HGV begging letter

Very true poly, but I expect most of them either go home at the end of the day or have access to decent facilities and are not forced to park on an industrial estate or in a layby and have to pee in a bottle or have a dump in a plastic bag because the service areas are full to overflowing or non existent in the area they are in.

Absolutely – I think that’s a much stronger argument (and it did make me laugh that if Dominic Rab’s suggestion of using low risk offenders was followed through on – they’d probably have legitimate human rights issues!). But who is to blame for a lack of infrastructure?

Online version of the newspaper article I linked earlier:

https://www.thestandard.com.hk/section-news/section/50041045/234631/UK-lorry-driver-crisis-opens-new-road-for-HK-job-seekers

and there is no time limit of course for the commute to and from the depot meaning you are often driving for a lot longer than 9 hours.

Yep, there’s nothing stopping you from finishing a shift then going out to a party then straight back to work. As long as you can stay awake and aren’t inebriated in any way it’s legal. Some drivers do not sleep between shifts as it’s the only way they can see their families, particularly night drivers.

Also, why cant 7.5t drivers after a period of time automatically (small test) qualify to say Class 2 then 1 thereafter.

The difference in the driving techniques required is massive. Most 7.5t vehicles are basically bigger vans or pickup trucks (with the odd exception that carries large but not too heavy loads), the loads that a Class 2 can carry are much more dangerous if done incorrectly. As the weight and size of the load increases the complexity of loading and securing it correctly is a big step-up.

But who is to blame for a lack of infrastructure?

Everyone, but mainly the government.

The government for not planning it in in the first place.
The drivers for not forcing the issue sooner.
The regulatory bodies for not fighting for it more.
The road planners for not considering it.
The government for not realising/ignoring it was an issue and doing something about it.

Had my invite come yesterday as well, I’m coming to the end of a seasonal contract (non driving) , so may have to look into getting back onto the wagons over xmas ,despite not really wanting too !

Queen by Ben Freeman[/url], on Flickr

Ok, I can’t figure out how not wanting to drive an HGV makes you anti-democratic.  How does that work?

It’s not only HGV drivers that have had begging letters. A couple of years ago retired prison officers were getting them as well. That dopey retard called Grayling got shot of loads of prison staff when he was justice minister, then when reality hit home they sent out begging letters to get officers to come back, not many did.

Bloke at work has had his letter, stuck it to the wall to troll the current (unpopular boss).
His response

“If they want to really sort the shortage just say HGV drivers don’t pay income tax for 2 years, there’ll be no shortage within a week. Unfortunately I’d have to go back driving”

germans getting absolutely blisteringly angry at this joke is funny every single time pic.twitter.com/RW3Qg6K3Z0

— c a i t (@kittynouveau) September 30, 2021

It’s not only HGV drivers that have had begging letters. A couple of years ago retired prison officers were getting them as well.

And retired NHS workers, doctors and nurses last year…If only there some some way to allow people from other countries to come to work and live in the UK.

germans getting absolutely blisteringly angry at this joke is funny every single time

You would have thought they would have some appreciation for how infantile the English-speaking world is by now.

And retired NHS workers, doctors and nurses last year…If only there some some way to allow people from other countries to come to work and live in the UK.

Yeah I forgot my Mrs got one ages ago.

People from other countries still can & do come here to work, India, Thailand, Philippines, to name a few.

When my Mrs was in hospital for 6 weeks there were more nurses from Kerala than the EU.

Surely it’s only a matter of weeks before autonomous driving legislation is rushed through parliament and Elon Musk gets to beta test his software on HGV’s carrying petrol and other chemicals across the country?

I believe they’re already testing autonomous HGVs in the UK

What other industry expects a 12 to 15 hour day to be the norm?

Dunno about the others suggested but I was up at 5 this morning to get to a 12 hour shift. I’m 2 weeks into a 6 week block of 7 days a week, before that was a 5 day week for a break but the days off were Thursday and saturday, and before that 11 days straight. Then a month of normal ish work and before that some “time off” to panic over my bank ballance.

I’ve got a day off scheduled for the 1st Wednesday in November.

Yours sincerely,
The camera guy from the airy fairy world of TV production.

I wouldn’t suggest anyone puts up and shuts up if they don’t enjoy it. But I’d object to the idea that it’s an exceptionally antisocial industry.

I believe they’re already testing autonomous HGVs in the UK

By allowing driver to fall asleep at the wheel?

Yours sincerely,
The camera guy from the airy fairy world of TV production.

The problem for the film and tv industry is many of the dangers of long hours occur on the way to and fro from work, when you’re not on the production’s clock. I worked on a period drama a few years back with the unofficial working title of ‘Death on the Motorway’ because the hours worked and distances travelled before and after were completely out of control.  Often for me its only when we have HGV drivers on the job – such as Genny Ops-  that theres pressure on the production to keep the length of the working day under some sort of control.

