Legal advice please – cancelling a new car dispute

Who can I hit, today?

Please line up in an orderly manner. Poop first.

I am so evil for trying to reclaim some costs on this fraudulent finance. How else do I pay for my vehicle fleet, if I’m subsidising dodgy customer car orders?

– Ling

That Gif is strangely captivating, as is the Ling office webcam.

I think I might be developing a bit of a thing for Lilly in the office.

You signed an order form knowing that there is an (undefined) cancellation fee then you expect to worm out of it. If you wanted to question the legality or morality of the terms, you should have done so before committing your (or you mates/BiL’s) signature to the order form.
Ling may not be right, or legal, but you still chose to enter into that arrangement.

I think there is a point there but there is also the major point that she cannot have a contract that i snot legal and is not legally enforceable.
She has and she claims this contract was approved by Trading standards which , on the lack of supportive evidence provided by here, currently appears to be an untruthful statement.

In reality he should honour the contract BUT the contract should be legal. Neither of them did the right thing here. As others note neither of them comes out of this well and neither appears to gave told the whole truth ;mick is at least honest about his dishonesty.

Ling runs a business i would hope some authority is having a word with her about her business model, its legality and her contract T & C.

for trying to reclaim some costs

I, and others, have asked for details of what costs you’ve incurred, and it’s one of the questions you’ve chosen to avoid answering. As far as I can tell it’s entirely probable that, apart from your time on this thread, this whole “order” and subsequent “cancellation” hasn’t cost you a penny.

Whoever is attempting to give us fits by making irritating animated gifs and posting them here…

I am so evil for trying to reclaim some costs on this fraudulent finance.

100 lines for you:

there is no fraudulent finance
there is no fraudulent finance
…

Please line up in an orderly manner. Poop first.

Shitty gift?

So if Mick married his mate Si, then the finance arrangement they had planned wouldn’t be “fronting” & Ling would be happy?

Hat shops are going to well out of this thread 🙂

How else do I pay for my vehicle fleet

Legally within the confines of the law and not via unenforceable contract points from terms and conditions you erroneously[ based on current evidence] describe as approved by trading standards whilst saying you always win when you sue.You dont do it by deceiving, bullying and haranguing your “customers” to pay for things that they are not legally responsible for. Well actually you appear to want to do this but you should not.

I think we can all see why it annoys you but you still have to operate as per the law

Really you needed to ask

I got bored at about page 34, have I missed anything?

“Can someone point to the offence committed when someone “car finance fronts”
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/35/contents
Fraud act 2006 is a good start. A conviction would require proof of dishonesty ( note a recent case has widened the definition of dishonesty to essentially an objective state not subjective), and an act more than merely preparatory filling in a form is not enough sending it off is.

Actually an even more interesting question – if you’re financing a car for your wife/partner and then split is it fronting? Just asking for a mate who’s paying for his ex’s Rav4 😈

I’d forgotten about the Dalek. 🙂

Davros has let himself go a bit, though.

Does that mean that if you are open about fronting, then it isn’t fraud? i.e. a matter of the finance company’s policy not one of law.

She does have something of a relaxed relationship with rules – of course she had to ask.

I note the ASA one isn’t just something she made up for marketing purposes:
https://www.asa.org.uk/rulings/lingscarscom-limited-a13-220750.html

“twicewithchips – Member
Does that mean that if you are open about fronting, then it isn’t fraud? i.e. a matter of the finance company’s policy not one of law.”
Exactly correct , that would just be a contract .

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/35/contents
Fraud act 2006 is a good start. A conviction would require proof of dishonesty ( note a recent case has widened the definition of dishonesty to essentially an objective state not subjective), and an act more than merely preparatory filling in a form is not enough sending it off is.

Thanks Crankboy, that’s pretty comprehensive. I’ve learned a lot in this thread.

Fraud requires intention to deceive. If it could be demonstrated that OP was completely transparent in communications with Lingcars about who would be the main driver/insurer of the vehicle, at whose address it would be kept (ie not the proposer), then I don’t see how an offence is committed.

I got bored at about page 34, have I missed anything?

A few called Ling out and suggested she make a donation to charity which they would also do. She did, most of the others didn’t and she won yesterday afternoon.

So Junkyard got really nasty about the donation, totally misunderstood about tax deductions and looked a little foolish and actually admitted he was wrong.

We had a game of “guess his job”.

GeordieMick came back with a new shovel.

I was accused of using the Edinburgh defence by a mod.

Then I gave up and went on the piss with some friends and now have a terrible hangover.

