Is there a YouTube channel/YouTuber that is balanced and honest? I’m properly sick of the ‘I just got this xxxx and it’s the best thing ever!’ Obviously they’ve been sent it/asked for it in order to say nice things about it, without context vs other similar stuff, in some cases because the usual outlets won’t *cough* Intend *cough*.

I don’t mean a ‘everything is shit’ hambini style rant, just someone who is honest about how they came by the thing that they are ‘reviewing’ and how it compares to other products on the market.

Or does the nature of YouTube mean that it’s adverts or nothing, zero objectivity.

Seth, hacker of bikes, seems to put together mostly unbiased and relatively entertaining content.

Steve at Hardtail Party is very honest about the bikes he reviews. He makes a point of it.

He makes a point of it.

Self proclaimed honesty is not a benchmark of an unbiased viewpoint.

Can I have a moan about EMBN?

The advertising and product promotion is up a good few notches on GMBN.

Ebikes are here to stay, I feel like most of the content is still justifying the existence of EMTB, move on, make some different content, the sport is past the point of needing to be justified.

I’m also pretty sure if Steve Jones was doing some how-tos, it would erode the pride of some of the older riders less.

Just to jump back in. Just watched Blake’s tree tap video. It’s a good little film showing something that’s nothing like the riding I do. It’s an interesting insight into the mentality of a dirt jumper and why I’ll never do it. It also contains nothing of note in terms of advertising. A couple of minor product shots in passing.

Nowhere near as bad as, say Wimbledon or F1 or other mainstream TV sports.

Is there a YouTube channel/YouTuber that is balanced and honest? I’m properly sick of the ‘I just got this xxxx and it’s the best thing ever!’ Obviously they’ve been sent it/asked for it in order to say nice things about it, without context vs other similar stuff, in some cases because the usual outlets won’t *cough* Intend *cough*.

I don’t mean a ‘everything is shit’ hambini style rant, just someone who is honest about how they came by the thing that they are ‘reviewing’ and how it compares to other products on the market.

Or does the nature of YouTube mean that it’s adverts or nothing, zero objectivity.

It’s not the nature of YouTube, as you’ll notice the established MTB media post video reviews on there (Pinkbike, Bike, MBR etc.).

If you’re asking can “influencers” do impartial reviews, there’s a fundamental conflict there with the influencer model – they primarily exist as a marketing vessel, in terms of their earning anyway.

I’m sure there are some YouTubers posting honest reviews of their bikes & bits though. I sometimes write a blog with objective reviews, if I was younger (and not a writer by trade) I’d probably do it on YouTube. I doubt I’d make any money from it though.

Is there a YouTube channel/YouTuber that is balanced and honest?

DC Rainmaker…But let’s be honest, unless you’re actually interested in the thing he’s reviewing, would you watch them for entertainment? And there’s the plaguey-rub in all this. It’s different things innit. I watch Paul the Punter who does do some product pushing, but in very tongue in cheek way and it’s not pushy.

DC Rainmaker…But let’s be honest, unless you’re actually interested in the thing he’s reviewing, would you watch them for entertainment?

It’s hard enough to read his reviews when you’re actually looking to buy a Garmin.

But he’s another content creator who has added YouTube as a channel to his existing distribution model, I assume?

DC Rainmaker can get away with being critical as when he does a full review he buys the product himself so is under no obligation to the company. Not bike related but I have watched other YT who have said they won’t endorse something as either they don’t agree with the product or the company ethics even though they have been offered money to do so.

I quite enjoy Hard Tail Party’s reviews on YouTube. He can be brutally honest about stuff and only seems to endorse things he uses daily and really likes.

The recent first look on the Pole hartail frame was quite honest.

I watched a Remi Metallier vid last night (doing all the things I taught him, obvs), and the product placement was a single line “Presented to you by Gro-Pro” at the end of his introduction. Which I thought was pretty classy, as these thing go.

I feel a bit for content providers, It must be pretty hard to make a living from it. The occasional guff about a set of tyres or a helmet is not the end of the world in the grand scheme of things.

I don’t mind product placement in otherwise good content, it’s when stuff is presented as an ‘independant’ review, that irks.

Nick C

The occasional guff about a set of tyres or a helmet is not the end of the world in the grand scheme of things.

Agreed – I’ve no issue in content creators being upfront about the support they’re receiving. E.g. “We were sent this by XX Corp to review, and it’s actually pretty good” or “This year we’re being sponsored by YY Industries, so we’ll be telling you a lot more about their products”.

It’s when the product placement is presented under the guise of ‘news’ that I tune out.

Is there a YouTube channel/YouTuber that is balanced and honest?

