inspired by shed threads, do you think its possible for…..

would you also use underlay with the felt or is that just belt and braces and not really required? and if underlay is required, use the proper felt underlay or, i see wickes selling polyester underlay which seems to be a lot cheaper. cheap rubbish tho or better than nothing?

thanks

Personally I wouldn’t use underlay.
If you have money for underlay buy a thicker felt.
Overlapping the front will put a drip edge further out. Screw a baton underneath the front/ back edge of ply, fold down ply and tackle, fix a decorative fascia to the batons..

i like that answer, its what i was thinking myself, and hoping itd be ok but expecting people to say “noooo, you need 2 or 3 layers” 🙂

ive been looking at the 38kg mineral stuff, bout £30 a roll, and ill need 4 rolls so still some expense there.

£30 a roll, and ill need 4 rolls so still some expense there.

Woah there, Bald Eagle.

To save me reading back, what size are you covering with that many rolls and where did you look at EPDM prices?

think the structure is 6.7m X 3.4m. so im thinking 1m wide rolls, overlapping a little is gonna take me to needing around 4m width. yes the whole area is maybe just less than 30 sq/m but i cant chop bits off the end and stick em elsewhere, itll take 4 rolls of probably just over 7m length?

EPDM – did a couple of online calculator things, then emailed a couple of places from google. only one of them got back to me with a quote, permaroof uk? quote was £214 for a 6.7 x 3.4 area.

The place I used quotes £182.02 delivered for the same area coverage.

Still quite pricey, I guess, when compared but I’ve never had felt last particularly long. Maybe when it finally dies you can slip on a bit of rubber membrane then. 🙂

if you’ve got the noggins.

Noggins 😕
Dont you mean dwangs 😆

Looking very nice by the way , sturdy 8)
Go on. Strengthen the roof and welsh slate it. 8)

The place I used quotes £182.02 delivered for the same area coverage.

what place is that mate? and does it include adhesive and any fittings? i spose its not waaaay over the price of felt but probably just a bit too far to choose it, unless theres a ‘lazyboy’ consideration and its a lot easier to fit?

Still quite pricey, I guess, when compared but I’ve never had felt last particularly long.

as mentioned before, im opting for thick (38kg) mineral stuff which should last a fair amount of time. had a builder mate round yesterday who agreed with tymbian ^^^ about no underlay. however, he also said he wouldnt use any adhesive either, just lats nailing the felt down and that in time the sticky underside of the felt just ‘melts onto’ the overlap anyway.
he also said he wouldnt use noggins (or dwangs ;-), but personally i think thats a step too far so ill be ignoring that advice and banging a few in.

Go on. Strengthen the roof and welsh slate it.

be no point anyway, top of roof cant be seen so doesnt matter how pretty it is 🙂

you may call me a donut here, but i started thinking of something else whilst laid in the bath…… retractable/removable/temporary roof? thought id bring this up here even if its just to be laughed out of court 😀 no harm in thinking outside the box tho is there, and its healthy to think that anythings possible 🙂
i started wondering if its possible to have a cartridge type thing where a canvas/plastic cover gets pulled out when it rains, in a sort of shop-front stylee. either from rear or side.
im not expecting this idea to last long at all, it may not be possible/may not exist/almost certainly be expensive, but i like the thought of it. even something home-made on a roller or something. so the gazebos open all the time and the cover is only brought out a) when we have a bbq/party with friends, and b) when its raining. so just 3 or 4 times per year.

feel free to pooh-pooh this or hit me til i see sense again please 🙂

How high is the front off of the ground?

the front is 7ft, sloping down to the rear at 6ft. thats to decking level, then the ground slopes left to right so different height depending.

FWIW ive pretty much talked myself out of the retractable/open roof, think it makes more sense to have a proper roof.

Was thinking you could of put a hinged piece at the front. Ie. If twas 8ft you could of had a hinged 2ft wide piece going across the front so in the down position you’ld have a 6ft opening that you could then lift the hinged piece forming an overhang and an 8ft opening. Clad in cedar shingles.

sadexpunk, I’m jealous. I’ve just roofed my new shed (thread at some point soon) and was thinking how it was pretty good then I see this. If I tried something that size I wouldn’t have anywhere to park the car.