Then I gave up and went on the piss with some friends

In which case I think you won last night

Why, do you have a nomination? You can’t mean this one shirley, it’s been ace.

Agreed. We’ve had:

Flounces
Reverse Flounces
Legal beagles
Gifs
Charity donations
Nazi references
People believing adverts are real programs
Belief systems colliding
Etc

It’s been great.

If it could be demonstrated that OP was completely transparent in communications with Lingcars about who would be the main driver/insurer of the vehicle, at whose address it would be kept (ie not the proposer), then I don’t see how an offence is committed.

Obviously. But if that had happened there would have been no transaction because Ling obviously wouldn’t take on a higher risk customer at the same monthly fee as a low risk customer.

Please line up in an orderly manner. Poop first.

It’s been great.

Agreed.

Needs more dogs though.

I’d imagine Lings dog looks like this….

A few called Ling out and suggested she make a donation to charity which they would also do

that is a complete and utter lie and is just not true.
She was challenged to donate some money for all the free publicity by one poster – I forget who now.
She said she would donate £100 if the OP did and “Many” other Stw posters would match her. I explained how this was not really an offer. No one said pay some money to charity and i will i think aracer suggested she match all donations but he did not even say he would donate.
Now you are wrong I am sure you will be as quick as i was to admit your error 😉

And her pussy cat?

Now you are wrong I am sure you will be as quick as i was to admit your erro

I was wrong.

At least I wasn’t **** nasty with it. 😉

Obviously. But if that had happened there would have been no transaction because Ling obviously wouldn’t take on a higher risk customer at the same monthly fee as a low risk customer.

It’s not her risk, she’s simply helping to set up the finance application and car supply. The only risk to her is if it could be shown that her team knew the exact nature of the arrangement (which would clearly be regarded as fronting by the finance co.) but somehow failed to pass it on or advise the customer to bugger off at that stage. The finance companies would be raising an eyebrow at that.

A few called Ling out and suggested she make a donation to charity which they would also do

that is a complete and utter lie and is just not true.

LOL, it’s not a lie, it’s exactly what happened *and* it’s totally consistent with your version of what happened:

She was challenged to donate some money for all the free publicity
She said she would donate if the OP did and “Many” other Stw posters would match her. I explained hos this was not really an offer but I dont think i was nasty about it.

A few of you hounded. She donated. Then the hounders got hounded. Nobody who didn’t hound got hounded, apart from Ling.

Channel 4 talked about “finance spiralling out of control” in a report in July 2017, featuring Bank of England Govenor Mark Carney, and me (on my Triumph Bonneville).

My high quality regular prime customers are not the problem, the issue comes when rules are broken and finance is dished out like confetti to people who don’t qualify from it.

The Finance and Leasing Association bloke with the beard, at the end, nails it. It has to be responsible. Like me.

Rather proves my point!

Thanks to Jon Snow and Jackie Long.

– Ling

GeordieMick came back with a new shovel.

Did he post a thread asking which one he should buy first? Did STW then recommend an artisan handcrafted titanium one with a walnut handle, sharpened using a strop made from the skin of a llama which was fed only on a rare fungus which only grows on the slopes of one mountain in the Himalaya?

edit: also, by going on the piss you took the only sensible option

Needs more dogs though.

Release the hounds!

A few of you hounded. She donated. Then the hounders got hounded. Nobody who didn’t hound got hounded, apart from Ling.

I have a dog.

Anyone want proof?

Did STW then recommend an artisan handcrafted titanium with a walnut handled one sharpened using a strop made from the skin of a llama which was fed only on a rare fungus which only grows on the slopes of one mountain in the Himalaya?

Get you trying to feign disinterest and then repeating back exactly what happened!

The only risk to her is if it could be shown that her team knew the exact nature of the arrangement (which would clearly be regarded as fronting by the finance co.) but somehow failed to pass it on or advise the customer to bugger off at that stage.

That’s quite a substantial risk!

I have a dog.

Anyone want proof?

I’m calling bullshit.

That’s your Brother in laws dog.

He just lets you walk it.

I think some people got their tights crushed
🙂

I’m calling bullshit. That’s your Brother in laws dog.

Until the mysterious BIL posts to confirm, that’s just speculation.

At least I wasn’t **** nasty with it.

True no one insults me as often or as politely as you do.
I dont think I was any nastier than you have been and I think both of us have been nicer than Ling was in her response,s though she was funnier than both of us – as for who was the most bitter…very hard to tell 😉

I did remember to pull the pin? Didn’t I?

– Ling

I was very careful with my wording, and disappointed it seems nobody noticed in the bun fight ling started.