First proper eMTB ride revelations

Had some interesting noticings. For context this was on a “lite” bike.

Any such things yourself?

Not running so hot. Sweaty but not dripping, so need to squeeze out my helmet pad so often, and don’t chill so quick when stopped in a windy spot. I put it in turbo on the way back on some doubletrack, I actually got cold presumably due to the wind chill of speed and not generating as much heat myself.

Forgetting to drink enough. Arriving at the top of a climb half wasted, out of breath, and all hot and sweaty must be a natural trigger to take a good gulp.

Leg cramps due to never having to get off and push. I get these sometimes towards the end of a long ride on my normal bike, usually on a long climb or descent. The solution is always to walk for a bit (stretches don’t help). Didn’t have to push any climbs so no walking, so I got the onset of cramps despite the ride being less of an effort overall. I guess my legs don’t like full time cycling and need walking now and again.

Shifted gears almost 1000 times over 45km. Count is from AXS. I didn’t have a guess beforehand but that’s a big number. Battery still showing full. Makes you appreciate how much cables and mechanical shifters last.

Using gears 2-9 about the same amount of time, 1st (52T) twice as much, and 10-12 almost never. That’s with a 32T chainring (smallest available), using eco most of the time. Glad I replaced the factory 34T. I’ll have to see if that aluminium big cog is what renders the cassette worn first.

Having energy for the descents makes a huge difference, I’m sure I was doing wheel lifts, hops, pumping a lot better despite the bike being 4kg heavier and 20mm longer chainstays.

Overtaking other eMTB riders on climbs, who were using absolutely glacial cadence on full power bikes.

Being overtaken by someone on a normal bike while climbing in eco mode (100W assist).

No idea if that day was better for my fitness vs. a normal bike day, definitely wasn’t as knackered by the end and I mostly used eco. Going to try and avoid the temptation to pair my Garmin watch heart rate sensor and be nerdy about it. 50km, 1300m ascent, no pushing. Normal bike sameish route with fewer trail repeats would be 35km, 900m ascent, of which 250m pushed due to being steepish and near the end of the ride.

I’m still new at eMTBs. I have several weeks on my lite e-bike. I did measure my heart rate on two short trails, just to try to see the contrast. My max and average heart rate drop by about 20 on the e-bike. But to balance that, certainly in deçent weather, I was going 50-100% further.

like yourself, I’ve noticed that I sweat less. I used to be a total sweaty mess at the end of any decent ride. Also, I can  now make techy climbs that beat me on my normal bikes. In fact, I’ve found myself riding back down just to ride some of my favourite technical climbs more than once. That’s not something I’d have the legs to do on my normal bike.

i had my first hike a bike on my e-bike yesterday. Even though my bike is only 18kg, I thought it was going to kill me! Still, I was able to ride a lot that I would have been pushing before. And I’m fairly confident I enjoyed it more.

like yourself, I’ve found myself enjoying the good bits more than ever – presumably due to being less knackered.

but the consensus seems to be that our fitness will definitely suffer. I’m prepared to work with that, because the benefits are so noticeable for me.

I have a question.

When we were cycling round Ballater we cycled up to Loch Muich and we are used to being passed by people on eBikes. On the way back is a long and gradual descent and we seemed to catch up with and pass people on eBikes who were pedaling down the slope.

What happens when you go downhill? What does it feel like?

What happens when you go downhill? What does it feel like?

Assuming we’re talking about a typical ‘proper’ mid motor mtb from one of the main brands (I can’t speak for home made specials, or Halford specials) It feels like a normal mountain bike, but a few kilos heavier, which gives slightly different characteristics when descending, but not hugely different. Emtb can plough through rocks/rough stuff better than a regaulr mtb, but are a bit less responsive to braking and changing direction (because of the extra weight). It freewheels/coasts like a normal mountain bike.

I’m going to guess that you caught these people up because they weren’t as proficient at descending as you are.

I think quite a proportion of emtbers have never actually ridden a regular mtb any significant amount, so may not have the experience and skills an average regular mtber who’s been riding for 20 years might have at descending.

I think they were people on hire bikes, so probably not very experienced cyclists. The track is as non technical as you can get and I was not pushing on as I am fatter than my partner and she has less natural momentum.
I guess I am going to have to hire an eBike and find out.
I have a fear that if I try one I will want one.

I have a fear that if I try one I will want one.

