back another horse that may win. You make a mental note that some of the horses here look dodgy and remember to take care next time. Ling doesn’t want that, she wants a premium racetrack with good fast horses and punters who wear hats.

That’s why she’s uppity, Mick doesn’t have a hat on.

That’s the worst analogy I’ve ever read. Nice one.

crosshair – Member

So Mick should have applied for the finance with Simon as a guarantor right??

Perhaps that would have been more honest, yes. But IMHO would have been declined, as Mick was out of work (I think), even though he implied to me he was in work. Whatever… it’s very unusual.

Basically, my view is that if you need a guarantor, then you shouldn’t have the car (either affordability, credit score or employment-related). It’s Jackanory time. If there is a story, then the underwriter loses interest very fast. And to choose a top-range £30k+ Skoda in that case where affordability is in question? The underwriter would need to be on drugs. Usually, they are quite sharp.

– Ling

…Mick doesn’t have a hat on.

Cue “What hat to get car finance?” thread

This one obviously

ling’s racehorse got drugs tested after the finish and disqualified – who’s looking clever now?

Why, do you have a nomination? You can’t mean this one shirley, it’s been ace.
Agreed. We’ve had:

Flounces
Reverse Flounces
Legal beagles
Gifs
Charity donations
Nazi references
People believing adverts are real programs
Belief systems colliding
Etc

It’s been great.

Don’t forget we also actually got to gaze at the BAN HAMMER!

aracer – Member

ling’s racehorse got drugs tested after the finish and disqualified – who’s looking clever now?

HOW DARE YOU! I insist you retract that horse scenario.

It is very rich to suggest doping, on a cycle forum.

I supply free mirrors, upon request.

– Ling

Electrically heated?

Behold!

That’s giantalkali’s xmas prezzie sorted 😉

Ling owns a racecourse.

Lingfield?

Reverse Flounces

No….

It’s

#flouncebounce

I can’t – I did try bribing the drug testers, but they wanted £500 + VAT and my BIL didn’t have that much cash on him.

Lingfield?

🙂

Redcar?
Banger?

The OP has zero chance of arguing in court that Ling was involved in the “fronting”. What jury is going to believe that a total stranger went to a random car lease firm and convinced them to commit a fraud on their behalf.

All that matters is whether there was a deliberate attempt to deceive by the OP and his mate/BIL. If they truly were upfront about the arrangement, and responded honestly to all questions from Ling’s team, then it isn’t fraud. Then it becomes a cock-up by Lingcars for either not asking the right questions about a fairly unusual proposal with comms from two people, or not cottoning on that it was effectively a fronting arrangement and telling them to bugger off.

Simple questions – Who will be the main driver? Where will the vehicle be kept? Is this other person on the insurance actually the main driver?

Ling’s role is a pre-filter for these finance applications. If she had done the job properly, provided the OP and his mate are as honest as he claims, we would have never got to this point.

Thanks Ling.
So is there any legal AND successful way that Mick could have secured finance on this car even with Simon agreeing to do it in his name?

I did try bribing the drug testers, but they wanted £500 + VAT and my BIL didn’t have that much cash on him.

I have this one covered as I always win when i sue and my terms and conditions have been approved by the local trading standards office…we cannot lose the law is on our side

funkmasterp – Member
That’s the worst analogy I’ve ever read. Nice one.

I quite liked it, as to what hat for car finance, may I suggest a Cavalier

Jackie Long

Is this Ling’s dyslexic sister? 🙂

Sorry, reminds me of the mildly racist, ‘Why can’t you get through on the phone in China?’ kids joke… 😉

crosshair – Member

Thanks Ling.
So is there any legal AND successful way that Mick could have secured finance on this car even with Simon agreeing to do it in his name?

I’m not an underwriter, but my experience is that when you have to start a story, it ends there. Maybe giantalkali – Member is better experienced to answer, but it’s hard for us all without Mick’s credit app details, and every time the OP discusses his status/backstory, it changes. Job/no job, etc.

I think Nancy Reagan was correct: Just say no, kids.

