FFS – anything to rip us off…

LINK THAT WORKS

http://www.talktalk.co.uk/news/pa/uknews/2010/08/23/drivers-face-work-car-park-charges.html?lpos=tat-links-1-news_pa&lid=tat-links-1-driversfaceworkcarparkcharges

sorry, struggling to get worked up about it. Don't most places charge anyway?

I pay £250/ yr now to park at work at a hospital site. Neither this or the levies that we'll get from Notts City make any dispensation for those of us that need vehicles for on-call/ emergency response. A lot of the big companies in Nottingham have already stated that they will move out of the City area to avoid it.

motorist wakes from 30 year coma shock…
do you really think parking should be free?

the simple fact is, the roads are full up and unsustainable.

The plan for road pricing was knocked back so they have to come up with an alternative such as raising fuel duty, parking charges etc..

"do you really think parking should be free?"

Yes.

motorist wakes from 30 year coma shock…
do you really think parking should be free?

In a word YES, why not? due to the fact that I believe I contribute enough into the system.. I pay tax etc, council tax, vat on most products I buy, vat on utilities.. I dont get free parking the majority of times – in fact I dont get anything free!!! now it seems I need to be 'taxed' again for the joy of parking my car to sustain the above…

What companies need I reckon are tax incentives to allow employees, where appropriate, to work from home. WFH is fairly prevalent in our company these days & doing the occasional M4 commute now just feels antiquated and an enormous waste of time and resources. Obviously it can only apply to people with a certain kind of job, but my guess would be that a large proportion of the drones in single-occupancy cars during rush hour are desk jockeys (including myself until a few years ago).

I don't disagree with the principle but do disagree with the way it is going to be implemented in Nottingham. It should be restricted to the city centre only, where there is frequent public transport as an alternative. It shouldn't include the whole Nottingham City Council area, the hospitals and industrial estates such as Lenton Lane. People working in these places are restricted using public transport due to shift work and/or poor public transport links. The park and ride sites are within the city council boundary so they can hardly say they're trying to stop people driving into these areas.

Aren't Boots just going to build a multi storey adjacent to their current car park but just over the border in Broxtowe? 🙂

Drivers are already charged where i work (goes to pay for the use of the facilities they use – after all as someone who doesn't drive to work i don't want to subsidise their parking place).

Thought it was standard practice, but agree it has to be done with the limitations of the public transport network in mind.

And despite the cost of parking rising it doesn't appear to put too many people off driving – the permit system is over subscribed every year.

Certainly in Nottingham, it's not going to be a case of charging for on street parking etc. – they already do that.

What they're going to do is charge workplaces for providing their own car parking. It's a tax on parking spaces.

If businesses actually do move out of the city centre, I can see it changing Nottingham quite dramatically – lots of restaurants and bars will be reliant on lunch trade, as will lots of shops. Ultimately, if it goes the wrong way, it could end up like Sheffield, with a half closed city centre and most the decent restaurants out in the suburbs, and a big out of town shopping centre.

The above point on shift workers is an interesting one – it could make for a very regressive tax.

the simple fact is, the roads are full up and unsustainable.

Nonsense. Maybe in central london.

I don't believe the council should be able to charge for employers allowing parking on their own land – that's a farce. Many of the companies have purchased a place specifically so they can offer their employees facilities that meet their needs, and pay rates based on those larger properties. To add more taxation to that is just money grabbing without justification and it just adds to the number of reasons people are not willing to invest in the UK.

This comes up every now and again. If a company has 1000 spaces are they going to pay the tax – why should they if they own the land? Or are the employees to pay? If it's the employees then is it a flat charge per year or a pay as you go? If the employee is to pay then who will administer it and where will that charge be added to ? What happens if it's a flat charge to have a space so you choose to go by bus except for the occasional days you need the car 'cos you've got, for example, a hospital appointment.

IMO too difficult to set up and administer. Go the polluter pays route – add tax to petrol so that the more miles you do in an uneconomical vehicle the more you pay.

But you're assuming there's a need to do so Dave – what is it that they're going to use the taxes on exactly? What is it that the car-park space does that needs investment? Air quality is pretty much fine in most cities, CO2 output is clearly important but how does the tax help reduce that?

i hear there are other ways of travel that dont screw up the enviroment, help keep you fit and cost very little….

nah, they'll never catch on

But you're assuming there's a need to do so Dave – what is it that they're going to use the taxes on exactly?

I believe the extra tax is to fund the tram

I actually car share.. so over a year a percentage of the time my car is at home, as is the same for the person I share with, its not exactly 50/50 due to flex holidays etc but as tesco states "every little helps".
So, would I need a full years subscription or be entitled to a discount off the local council?

what is it that they're going to use the taxes on exactly?

