Gravel – Am I missing something?

CX is where it’s at anyway. My 2016 Kona Jake carbon with 33mm CX tyres and carbon wheels is at least 95% as fast as a proper road bike, but will still handle rough stuff, IME. I’ve happily ridden the Ridgeway on it from Pangbourne to Avebury in a day, including road sections to and from my house near Oxford. Perfect do it all bike.

The concern I have with gravel bikes is they seem to have taken the wind out of the ‘recreational’ CX bike market, and to my mind, become over-bloated slow things with massive tyres – and now even suspension! Trying to buy a general purpose recreational CX bike like in the good old days pre 2019, or even CX tyres that aren’t racing tubs, is challenging now to say the least. Looking at you: Maxxis, who seem to have completely discontinued my favourite CX tyre the Raze 33c, since ‘gravel’ came along. Grrrr…

My riding is around 50% road and 50% gravel (with maybe 5-10% of the gravel being single track depending on season). I have ridden CX bikes, rigid MTBs, hardtail MTBs and fixed gear bikes on this sort of mix for 20 years. As long as I am riding something I don’t really care but given the choice the MTBs always get sold off as they are dull on 90% of the ride. I tend to go back to one bike (as I just have done) and that is a fixed gear as for me I enjoy riding it the most even though it probably makes the least sense.

So pick the bike YOU enjoy riding for YOUR reasons and get on with it.

I like my gravel bike, works well where I live for the riding I like to do – local loops using quiet tarmac roads to link up estate, farm and forest roads/tracks.  Living in Scotland means going literally anywhere, consequently lots of options.

Did a 50 mile loop around Aberfoyle a couple of weeks ago.  Good fun.  Also have slicks for it and a couple of times a week I take an extended ‘lunch’ and can easily do 15-20 miles of backroads.

I have MTB’s too and was out on the local enduro trails night-riding yesterday on my 170mm FS.

One thing though the gravel bike isn’t good for is when loaded and descending rough(er) tracks, then I prefer my MTB HT, but not for the rest of the trip when the gravel bike just takes less energy and is easier on the hands etc.  Consequently I’ve just bought a drop-bar MTB (Cotic Cascade) for bikepacking – n+1 🙂

Mostly this

The MTBers who like them are probably those old-schoolers who know what underbiking and pin-balling is and enjoy it, in moderate doses.

With a bit of this

Those who appreciate good road bikes will like gravel bikes for a bit of ‘road plus’

I’m not racing anybody so I don’t really care how fast I’m going. I *do* care about how involved in the process I am. Modern MTBs are just too damn capable for most riding. There’s very little I can’t do on my hardtail and it has to either be multiple days in proper mountains or full on winch’n’plummet scariness to make dragging the big bike out worthwhile. The gravel bike takes me back to the 90s (with better brakes and tyres) and I really enjoy picking my way down tech descents. I won’t be going fast, but I will be pushing myself and thats what matters. Suspension – meh. I wouldn’t bother with anything less than 100mm, and I wouldn’t want the weight. The whole point is that its supposed to be flighty, fidgety and scary, but generally low consequence!

(the caveat to that is that I live somewhere with nice grippy rocks – wet roots are ****in’ appalling on gravel tyres!)

IMO they are all compromised at some point which ever route you go down.

At that point its in which way do you want to compromise. However when I look at gravel bikes with thick tyres and suspension and do start to think people have lost the plot a bit.

Its all a wet dream though for bike manufacturers. Sell the dream of something thats perfect. Said thing isnt perfect when you buy it, you change it, or buy something just a little more comfortable, before you know it its more compromised than the other alternative.

The fact is you are going to have to compromise  somewhere with a bike, unfortunately I think a lot of people compromise based on marketing hype and trends, rather than where they actually ride

Whereas when I see folk riding most of the trails and tracks around here in 150/160mm FS bouncers, I think the same – until I remember that most folk only own one bike.

he gravel bike takes me back to the 90s (with better brakes and tyres) and I really enjoy picking my way down tech descents. I won’t be going fast, but I will be pushing myself and thats what matters.