(I will say that my customer “Simon” aka the BIL… seemed, and was extremely credit-worthy, for the avoidance of doubt.)

– Ling

who’s looking clever now?

Given Crankboy’s last post, I think Ling.

Ling:
Criminal: Failed to have cancellation rights in the T&Cs
Moral: Unenforcable clause in lease agreement, said online she was going to chase the OP for 500 notes which she almost certainaly isn’t.

OP/OP BiL:
Criminal: Conspiracy to commit fraud.
Moral: Signed up to an agreement and failed to follow it through.

Poopscoop:
Blameless due to his total disinterest in this thread.

outofbreath – Member
said online she was going to chase the OP for 500 notes

To be scrupulously fair, I think she said she *may* do this…

outofbreath – Member

Ling:
Criminal: Failed to have cancellation rights in the T&Cs
Moral: Unenforcable clause in lease agreement, said online she was going to chase the OP for 500 notes which she almost certainaly isn’t.

OP/OP BiL:
Criminal: Conspiracy to commit fraud.
Moral: Signed up to an agreement and failed to follow it through.

Poopscoop:
Blameless due to his total disinterest in this thread.

Will you all come and visit me in prison? Bring cake. Lots of cake.

“Cake” is not a euphemism for anything.

Poopscoop is waiting to run me over with his mum’s wheelchair again.

– Ling

“Cake” is not a euphemism for anything.

Ling is looking for a volunteer to stimulate her “Shatners Bassoon”

Don’t try and play the sympathy card with us – they can’t lock you up for that just fine you, so you can just treat it as more free publicity.

aracer – Member

Don’t try and play the sympathy card with us – they can’t lock you up for that just fine you, so you can just treat it as more free publicity.

I’m feeling lucky, punk.

– Ling

To be scrupulously fair, I think she said she *may* do this…

“May” and “up to”

Will you all come and visit me in prison? Bring cake. Lots of cake.

Just say GeorgieMick’s BiL wrote your T&Cs, no jury would ever convict.

Dracs dog is a Vampire (it doesn’t cast a shadow) and I claim my £5(00.00 plus VAT)

Ling is looking for a volunteer to stimulate her “Shatners Bassoon”

I’m not an underwriter, but my experience is that when you have to start a story, it ends there. Maybe giantalkali – Member is better experienced to answer, but it’s hard for us all without the credit app details, and every time the OP discusses his status, it changes. Job/no job, etc.

I think Nancy Reagan was correct: Just say no, kids.

20 years ago I’d have refused it as the vehicle wasn’t going to be living where the finance was being held and it’s not a company / fleet vehicle. Private vehicle = private address that matches finance address. So no.

Applied for by Mick and with BIL as g’tor? Potentially, if Mick has a chequered financial history, but I wouldn’t have covered a car for an utter shyster. I assume he has functional history as he’s had so many recent-ish purchases. If he wasn’t working or with a steady income then it’d be a straight no.

Other companies worked differently, hence the vast variations in rates, why do payday loans charge so much? Because of their clientele.

I am no longer an underwriter, I’m a lumberjack.

To be scrupulously fair, I think she said she *may* do this…

“May” and “up to”

That was on the applcation form. She’s said online she will chase GM for a specific amount, or at least strongly implied it. Mind you GM’s story changes every 5 minutes, so I should probably have put that in his ‘moral’ column.

Lots of cake.

Stotty for you, remember where you are… 😉

Ling, the only other thing still drawing me to this thread is that I want to believe the distinction you made between the car…. and the finance.

So you get the finance approved in theory, then get the order form signed so you can get a VRN to then enable the finance to be finalised. Is that right?

I morally think that you should 100% have the right to cover yourself in that grey zone between the order form being signed, the car being registered and the finance agreement commencing.

Yet everyone is still maintaining that this is illegal?
Is it?
So are the dealers who take a deposit at that point also acting illegally?

Don’t panic, I’ll keep reading and clicking but I would love to know the answer.

She’s said online she will chase GM for a specific amount, or at least strongly implied it.

Ah yes. Apologies.