You will want one, but treat it as a different sport to non assisted mountain biking. I’ve had a Whyte E-160 (which is heavy by ebike standards) for about  15 months now and it there are places I’ve ridden that would definitely be more fun on a normal bike but on the whole I’ve got no regrets about buying it. The weight makes it a handful on slower steep techy switchbacks and also on fast stuff with quick changes of direction, but being able to do 8000ft of climbing in a day where I’d usually manage about 4500ft,  as well as an hour on turbo after a 10hr shift at work makes it more than worth buying to me. It also means climbs that wouldn’t be possible on a normal bike aren’t just possible but are actually fun to attempt.  I’ve no plans to get rid of my trail bike but the ebike has been a game changer for me personally

Going to try and avoid the temptation to pair my Garmin watch heart rate sensor and be nerdy about it

I am still waiting for my first emtb (orbea Rise) to arrive, but when I tested a few back in May my heart rate was just as high as it was on an analogue bike. That could have been because I was trying to get as many runs in as possible on the day.

I guess it depends why your bought an ebike, and what you like riding. I like riding uphill so maybe my hr will remain high, but my ultimate aim is to still do the climbs and keep going for longer.

What happens when you go downhill? What does it feel like?

They all feel different depending on the motors, I am in the e-curious camp and have demo’d some ebikes. I found some motors that you pedal to the limit and then its like hitting a wall almost when the assist goes and then the motor is draggy and slows you back down, whilst others have been less draggy and felt like you could sprint past the assist limit with no issues other then a slightly heacvier bike, but its more planted.

I am still waiting for my first emtb (orbea Rise) to arrive,

A mate of mine has been waiting over 6 months for a new battery for his Rise (warranty claim, due to water ingress according to the shop he’s dealing with) , last he heard was basically ‘we don’t know when we’ll be able to get one’. He’s not a happy man

E-bikes are fun and definitely make climbing easier, leaving you less tired for descending. I’ll be on one eventually, just not quite yet, even then I think it will be a ‘light’ version.

Also I reckon one benefit of e-bikes that is underplayed, is keeping your heartrate down, I don’t think maxing my heartrate on the bike (or anytime) is healthy for a mid forties dad with a bit of a belly.

A bit like a brisk walk being better for your overall health compared to running. Just a thought.

https://health.clevelandclinic.org/walking-vs-running

Drink more as that can help reduce cramps as well…maybe have an electrolyte mix to keep drinking from.

Also I reckon one benefit of e-bikes that is underplayed, is keeping your heartrate down, I don’t think maxing my heartrate on the bike (or anytime) is healthy for a mid forties dad with a bit of a belly.

Mid-forties? Mid-forties?

“I don’t think maxing my heartrate on the bike (or anytime) is healthy for a mid forties dad with a bit of a belly.”

That seems unlikely to be true. In any event you’re probably not going to max your HR cycling, running max HR is normally a bit higher as more muscle groups involved.

Also I reckon one benefit of e-bikes that is underplayed, is keeping your heartrate down, I don’t think maxing my heartrate on the bike (or anytime) is healthy for a mid forties dad with a bit of a belly.

Maybe look at golf as well? Combines walking with mild resistance training and low HRs – win!!

Had some interesting noticings. For context this was on a “lite” bike.

Any such things yourself?

Not running so hot. Sweaty but not dripping, so need to squeeze out my helmet pad so often, and don’t chill so quick when stopped in a windy spot. I put it in turbo on the way back on some doubletrack, I actually got cold presumably due to the wind chill of speed and not generating as much heat myself.

Forgetting to drink enough. Arriving at the top of a climb half wasted, out of breath, and all hot and sweaty must be a natural trigger to take a good gulp.

Leg cramps due to never having to get off and push. I get these sometimes towards the end of a long ride on my normal bike, usually on a long climb or descent. The solution is always to walk for a bit (stretches don’t help). Didn’t have to push any climbs so no walking, so I got the onset of cramps despite the ride being less of an effort overall. I guess my legs don’t like full time cycling and need walking now and again.

Shifted gears almost 1000 times over 45km. Count is from AXS. I didn’t have a guess beforehand but that’s a big number. Battery still showing full. Makes you appreciate how much cables and mechanical shifters last.

Using gears 2-9 about the same amount of time, 1st (52T) twice as much, and 10-12 almost never. That’s with a 32T chainring (smallest available), using eco most of the time. Glad I replaced the factory 34T. I’ll have to see if that aluminium big cog is what renders the cassette worn first.