That’s me too. My riding-from-the-door isn’t techy and my dropbar MTB (unsure I can call my Cotic Cascade a “gravel bike” after fitting 29×2.2 Race Kings?) increases the challenge and excitement levels to make local riding appealing. Its definitely increased my “fun” biking time by avoiding the need for a 20-25min drive to the nearest proper MTB stuff.

when I look at gravel bikes with thick tyres and suspension and do start to think people have lost the plot a bit.

Disagree about thick tyres – it’s about comfort/capability for me and they don’t (all) hugely compromise speed on road. Yet to be convinced about suspension personally but not saying never.

My two bikes are a 160mmFS (Spesh Enduro) and 140mm HT (Yeti ARC) , I do all the ‘gravel type’ riding on the HT, for some stuff it’s probs slower than a gravel bike – the canal toe-paths, the double track, but other bits; the techy chutes, the nadgery climbs – not so much. I think for most folks their choices are based around local terrain their priorities and how much time they have. Some of the rides I do on the ARC would probs be faster on the gravel bike, whether they be as much fun (for me at least) is a different question.

 Modern MTBs are just too damn capable for most riding

Then just ride them faster?  There’s always involvement and skill needed, the difference is the speed at which it is needed.  That is under your control to a large extent 🙂

Ok so I’m trolling a bit here as the faster you go the higher the penalty for failure becomes and the more problematic for other trail users.  But really, it’s not like ‘modern MTB’ always means 160mm enduro gnar sled.  There are bikes between gravel and enduro that might be a good halfway house.

The concern I have with gravel bikes is they seem to have taken the wind out of the ‘recreational’ CX bike market, and to my mind, become over-bloated slow things with massive tyres

You know you can change tyres to a different size, right?  For me 33c tyres are an absolute non-starter. There are loads of tracks here that are superb for long non-tech days out but they are still rocky, and some important trails are 100% big loose rocks so if you’re riding at all on skinny tyres you’re mincing slowly. Sure it’s possible but it takes all the fun out of a descent.  45-50mm tyres are a huge improvement on this kind of riding. I do it on a rigid MTB with 2.3″ tyres, but I could probably drop to 2.0.

Repurposed early 90’s 26″ MTBs are where its at these days.

How about the 80s for some vintage MTBs that don’t even need repurposing for gravel?

Dave McLaughlin:

and of course Tomac in the 90s:

Some great photos here: https://roadbikeaction.com/the-origins-of-fat-tires-drop-bars/

I finally boarded the hype train and got a gravel bike recently, and I have really been enjoying piecing together local routes with shorter bits of off-road that I have never properly explored. My MTB is a 2006 Anthem (which refuses to die) and would be fine for the same riding, but the gravel bike is just a bit lighter and nicer for short climbs and extended tarmac sections (which has expanded the range of local off road I can visit). It can also potentially double up as a town/shopping/utility bike.

I considered getting a HT, because I thought that would do the same job, but be better for more remote routes with proper stony estate tracks, but an extremely good clearance deal on a gravel bike caught my eye in the end. So I am pleased with my purchase so far, but I think if you have a light HT (or rigid MTB) the case for a gravel bike is not so compelling.

Modern MTBs are just too damn capable for most riding

I can ride right on the edge, to the point of catastrophic failure on any of my bikes, even in the Derbyshire Dales.

Ride harder 😉

Horses for courses, always has been.

Gravel bike is perfect for my local area, plenty of back lanes that would be tedious on an MTB, that connect short sections of off road, all that you’d probably not even notice in an MTB.

So the gravy bike makes the tarmac bearable and the off road more if a challenge.