I roofed mine with standard shed felt but then I could do the whole lot in one run as it’s a long narrow roof and used the bitumen felt adhesive. I used a flashband on the top edge as it joins onto a brick wall and I didn’t want to faff with melting stuff. I would have liked to have used the torch on stuff but the budget was spent a while ago.

Did you find treated shiplap? I had a quick look but it worked out about twice times the price of the untreated stuff. Mine is going to end up painted anyway so wasn’t too fussed.

Was thinking you could of put a hinged piece at the front. Ie. If twas 8ft you could of had a hinged 2ft wide piece going across the front so in the down position you’ld have a 6ft opening that you could then lift the hinged piece forming an overhang and an 8ft opening. Clad in cedar shingles.

sorry, cant picture what you mean, or what its for? is this purely decorative or does it have a purpose?

Did you find treated shiplap? I had a quick look but it worked out about twice times the price of the untreated stuff.

yep, got a couple of places sell tanalised shiplap, pretty sure its not double the price of untreated, ill have a check tomorrow. theres also a place that sells 4.8m untreated boards (my preferred length) but id ruled that out as i believe that i need tanalised.

Mine is going to end up painted anyway so wasn’t too fussed

ive thought all along id need tanalised as a safety option as im not sure how long itd be before i could give it all a good coat of protection. whats your thoughts on that? will untreated timber be ok for say 2 or 3 weeks in the rain before treatment? if so i may take a punt on it. just didnt want to let it get damaged by bad weather before i got round to treating the whole thing.

Re my post..it was a variation on you roller-awning idea

what place is that mate? and does it include adhesive and any fittings?

This place : http://www.rubba-seal.co.uk/

But no, I forgot to add the cost of the adhesive. That’ll be another £20, sir. And no edging either, though a wood is a viable alternative.

Just ignore me…

Wood rots fastest where it goes in the ground. Your uprights will go first (after many years) so I wouldn’t worry too much about the rest.

been reading up on tanalised wood, and it generally says because its been pressure treated it doesnt need any further treatment. now i dont intend to just leave it without further treatment, but it does suggest itd be a better option for if i do become a bit lazy. obviously nearly every end will have been cut to fit somewhere, so i do intend to go over it all with some ronseal 5yr protection or something when its all finished, plus some non-slip decking oil.

thanks

End-grain sealer for the cut edges. Your wood will start silvering down after 6 months to a year whether it’s tanalised or not. You can prevent this with a uv protect oil from Osmo ( yearly ). If your timber stays out of sustained contact with moisture it won’t rot for a very long time so you could, for instance, use un- tanalised shiplap and then oil or paint. DON’T, I repeat, DON’T buy kiln-dried shiplap and go home and fit it immediately. Let it acclimatise, leave it in the open part under the roof before fitting. If you have a dry warm week you’ll need to fit loosely. Ie. Fit the first one, rest the next on top and lift off slightly (1-2mm) and fix. This will allow for expansion due to moisture.

rightyo, thanks. is end sealer different/betterer than 5yr preservative then? should i get both? FWIW i dont mind wood silvering with time, thats not a bad thing is it? just dont want it to rot/split/warp.
and no, i havent actually seen anything ‘kiln-dried’ so i shouldnt make that mistake, everything ive looked at has been tanalised.

raining yesterday so popped round to see me mate who said i could nick some of his woodburner logs. took a few logs of different sizes, sliced em a few inches thick and stuck em under the decking for the er…. rustic look 🙂

then had a tough day today, although i dont seem to have got much done. twas the noggins today and they went fine. spaced the first row to match the join in ply sheets, adjusting 2″ for front overhang. in retrospect im not sure i should have maybe left a little more as i forgot im going to put a facing board up too, but no matter, done now, 2″ is probs ok.

its times like this you realise you should have worked things out a bit better, as when i got to shed end, the front of the shed frame was just slightly in the way of perfect noggin spacing. id just plopped the shed front where it looked ok, if id thought about the roof i could have come an inch or two forward and id have had a nice beam to nail a ply sheet to. durrr.

anyways, had the afternoon left plus a bit of surplus timber so i thought id attempt tymbians suggestion of knee braces, see how they looked.
did the first one and….