Yep, Ola England. Admittedly you need to enjoy Swedish metal rather than bikes but he was talking about it just yesterday. If a company wants to send him stuff he tells them he will be honestly reviewing it and up to them. Some didn’t acknowledge that, he gave bad review and then now don’t send him stuff while others are fine with it.
He doesn’t seem to be as dependant on that side of things though as he has his own content, his own guitar company, his own bands, distributes his own music etc,.

It’s when the product placement is presented under the guise of ‘news’ that I tune out.

But in a past-time where the companies have such huge influence, this is always going to be a blurred line though isn’t it?. The first carbon wheelset is news, the 209th copy, less so. A 12speed wireless groupset that’s “affordable” is news, slight changes to the colour of the next model year of XT..,passing interest. I think on balance; GMBN get it mostly right.

It’d be interesting to see what different people consider as “product placement”.

OK, maybe not that interesting, but there might some cross-purposes going on.

In GMBN’s case, I see it as the bikes they ride – and which the cameras often linger over – and the occasional product-led video or social post.

They’ve never pretended to do objective bike reviews, have they?

If only they were using Steve Jones for that, instead of the eeb-evangelising.

tbh i like the GMBN stuff. Its quite positive and easy going. Nice to watch with a beer.

Yes they are faults but on the whole i bet its helped a lot of people.

If only they were using Steve Jones for that, instead of the eeb-evangelising.

Please God no!! At least on EMBN I can avoid him and his nonsense. Whenever he appears on the DSS or one of the other videos I turn off!

chakaping

It’d be interesting to see what different people consider as “product placement”.

As an example of where I see GMBN blurring there lines between ‘News’ and ‘Product Placement’: On a recent Tech Show, Doddy talked at some length about a new POC helmet and some sunnies as part of the ‘News’ section of the show. The whole segment just felt like he was regurgitating a press release whilst someone filled his pockets with twenty pound notes just out of shot.

I know in the bike industry that advertising can range from anywhere between “This content includes a paid promotion from xxx” to lingering shots of specific products (Red Bull sponsored riders shredits, anyone..?) and I’m genunely fine with either. I get it – you’ve got to get paid, and riding bikes is only ever a viable career if you can use your influence to shift a bit of product. It’s when the commercial incentives begin to colour the editorial content in such a way that the content creators think we won’t spot an advert that I take issue.

Doddy talked at some length about a new POC helmet and some sunnies as part of the ‘News’ section of the show. The whole segment just felt like he was regurgitating a press release

This is literally every bike website though

I’m not too bothered with product placement or even sponsored video as long as it’s made clear its a sponsored video.

This is literally every bike website though

yup, even if they aren’t getting paid for writing an article/doing a video of it specifically, seems that the “deal” is there is a
– release (spec sheet regurgitation)
– first ride (actual use of box fresh product by someone who constantly flits between box fresh products for a job)
– long term review (many months of use and a decent opinion given)

Only the last one is really of much use to the discerning buyer, but you don’t get free stuff to long term test without doing the first two.

They’ve never pretended to do objective bike reviews, have they?

They got a slap on the wrist from the ASA over some Wahoo content on GCN a couple of years ago for this.

If you want to see who sponsors them, ‘Read More’ in the video description – that’s where their sponsors are (or should be…) listed.

This post is brought to you by Square Space…..

Least it’s not NordVPN

Nope they’re all shilling something or other. Even the one’s who make a point of being real, rolling laughing emoji!

YT has become the extension of corporate marketing it was always intended to be, once the captive audience was large enough. Yes the old fashioned drug dealer tactic is pretty much standard practice for American tech/software businesses.

Has Doddy been reading this thread?

See the latest video where he recommends 10 accessories!

Full disclaimers. Excellent stuff.

Genuinely useful and (to me) interesting.

GMBN used to be a worthwhile watch but it’s disappeared up its own pipe recently. Can’t make it’s mind up what it should be doing.

A video released earlier this week: Are hardtail mountainbikes pointless?
A video released today: Is a hardtail mountainbike the only bike you need?

Can’t decide if it’s serious or not….

Kinda gave up on it as of late. Same with Pinned/ Tommy C after it went all e-bikey.

I like Juliet Elliot and a few over sorta vloggers, but not really watching any bigger MTB channels.

Not watched GMBN for ages. The content seems as though it’s aimed at noobs or youngsters. Very shouty. Too many skids.

Haven’t bothered with Seth bike hacks/berm peak.

The other Seth guy who builds features in his garden is a nice watch in a slow TV kinda way.

I’ll watch GCN and the occasional pink bike vids, along with a few random channels.

Paul the Punter lost me when he started crying that Scott weren’t supplying him with bikes. Putting a call out to bike manufacturers that he needed a bike reeked of desperation. Go and buy your own bikes you parasite.

GCN seems to have more relevant content despite the fact I don’t ride road. Their style is generally more professional and not so shouty and in your face.

I feel a bit for content providers, It must be pretty hard to make a living from it.