We don’t all live in the peak or lake district. If I did I’m sure I’d use the MTB more

We don’t all live in the peak or lake district. If I did I’m sure I’d use the MTB more

I live smack bang in the middle of some of the best MTBing that South Wales can offer, and the majority of riders I ride with own other bikes, very often including gravel bikes. Why? Because we don’t spend all our time shredding gnar and high-fiving, and often want a day of more gentle, scenic riding, or in fact just something to ride to work. Shredding every day sort of wears you out. 😀

Gravel bikes are great for gravel, there isn’t a vast amount in the UK (compared to say rural USA) but there’s certainly enough in many places to make them a good bike to have and ride.

I’ve owned one now for about a month or so. I really like it. The main thing for me was the riding position. Much more comfortable. Down to the tyres and frame material mostly, but the geo is more relaxed than my road bike. After say 25-30 miles, I feel more comfortable. Yes it’s slower on the road, but I don’t care. I’m slow anyway. Last weekend I did a canal/old train line ride which was great. It’s perfect for that environment.

There are loads of bits of Britain that have miles and miles of tarmac country lanes, towpaths and forestry fire roads. In these areas gravel bikes make perfect sense.

There are loads of bits of Britain that have miles and miles of tarmac country lanes, towpaths and forestry fire roads. In these areas gravel bikes make perfect sense.

Yeah, but if the only cycling you do is to drive to trail centres or bike parks then you won’t see any of the places where a gravel bike is useful.

😀

I like to ride long distances in silly events. I don’t get hand palsy with my gravel bike, I get it loads on my hard tail and a little bit on my FS.

The hardtail is pretty much relegated to the trainer now, and there is a bike choice of two for these events:
Either a short travel FS if it’s likely to be gnarly(ish) or gravel bike (with some redshift bits) if it’s more road than off.

Endurance road bike for Audax, which is almost the same geometry as my gravel bike…

I like to ride long distances in silly events. I don’t get hand palsy with my gravel bike, I get it loads on my hard tail and a little bit on my FS.

Yeah, I’m trying to build up to some 190-200km gravel days next years, routes I would NEVER have considered trying on the MTB (although granted all of them involve extended 10-15km sections of tarmac at points).

Gravel bikes are great for gravel, there isn’t a vast amount in the UK

tarmac country lanes, towpaths and forestry fire roads. In these areas gravel bikes make perfect sense.

I think this is too limiting, I regularly ride the above, plus bumpy/rocky/loose farm tracks, quad tracks, hill tracks, singletrack, boggy bits, muddy bits etc. of which there is a never-ending supply in the UK! The limiting factor tends to be (extended) steep gradients when I miss powerful brakes and a more upright position, and obviously speed, gravel bikes are more nimble so you can steer around obstacles, but for going straight over the top or ploughing through, you want suspension and big tyres. Thing is on big long distance routes, I’m not focusing on absolute speed, e.g. picking my way over the Glen Tilt watershed I’m enjoying the thrill and the scenery as much as I want to without being able to go slightly faster because I’m on an MTB.

I think if you have a light HT (or rigid MTB) the case for a gravel bike is not so compelling.

Well. There’s nothing wrong with a gravel bike (or two) … AND a lightish HT!

I’ve ridden a gravel bike for years now, and absolutely get the point of it. It’s a very versatile bike, BUT does have quite a sharp drop-off as soon as the riding gets chunky, rocky, steep or techy. This year, I’ve also updated my HT around an On One Vandal, mostly it runs as a trail bike with 2.4in MTB tyres and Pike forks. But, with a swap to a carbon rigid fork, lighter wheels and 2.2/2.3 Bonty XR2/3 tyres, it makes an excellent ‘gravel +’ bike, which I now tend to use more for bike-packing, especially when I think the terrain is going to have more chunky/challenging gravel (North Yorks Moors – I’m looking at you!)

I suppose all the 6 hour+ XC races are fine on gravel bikes now? 😉

If I was wealthier and my various other bike wants were dealt with, I might get a gravel bike for commuting. No hang on if I were wealthy I would probably get an e bike for commuting… Maybe. I’d probably have ten bikes or something just so I could figure out what’s best and when. If I were wealthy I wouldn’t need to commute and excellent MTB would be from the doorstep having relocated. Sorry can’t think of an instance where I would  want a gravel bike.