bit savage innit 🙂 decided itd look better smaller, so cut em down again, then realised im gonna be struggling at the ends. double mitre where the corners meet, and wouldnt you know it, the chop saw wouldnt quite fit 4×2 in at 45 degrees so had to do the corners best i could at probably 43 degrees or something. thats a lot to be out and it was leaving a big gap so i spent ages rubbing the faces against brickwork, walls, anything rough to try and file away the excess wood so the corners could meet up.
used a bit of creative licence and er….’reformed’ the wood a little with a lump hammer 😀
before

after

oh yep forgot, i also realised they looked a bit crap with a sharp V shape, so sawed the bottoms flat, i think it makes em look a bit better.
again, before and after below….

so thats my day, sorry its a bit pic heavy but thought the pics would describe my day better than words.

cheers

EDIT: still not sure bout them braces. im perfectly willing to take em down if everyone thinks they look crap, i await comments from you chaps plus wife and friends…..

EDIT EDIT: the more i look at em, the more i think i should have made life easier for myself by screwing the braces to the inside of the ring beam, so i could screw em directly into the posts, and then they wouldnt have to meet outside the posts. probs look better too. b*ll*cks. ah well, a wasted afternoon maybe. wotcha all reckon?

NO idea which is the better solution from an engineering perspective but I like them. Good work that man.

If it bugs you now, it’ll bug you even more in 6 months time when it’ll be considerably harder to change…

nope, im over it now 🙂

went outside for a stare at it and realised that i couldnt do it the other way as theres roof joists in the way of nailing the braces to the roof beam.
plus wife likes it (oooh we can dangle pretty lights from them) so theyre there to stay. thats that then.

NO idea which is the better solution from an engineering perspective but I like them. Good work that man.

not sure either would bring much to the party from a ‘strengthening the roof’ point of view really. and thank you.

I’m a fan of those post braces. I made mine at 50cm along their longest edges so they don’t steal too much space.

They do look slightly odd but you’ll probably get used to it and not even notice after a while. If they do bug you you could add some more timber on the front of the uprights going up to meet them from the floor so they don’t look quite so obvious….

I’m a fan of those post braces.

mcmoonters seal of approval. end of discussion 🙂

that your car??

that your car??

No, some guys came to do a photoshoot here. The results were outstanding.

aye, lovely photos, thanks for sharing.

two quick questions please as im looking to order the roof materials tomorrow.

1. googled this and cant find the info. does anyone know how thick the 38kg mineral roofing felt is please? need to order galvanised clout nails and not sure what length to go for. or should i just order the longest they do?

2. ill be nailing felt to the ply, then screwing some battens on top of it. over the 6.7m span of the roof, how many battens would you use? and would you put them at the edges too, or just a few strategically placed in the middle somewhere? and just 2×1 roofing battens yep?

thanks

I wouldn’t use batons over the felt. Your just trapping water.

I wouldn’t use batons over the felt. Your just trapping water

yeah i heard (and read) some opinions on this, trapping water, leaking from the screws etc and it makes sense. but…. the bits i read were for when theres the ‘gold standard’ 3 layers of felt, with adhesive between layers. im just using one good layer, not stuck down. so its ply screwed to joists, felt tacked to ply with clouts and….thats it?

as i mentioned before, we’re backed onto open fields at top of a cliff and get some howlers from time to time. wouldnt battens give me a bit more protection? i was thinking of painting adhesive over the area where the battens go so when i screw them down and the adhesive dries i get a watertight seal.
oh, and the trapping water thing. i was expecting the battens to run down the slope, not across the roof, no?

3. also on the felt situation, does the real thick stuff fold over and under easily without tearing? i have visions of it being so thick when i try and fold it over and under a 12mm bit of overhung ply, that it rips as its not pliable enough. also thinking about those places where shed felt folds over on itself so in effect theres 2 layers of felt in some corners. will it rip?
reasonable fear or ungrounded? if i may have problems with that should i go for a compromise felt, a bit lighter than the 38kg stuff im considering at the moment but still better than the crap stuff?