What other industry expects a 12 to 15 hour day to be the norm?

Both  my sons do 12 hour shifts

Both they and both parents have done things like split shifts at hotels – often in at 6am, finish at 10am, back in at 3/4pm to finish at midnight.

My old outdoor centre I would weekly do a 7am-11pm day, on expedition or similar it would basically be 48hr-week working and ‘on call’ overnight.

Young doctors.

Even one of my staff today left the house at 6am, got to worksite at 12pm, worked all afternoon and will fly back in the morning. (Barra!)

I believe they’re already testing autonomous HGVs in the UK

Meanwhile, when I was on a train a couple of weeks ago, it terminated after one stop due to a lack of drivers.

A train. Y’know, those things on rails.

Good luck with your driverless trucks, surely must be due any day now.

scud
Full Member
I did my HGV years ago in Army, so as ex-HGV and ex-army i am expecting a recall to ask me to drive lorries monday to friday, do the bins on a saturday and then maybe put some fires in a 60’s Green Goddess if i have some spare time…

I’ve seen you ride a bike. Driving a Green Godess would scare me sh!tless!!

I understand the situation may be about to get a whole lot worse as, from today, EU drivers will only be allowed into the UK with a valid passport. Many of the drivers from the Schengen countries have, up until today, been able to enter the country on a ID card. From the info I have been listening to it seems that many of these drivers do not even have a passport. So expect even more pressure on the haulage industry over coming months.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/national-id-cards-no-longer-valid-europeans-entering-uk-b958212.html

Really?!? No-one thought that putting an extra hurdle for European drivers to jump over in the way just at the time we’re trying to encourage a few more over might be a bad idea?

What is the big game plan then? Because there is no way in hell this can be anything other than deliberate. Even the completely incompetent don’t get things this wrong all of the time.

Germans on pre 1999 licences are registered with hgv entitlement on DVLA data base and have been sent letters:

One 41-year-old German man, who, along with  his wife, received a copy of the letter at their London home on Friday morning, told the Independent: “We were quite surprised. I’m sure pay and conditions for HGV drivers have improved, but ultimately I have decided to carry on in my role at an investment bank.

“My wife has never driven anything larger than a Volvo, so she is also intending to decline the exciting opportunity.”

My brother keeps being offered jobs (he has class 1) … but who would do his job if he took a driving job? We can keep shuffling people around for a few years ‘till the public come to accept that we need workers to replace those we’ve told to…

And they say Germans have no sense of humour 😀

you’re not selling the UK as a place to live and work 🙂

Why would EU drivers come back/over here to work when Europe are short of 400,000 drivers?

https://www.euronews.com/2021/09/28/uk-lorry-driver-shortage-a-stark-example-of-a-wider-european-problem

esselgruntfuttock
Free Member

Why would EU drivers come back/over here to work when Europe are short of 400,000 drivers?

The EU had a driver shortage before when EU drivers were working here, it’s not really much different now except that we’ve chosen to make ours far worse for lolz.

There’s little reason for EU drivers to come here now, and plenty of reasons not to- we literally just made it harder- but this isn’t really much of a factor.

It would be nice to think that the benefit to come out of this crisis is that it forces UK employers to invest in employing local people instead of expecting qualified/trained cheap foreign workers.
That would improve wages and conditions if you take the pool of cheap labour away.

Of course it would initially mean higher prices for consumers having to cover wage increases, but soon this would result in less profits for employers as other less greedy companies undercut them … market forces would prevail.

unulales
Free Member
It would be nice to think that the benefit to come out of this crisis is that it forces UK employers to invest in employing local people instead of expecting qualified/trained cheap foreign workers.
That would improve wages and conditions if you take the pool of cheap labour away.

Of course it would initially mean higher prices for consumers having to cover wage increases, but soon this would result in less profits for employers as other less greedy companies undercut them … market forces would prevail.

You have a lot not confidence then me in that happening.

Ah, “the chosen one” is here to stay. That’s great. Expect plenty of “Brexit is great” repeats.