I live smack bang in the middle of some of the best MTBing that South Wales can offer,

No one likes a show off

I had a Diverge for a bit. Can safely say I thrashed the pants off of it. And I really liked it.
I no longer have it though!

At the time I had a 2013 Scott Spark 920 and a rim braked road bike.

The diverge was a boon on winter road-club rides and I even did a few 30kph centuries on it. Proper smash ups where the bolt on top tube bag, frame storage and future shock made for a cracking comfy long range tool.  That was on Prime RR50’s with 32mm conti gp5000 str’s. The discs were obviously night and day better than my carbon rim brakes.
I even did a few 26mph Chainy’s on it- although I couldn’t do many pulls.

I then found Dirty Reiver because of the bike basically. It was something gravelly to do on it. My Pathfinder Pro’s steadily grew from the oe 38’s to 42’s and eventually the 47’s and it was always fun when I rode byways and gravel on it.

Then I fancied di2 so I got an Orro Venturi and put the RR50’s on there. And suddenly- I didn’t want to ride my Diverge on road any more. I had equally good brakes, a 2kg weight saving and better aerodynamics on the Orro now.

Next up, I stuck some Challenge baby limus I had in the shed on there and tried racing cross on it… Gravel bikes are NOT all just rebranded CX bikes however and the low BB height, slack steering and relatively high weight made it awful to ride round a CX track.

The final nail in the coffin though was taking my mtb out for a 75mile road road with the local club and realising how comfy it is even on tarmac lanes to have suspension and 2.25 tyres!

So- I swapped for the next Dirty Reiver and did it on my Scott and realised that XC bike development was right all along. Even tame gravel is less fatiguing on an XC bike if you spend enough hours out there.

Obviously people like to feel hardcore doing these epic events so make out they are cool on 33’s and ancient CX gearing but I know I’m hardcore already so have nothing to prove 😉

One or my favourite rides to do is Salisbury Plain end-end-end starting and finishing at Ludgershall and riding to Westbury white horse.
Yet no matter how hard I tried- I couldn’t beat my pb 15mph average (set on the Spark) with the Diverge!!

I’ve been predominantly a MTBer for most of my cycling life, if you discount the commuting. (If you include the commute then it’s been a fast hybrid, first with rim brakes, then cantis, then V brakes and for the majority decent discs.)

I bought a Genesis CDF a couple of years ago as a sturdy road bike, to ride with the local road club, that I could do some gravel on with a change of tyre. It’s now my gravel bike that I swap the tyres on to do the odd road ride. I’m now in a bit of a quandary, I either need to put the full mudguards back on for winter road duties or or put the new winter slop gravel tyres on and continue to seek out new gravel.

Either way I’m riding mostly off-road when the intention was to have a “road” bike and a MTB. Mind, the MTB is a rigid Stooge.

Some interesting views, I like my gravel bike for short rides, most seem to prefer long rides, but I love thrashing around some mild xc trail, arse on fire, sprinting up hills and sliding about on descents. Sure I might be faster on my MTB, but I don’t care it’s not as much fun. Also for me gravel is strictly a summer thing, slow mud plugs are zero fun.

I live smack bang in the middle of some of the best MTBing that Nottinghamshire can offer. That’s why I mostly ride a gravel bike.

Gravel – Am I missing something?

Yeah, a monster cross tourer is where it’s at.

Ride the bike you have. Smile. Wave. Smell the breeze. Enjoy.

One thing I will say is that “gravel bikes” are very much on a spectrum from ‘pretty much an MTB‘ to ‘almost a road bike‘.