4. do you cut felt like you would wallpaper, to fit round corners and edges etc? you know, cut into the corners and fold over, or is that a big no-no which may lead to the cuts tearing and leading to water ingress?

thanks

having a bit of a runaround getting shiplap, on my third woodyard now.

first one gave a quote over phone, next day when i told em exact sizes i wanted itd gone up £90. they said no record of yesterdays quote, must have been a mistake, sorry.
2nd woodyard was local so i went for a look, it was untreated, so didnt take it any further. they said they could get tanalised in bit at £1.60 per metre which is way more than other quotes.

on 3rd woodyard now, gave me a quote of £220 which i was happy with, all sorted. then rang next day to say sorry we dont have those sizes in, we only have 4.8 and 3.6 and its a bit thicker at 19mm but ill honour original quote. very good of you i thought, rang back with new amounts of these sizes and its gone up £90. “ah thatll be cos theres more metres now”
“yes but i dont want the waste metres, you said youd honour original quote”
“sorry, £300 cash is lowest i can go”
so…. said ok, lets go for it. just checking, its tanalised, good quality and normal wood colour int it? no, its green.
green???

so….. im umming and ahhing now. not sure that green cladding wont look a bit cr@p. anyone seen any ‘green shiplap’ from a woodyard and can tell me if its just a light stain from tanalising or actually that dark green colour that some sheds are?

ill ring him later and ask, but its 30 miles away and dont want to get it here and have to say sorry, dont want it….

I was concerned about doing a hard corner when I put my EDPM on (it would probably have been fine), so I screwed roofing batterns to the underside of the edge of my OSB roof, increasing it from 18mm deep to around 50mm deep, then wrapped the rubber round both. Looks nicer (imo) too, a more ‘chunky’ asthetic than just wrapped around an 18mm edge

thats not a bad call, even if i just tack a bit of inch square bead round the edge, thanks.

just spoken to the bod at woodyard about the ‘green’ colour of the shiplap. he says yes, its an olive green colour from tanalising, but thatll fade to normal golden brown, and any tanalised shiplap i get from anywhere would be the same colour. is that right??
id asked a different yard about it previously and theyd implied it was just a light tinge, hardly noticeable.

am i destined to have a green gazebo? and if so will it look ok?? :-/

The green will be gone by the spring, and yes, it’s a light tint rather than a solid colour.

The green will be gone by the spring, and yes, it’s a light tint rather than a solid colour.

ok, ill take a punt. thats what id have thought too, its only with him insisting that it really is olive green that im starting to get a bit worried. all the wood ive bought so far including decking has been tanalised, but theres no way anybody could describe it as olive green, it just looks like ‘normal wood with a very slight tinge’.

(expect a photo of a comedy gazebo in a couple of weeks time 😉 )

thanks

mate may not be able to help for a while so i may try and do the roof myself. if so, would it matter if i got the ply on and then it rained before i could get the felt on a day or two later? or should i really wait until its a dry spell and a couple of us can get it all done in one day without anything getting wet?

oh and ive been watching youtube vids of blokes fitting shed felt (yeah i know). nobody seems to put the adhesive on the ply, only the felt overlaps, altho theyre ickle sheds rather than a large pent roof. that what you recommend too?

my roof was gonna be a lot messier than theirs, thats for sure! 😀 i was going to have adhesive being used as a sort of sealant too, so painting it past where the overlaps come to, and also thick strips painted where the battens would be screwed, so in effect a batten would ‘squidge’ down onto the adhesive creating a seal.

obviously all this would result in a messy looking roof with areas of adhesive showing, but as nobody can see the top of the roof at any point i was thinking it didnt matter.

im considering now that this probably isnt how its done, and so much adhesive is maybe overkill.

could i have your thoughts on this please, and also on whether the ply can be left potentially in the rain for a couple of days if the weather turns, or if it needs to all be done quickly in the dry?

thanks

Can you get a tarpaulin that you can throw over for a few date? Or even a tent fly sheet?

ive got one tarp that would cover about half of the area. ive just borrowed another mates saw and done a test cut on one of the bits of ply using a length of decking as a guide.

im thinking i can maybe get half the cuts done ready for fixing (cos im working from one end), then see how well its going as to whether i screw them up and do the remaining cuts to suit the other end.

dont know if its an old saw or its me thats crap but the test cut didnt go through ‘like butter’ by any means,seemed to move about a bit, the guard getting stuck etc. ive finished with a straight line tho so ill do a finish cut next and hope for the best 😯