We can keep shuffling people around for a few years ‘till the public come to accept that we need workers to replace those we’ve told to…

There are currently 2.2 million people in the UK claiming unemployment benefit – Costing £1.5bn of tax payers money that could be better spent on things like the NHS for example if we could get these people back into work…..there is no need for us to be short of staffing our own domestic jobs if they were not undercut by cheap labour making it more lucrative to claim benefits rather than work…Of course paying people a fair price for the jobs they do wether it be nurses or HGV drivers means we all have to pay a bit more for the products and services we buy….but if we’re really serious about paying those on the lowest wages a higher and ‘fair’ living wage rather than talking a good game, then we all have to pay a bit more for our products and services. People talk a great game about doing more for the least well off, but short of suggesting ‘Those with the broadest shoulders’ to pay more in tax they’re fresh out of ideas. God forbid it is suggested getting those on benefits off benefits – which would benefit them more than anyone. Far easier to bring in the cheap Bulgarians to do the jobs for a pittance. Doesn’t do any good for our own economy or the Bulgarian economy.

Sorry to cross post but EU drivers will be allowed to stay till end of February now.

Wonder if that February date will lapse, then lapse again?…

Brexit is very good at that after all. Delay, delay, postpone, delay.

The good thing about Baroness Vere of Norbiton is that she really is in touch with the working classes.

2.2 million people in the UK claiming unemployment benefit

You don’t know what you’re talking about.

Do you mean JSA? If so, it’s 0.3 million. And are they where the jobs are? Are they looking to do the jobs you have in mind for them and starting from scratch, rather than getting back into another job akin to the previous job they were doing?

Even in “soft” areas like software development, accountancy or law it won’t be that unusual to find people doing 12+ hr days, .

True but at least in the area of software development I work in its a occasional thing (games dev for example tends to go a lot more for crunch time) but the thing is I can look back at my commits and when they were done and one thing stands out.
After about 8 hours or so the quality drops dramatically and once I hit twelve or so unless I am in mostly just monitoring the quality absolutely sucks and if I look at other peoples commits and their timezones it is pretty consistently poor once it hits that time as it might sort of fix the immediate issue but misses a bunch more.
Whilst some rare people might be able to keep up on minimal sleep for a sustained period its not what we have evolved to do. Whilst sleep is still somewhat of a mystery as to its purpose that it is essential when we go way back on the evolutionary tree gives a hint its kinda useful.

I might be being selfish here but if someone is in charge of a 40 ton lorry on the same road as me, especially if it is loaded with 40 tons of fuel, I would like them to be semi awake.

There are currently 2.2 million people in the UK claiming unemployment benefit – Costing £1.5bn of tax payers money that could be better spent on things like the NHS

You should put that on a bus

Baroness Vere of Norbiton
or
Baroness Vere of Nobriton

wobbliscott
Full Member
We can keep shuffling people around for a few years ‘till the public come to accept that we need workers to replace those we’ve told to…

There are currently 2.2 million people in the UK claiming unemployment benefit – Costing £1.5bn of tax payers money that could be better spent on things like the NHS for example if we could get these people back into work…..there is no need for us to be short of staffing our own domestic jobs if they were not undercut by cheap labour making it more lucrative to claim benefits rather than work…Of course paying people a fair price for the jobs they do wether it be nurses or HGV drivers means we all have to pay a bit more for the products and services we buy….but if we’re really serious about paying those on the lowest wages a higher and ‘fair’ living wage rather than talking a good game, then we all have to pay a bit more for our products and services. People talk a great game about doing more for the least well off, but short of suggesting ‘Those with the broadest shoulders’ to pay more in tax they’re fresh out of ideas. God forbid it is suggested getting those on benefits off benefits – which would benefit them more than anyone. Far easier to bring in the cheap Bulgarians to do the jobs for a pittance. Doesn’t do any good for our own economy or the Bulgarian economy

As we have seen over the last few years a certain section of society find it more convenient to blame others (migrants, Brexit, government, old people) than to take some responsibility themselves and pay a little more towards supporting those doing essential jobs for low pay and poor conditions.
In our contemporary society, where it’s easier to buy a new shirt than sew on a new button; where it’s easier to import cheap labour than train a domestic workforce. I am hopeful that society as a whole can see the quick fix option is not a solid foundation.

Kelvin – why do you feel a need to Troll?
I can see you are unable to provide logical counter views or opinions – therefore identifying yourself as irrelevant – so please explain what benefit Trolling gives you?

You are funny “chosen one”.

Currently listening to this, you’ll probably agree with lots of it:

02/10/21 – Farming Today This Week: The Food Supply Chain Crisis

We have manufactured a situation where the pandemic and cutting out workers have occurred at the same time. I can’t take responsibility for that, no matter how much I pay for food and goods. Only the government can. Our supply chains will have to be transformed to deal with “our” choice to keep people out, and realistically that probably means more food and goods being produced abroad. A lack of workers will eventually just mean the sectors hit will contract and we will lose out to other countries, we simply won’t have as many people working here as we could have had. A reduced workforce and a diminished UK.

What is it about my singletrackworld username that bothers you so much? maybe you should reflect on this and it may help you address your motivation for Trolling complete strangers on the internet.