Having energy for the descents makes a huge difference, I’m sure I was doing wheel lifts, hops, pumping a lot better despite the bike being 4kg heavier and 20mm longer chainstays.

Overtaking other eMTB riders on climbs, who were using absolutely glacial cadence on full power bikes.

Being overtaken by someone on a normal bike while climbing in eco mode (100W assist).

No idea if that day was better for my fitness vs. a normal bike day, definitely wasn’t as knackered by the end and I mostly used eco. Going to try and avoid the temptation to pair my Garmin watch heart rate sensor and be nerdy about it. 50km, 1300m ascent, no pushing. Normal bike sameish route with fewer trail repeats would be 35km, 900m ascent, of which 250m pushed due to being steepish and near the end of the ride.

Did you enjoy yourself at all?

As a non ebiker my observation is that eMTBers wear more clothing.

Not sure how to link an Instagram Reel but reading the OP it seems he needs to learn the Emtb riders mantra 🙂

https://www.instagram.com/p/C7NPck9IfKw/

Being overtaken by someone on a normal bike while climbing in eco mode (100W assist).

That’s one of my lads party tricks…It is a matter of stubbornness that he keeps up or overtakes eBikes.
Bloody twenty something year olds.

Did you enjoy yourself at all?

Yes!

When I’m not riding bikes I like thinking and talking about riding bikes. As we do on this very bike forum.

Ive demo’d a good few e-bikes, one thing I really dislike is the on/off feeling when the speed limiter kicks in and disengages the motor. Feels like an actual brake on some of them.

Using an ebike to keep your heart rate down as a positive?

Yeah sure if you have a medical condition that means you shouldn’t go hard (have a mate who suffered from that), otherwise that is a poor excuse to be a lazy arse

Which eeeeeb did you buy in the end b&b?

@Ewan

That seems unlikely to be true. In any event you’re probably not going to max your HR cycling, running max HR is normally a bit higher as more muscle groups involved.

Nice to know that you know more about me than I do.

As for golf, I think an e-bike would be cheaper than the cost of replacing all the golf balls I’d lose.

I still think that as a ‘health’ point of view, riding in zone 2-3 for longer periods would be better for most people than the zone 4 (and briefly zone 5) that can be reached when riding off-road on proper steep off climbs and muddy conditions.

https://health.clevelandclinic.org/exercise-heart-rate-zones-explained

Using an ebike to keep your heart rate down as a positive?

Yeah sure if you have a medical condition that means you shouldn’t go hard (have a mate who suffered from that), otherwise that is a poor excuse to be a lazy arse

I think like anything there is balance. I am no expert, but I think there is now research that shows as you get older max efforts etc can do more harm than good for your heart.

I am 50, and cant be arsed ‘training’ to get fit, as its always going to be a loosing battle now. I just want to keep fit and do the stuff I did as a fit young kid, and an ebike definitely enables me to do that !

Ive demo’d a good few e-bikes, one thing I really dislike is the on/off feeling when the speed limiter kicks in and disengages the motor. Feels like an actual brake on some of them.

Far worse on full-fat bikes than SL’s, I don’t even notice it on my Kenevo SL.

Also, this only really occurs when you’re riding on tarmac or up a fire road – so probably going far faster than you would on a normal bike, either pedal harder or go and buy a motorbike.

I still think that as a ‘health’ point of view, riding in zone 2-3 for longer periods would be better for most people than the zone 4 (and briefly zone 5) that can be reached when riding off-road on proper steep off climbs and muddy conditions.

Isn’t the point – as per Joe Friel etc – that you mix zone 1.2 riding with occasional shorter, harder efforts, which is pretty much what happens if you ride a conventional mountain bike aggressively on undulating/technical terrain. It’s not ‘either / or’ you can do both?

Which eeeeeb did you buy in the end b&b?

Mondraker Neat.

A compromise between everything I liked and disliked about Bosch SX, Specialized SL 1.2, TQ HPR50, and the bikes they come in.

Was offered a good price on an in stock 2024 model, and didn’t see rumours of anything appealing coming next year so went for it.

I was hoping to like the Bosch SX, and wait for Bird/Ethic’s SL sometime next year. But that clutch rattle killed it for me, and to a lesser extent the fixed batteries.