Zero sympathy. Either be good at what you do or go and get a proper job. Most YouTubers who rely on promoting various crap as opposed to making genuinely interesting or original content are vapid media whores who’ve seemingly not done a proper day’s work.

#Fckinflzr

Go and buy your own bikes you parasite

Lol I used to like his videos cause his riding was like mine but it’s changed so much there is hardly any riding done now. BKXC videos have changed too for the worst. Mine are just as crap as they usually are that’s if I ever make another proper video.

I am waiting for the Gmbn Pole Stamina review.

Zero sympathy. Either be good at what you do or go and get a proper job. Most YouTubers who rely on promoting various crap as opposed to making genuinely interesting or original content are vapid media whores who’ve seemingly not done a proper day’s work.

But… don’t you want to check out their ULTIMATE MTB camper dream build?

I suspect most moderately popular MTB YouTubers are barely scratching a living, and are mainly in it for the free stuff and the perceived status.

Maybe it’s not their fault they don’t know how to make good content, or that they come across as smug, or that they have to put out increasing volumes of dull, pointless videos as they try to try to chase revenue.

OK, maybe it is. But I notice a common theme is that YTers “aren’t as good as they used to be”. This links back to the original discussion about GMBN – it’s bloody hard to come up with really good content propositions week-in week-out. The ideas run out and you revert to formulas.

What seems like a dream job could quickly become a cross to bear.

I suspect most moderately popular MTB YouTubers are barely scratching a living, and are mainly in it for the free stuff and the perceived status.

I suspect for a lot of them it’s the equivalent of doing a Saturday shift in an LBS every once in a while for the trade prices, whilst having a proper job during the week, and very few ‘turn pro’.

Paul the Punter lost me when he started crying that Scott weren’t supplying him with bikes. Putting a call out to bike manufacturers that he needed a bike reeked of desperation. Go and buy your own bikes you parasite.

Think it worked for him, though. But yes, seemed a bit desperate. I got bored with BKXC because he seemed to think that visiting states with complete Covid lockdowns was OK for his ‘dull rides everywhere’ feature. Plus his little whoop/laugh thing that sounds like Bo Selecta’s Michael Jackson…

I suspect for a lot of them it’s the equivalent of doing a Saturday shift in an LBS every once in a while for the trade prices, whilst having a proper job during the week, and very few ‘turn pro’.

Totally agree. I was thinking more of the “vanlife” types, but what you describe is more common I’m sure.

for his ‘dull rides everywhere’ feature

Those were some really crap trails he rode

Not watched GMBN for ages. The content seems as though it’s aimed at noobs or youngsters. Very shouty. Too many skids.

Haven’t bothered with Seth bike hacks/berm peak.

The other Seth guy who builds features in his garden is a nice watch in a slow TV kinda way.

I’ll watch GCN and the occasional pink bike vids, along with a few random channels.

Paul the Punter lost me when he started crying that Scott weren’t supplying him with bikes. Putting a call out to bike manufacturers that he needed a bike reeked of desperation. Go and buy your own bikes you parasite.

GCN seems to have more relevant content despite the fact I don’t ride road. Their style is generally more professional and not so shouty and in your face.

I feel a bit for content providers, It must be pretty hard to make a living from it.

Zero sympathy. Either be good at what you do or go and get a proper job. Most YouTubers who rely on promoting various crap as opposed to making genuinely interesting or original content are vapid media whores who’ve seemingly not done a proper day’s work.

Never understood PTP and how he managed to blag a ride on Scott, didn’t set the world alight with his riding or wrenching. Scott Laughland is really good, polished, informative content with value.

Vast majority of mags, youtubers rarely add any value to the reviews, just spouting whats in the blurb. Paul Aston was good, as wass the NSMB and Bikemag, they pushed pinkbike to up their game.

3 pages in and no mention of Sam Pilgrim tearing up parks and footy pitches on his electric motorbike?

it’s bloody hard to come up with really good content propositions week-in week-out. The ideas run out and you revert to formulas

This is the problem in a nutshell I think. I don’t envy them trying to think up new ideas for weekly videos that quickly become very repetitive. It was getting boring long before Covid ruined everything. GMBN morphed into MBUK ages ago.

I think the solution is probably to do seasons like they do on Mighty Car Mods. Have an idea, document it, finish it then take a break. Then think of something new and come back. That’s how I would do it, but I’m not a pathological attention seeker and I hate being on camera.

The only channel I’ve been watching regularly in the last year is Storror and that’s mostly because I slept on it and can go back and catch up on all their best stuff while they’re trapped in the UK struggling for ideas every week.

Even my mrs. likes it. She says it’s because it’s rare to see a group of young lads who are really nice to each other and don’t act like dicks all the time. It’s either that or because they’re all ripped young hunks.