Yes, this. I went from my battered cross bike – basically a road bike with a bit more shortness and larger tyres – to my Camino, which by gravel standards is at the mountain bike end of things with long-ish reach, 45mm tyres, short-ish stem and a 69˚ head angle, which is in old school mountain bike territory. I live in the Peak and the difference between the two is night and day. Stuff that the CX bikes sort of teetered down, the Camino is far more composed.

I get that you could argue a lightweight hardtail would be faster and it probably would, but I like riding drops. I do quite a lot of broken tarmac between bits of trail and, in honesty, I can take the argument a stage further and point out that with light wheels and fast tyres, my FlareMax is pretty much as quick as a fast hardtail. Cue:  why bother with a gravel bike, why not just run a short-travel full sus with fast-rolling wheels and tyres eh?

I have a bit of love hate relationship with gravel.

Love the fact that I can, as many have said, piece together routes mixed surfaces (mine being road, tow paths, gravel, single track/ woods, shared paths, etc).

But also hate in that it is so easy to grab and go often my MTB or road bike get neglected.

For reference I’m now on my 4th gravel bike. Each one different, till I knew what worked best for me. First one was steel, 1x and 650b but very much at the load lugging /  cruiser end of the spectrum. That was stolen after 4 months but had highlighted how much I’d ride one.

Then I moved on to a more race/road geo steel frame, also 1x and 650b. I had that bike about 3 years and rode it above and beyond its pay grade.

Eventually selling it for a bike that was 700c and with geo somewhere between the 2 previous bikes. Still 1x.

That only lasted a year, partly due to being back at the bike shop approx every 6 weeks with a variety of issues (brakes, gears, hubs, tyres) and I realised I liked 700c but wanted 2x and lighter! Fortunately I was offered a good price on it as someone was looking for that exact model.

So number 4 hits the spot. 2x, 700c and carbon. It rides like a robust road bike on the tarmac but has been more than capable of pushing boundaries off-road. I totally get it wouldn’t suit everyone (lack of ‘warts’ – bike packing mounts) and race geo but it ticks the boxes for me.

I guess that sums it up for me, get the right set up and it can be super addictive.

Bikes are cool!

I live smack bang in the middle of some of the best MTBing that South Wales can offer,
No one likes a show off

😀

It’s always surprised me how few people on this forum live anywhere near good MTBing.

Love the fact that I can, as many have said, piece together routes mixed surfaces (mine being road, tow paths, gravel, single track/ woods, shared paths, etc

I do all that on my hardtail – a bit slower but in greater comfort.  Its about smiles per mile not miles per hour

So do I, just more often on the gravel bike as I said.

I’d rather be comfy.  I even prefer a hardtail with a sus fork for utility riding around town.

I have two bikes a Camino Ti gravel and an Orange 5 evo.

I have not ridden the 5 for two years, now this probably says more about not wanting to tackle or able to tackle Pennine drops and nasty rocky singletrack.

My gravel bike gets me out from the house and be able to put in miles on the road to get to the tracks I feel more able and confident (Pennine Moors and the like)

The gearing on the Camino is spot on for 95% of what I used to do on the 5.

I’d rather be comfy

Depends what you mean by comfy. I like my Stooge for long rides but the gravel bike, whilst providing less shock absorption gives me a range of hand positions that keeps me going for longer with less issues.

If it’s really rough and unpleasant then the balance switches but for covering big distances then on mixed terrain it’s the ability to relieve pressure points.

no teeth rattling because I have suspension and I don’t need to change positions on the bars (tho I do have a couple) due to sweptback bars.  I also like the brakes immediately available at all times

different strokes for different folks.

I do all that on my hardtail – a bit slower but in greater comfort. Its about smiles per mile not miles per hour

Whereas other get smiles from giving it the beans…..isn’t diversity great

About two threads every week for the last ten years saying the same thing?

Excellent, though I’m going to go back to check you’ve put a similar comment on at least 1000 of the other threads 🙂

my mate took his gravel bike and was AOT a number of times

Can someone explain to me, an old man not down with the lingo, what AOT means?