I absolutely love ebikes. Full power so my spectrum of assistance is greater. Game changer .

Ive demo’d a good few e-bikes, one thing I really dislike is the on/off feeling when the speed limiter kicks in and disengages the motor. Feels like an actual brake on some of them.

You can make that not happen you know 😉

But don’t tell STW, they’ll probably get a bit preachy…

 I don’t think maxing my heartrate on the bike (or anytime) is healthy for a mid forties dad with a bit of a belly.

Where on earth does this idea come from? Probably more at risk for not hitting your max heart rate.

but I think there is now research that shows as you get older max efforts etc can do more harm than good for your heart.

Links please.

Nice to know that you know more about me than I do.

Of course I don’t know more about you. However most people have higher running heart rates, however unless you run and do intervals at flat out pace you may not find this out. Obviously that’s a generality and you may happen to have a max HR that’s higher for cycling. But for most people that is not the case.

There is lots of evidence that intense exercise, including hitting max HR is good for you. Even if you’re middle aged. Obviously no reason you can’t hit max HR on a ebike.

Links please.

Ok perhaps I didnt phrase that quite correctly, but as you get older high intensity wont get you the best outcome for your training. See 14:44

Google and get through the marketing stuff and you get similar.

no reason you can’t hit max HR on a ebike.

Agreed – I touched a higher heart rate on the ebike demo day I did than the previous year riding analogue bikes

poor excuse to be a lazy arse

Basically this.

Ok perhaps I didnt phrase that quite correctly, but as you get older high intensity wont get you the best outcome for your training.

That’s very, very different to stating that hard efforts are somehow harmful.

I’m becoming e-bike curious! My main reason for getting one will be because many of my riding buddies have or are heading that way.  I ride with e-bikers (who keep to the group going up hill) and it works but the other way it doesn’t. I would put my self down as a fit 50 year old certainly not ready to give up peddling. Anyone been in a similar position and made the leap to battery powered mtbing?

Ive demo’d a good few e-bikes, one thing I really dislike is the on/off feeling when the speed limiter kicks in and disengages the motor. Feels like an actual brake on some of them.

you get used to it.

the more assist you have on the worse the feeling is. Its not a brake. you still roll normally. its your body noticing how much assistance you got previousy. you can still go faster by pedalling its just the same effeort as it would be on normal bike (well maybe a bit more due to motor friction but not that much) i can happily pedal my shinamo e8000 with no assist and this is supposed to be quite a draggy motor.

if i’m doing a longer ride i’ll turn off assist on the flat/slightly downhill bits as its a waste of battery (i havent got a huge battery). I`ve my motor settings de-tuned to teh least assistance as max power is just bonkers. I can easily ride over the motor assist threshold on the flat/slightly uphill. 15mph isnt that fast.

I love that video, Nick Craig breezing up my local mountain bike climbs on a gravel bike without even breaking a sweat, while telling Simon Richardson that he basically just rides around a bit for fun and does the occasional harder blast when he feels like it. Oh, and it still finishing top-ten elite in his early 50s…

I don’t entirely get why every thread about e-bkes seems to descend into some sort of attempt to either justify or condemn them in a black-and-white style. They are just what they are and what you do with them is your call. My take is that if they make people happy, then great. You can use them to minimise your effort if you choose, or to hammer yourself senseless, or anything in between. It’s a continuum, not one thing or another.

Actually tbf I do get it, but it seems pointless to me.

I don’t entirely get why every thread about e-bkes seems to descend into some sort of attempt to either justify or condemn them in a black-and-white style.

I don’t think anyone on this thread has been condemning ebikes.

But claims that riding a regular bike is somehow harmful to your health (with claims of research) are frankly irresponsible.

Yea i bought a second hand Mondraker Neat recently from a local bike shop. Brand new motor so i was quite happy with that.

It is living up to everything i hoped it would be. My local loops are all boring slogs up with great descents and i wanted to spend less time going up and more down. And so far i seem to be achieving that aim.

Im very impressed with the TQ motor. Quiet and very unobtrusive. I don’t feel any weird start stops the way i did when i used a mates Orbea Rise. But like everything you get used to certain characteristics and adapt accordingly.

I do get a bit of power panic if im stretching the riding out. A range extended might be on the cards for next year.

As a mate once said to me, who cares what you ride as long as you are having fun. I think more people on here could adopt that attitude 🙂