In Nottingham, it's more tram lines. I do wonder how they've decided where they'll go though. A park and ride in Clifton seems a bit pointless – there's already a train station next to Clifton power station, and the A453 is enough of a nightmare that you wouldn't bother carrying on any further than you had to.

i hear there are other ways of travel that dont screw up the enviroment, help keep you fit and cost very little….

Yeah, only really possible for a fairly small percentage of the population. And as above, I car share with people at different places of work. Why should my work/me pay for parking my car and not others – if they're going to ahve to pay per employee/space then everyone will drive their own car. If it's charged per employee, no-one is going to want to go down the "now can you pay me your portion of my parking tax please" route.

Trams – another questionable waste of time.

IMO too difficult to set up and administer

Council already charges domestic rates on the proprty, they just adjust it to take into account the parking spaces. It is then up to the employing compnay to decide if/how they charge the employees. Easy peesy.

the nottingham case was introduced to fill the £m's that Notts County Council pulled out of the new tram line when it went tory so the city council had to get money from somewhere the Work Parking Levy (WPL) was their plan. The tram line is now on longterm hold if not cancelled forever, the WPL is still going ahead tho. Bonkers!

yer might help adjust people habits – i know there are loads bods that drive 1.5miles to work…. every day, on their own

quicker to walk when compared to going up levels in a multi storey etc and sitting in queues

But you're assuming there's a need to do so Dave – what is it that they're going to use the taxes on exactly?

The need is to fund the UK tax system pot which then gets spent on anything the central or local Government decides (roads, public pensions, paying off debt, C2W scheme, refuse collection). A flat rate of tax be it car parking charge, yearly car tax, local community charge tax (or whatever it's called now) does not tax people on how much they do something. Hence I would prefer a tax where the amount you do something – drive your car or send rubbish to landfill is preferable. Though a land fill tax would be virtually unenforceable IMO.

EDIT – OK, so people driving 1.5 miles to work wouldn't be affected by a pay as you go tax.

If the cost is passed onto the employee – Isnt this just going to make people park on the roads to aviod the charges ?

In most UK city & town centres, it's not possible to park on the road for free.

But the nottingham scheme is not limited to the city centre. It covers everything within the city boundaries – residential areas, industrial estates, hospitals etc, and a lot of there places have no parking restrictions in place. Even The city centre you can park for free on Sundays and after 6pm

was thinking of areas where parking on the street isnt charged such as the industrial estate near the queens drive park and drive (its been a while since i was there tho !)

Providing parking to employees is a benefit that those that don't need it don't get. Either those that don't need the parking should get something or those that use the parking should pay – if all is to be fair anyway.

free parking from work is a benefit in kind.

It doesn't make sense because if people stop travelling by car in order to save the cost of the parking space the company is still going to have to pay for providing the empty space.

eve on stw any perceived threat to our human right to drive polution where we like, when we like, at any speed we like and park/abandon it where we like is met with resistance…you do realise that that one day the oil that powers said device will run out and you will have to do something different dont you?

Yeah, only really possible[commuting by car] for a fairly small percentage of the population

Any figures to back that up? what perecentage of the population using a car drive less than 5 miles to work or 10 miles to work each way? At my work that distance [10]covers every employee here except two. I am one of those and I cycle in.

charging more and more for car use is just a way to extract cash and does little to reduce usage in situations where people have no alterntive. If the powers that be really wanted fewer cars on the road then they would provide alterntives that are more appealling, for example, lots of good cycle lanes, secure bike parking and showers per x number of staff. They would also encourage working from home.

I'm normally all for car use reduction schemes but this one seems a bit rough, even though it won't effect me as I walk or ride to work. Charging companies tax for what they do with their own land is not going to entice employers to increase the facilities for making riding to work or running company buses.

Also – those employers that already charge their employees to park – I'm guessing they will passing on the extra tax too – that could be very expensive.

I'm not sure what will happen to employers like mine – because they have no shortage of land (in the countryside on 120 acre site, but classified as south Hampshire so will get caught be this) there are plenty more spaces than needed and lots of random bits of road where people park. Will they have to grass half of it over to avoid a massive bill?

I can't really get worked up about it. It already costs me ~£250 a year to park my car at work. Well, it would do if I drove to work, but a don't 🙂
We have showers, secure cycle parking and specific bus services, but plenty of my work colleagues who live just a couple of miles a way are quite happy to cough up the money, carry on driving, and complain that they're being ripped off.

Yeah, only really possible for a fairly small percentage of the population

And what is the sole reason society has changed to allow us to commute large distances to work? The car.
Cars have changed the way we live our lives, and when the fossil fuel runs out some people are going to be in for an almighty great big shock.

Devils advocate – but should a bit of tarmac cost ~£250 and a secure cycle facility and a shower be free?

With tax added that ~£250 could become ~£500 and you might find yourself sharing that shower!

Though a land fill tax would be virtually unenforceable I

we already have a landfill tax – current £48per tonne normal or £2.50 tonne qualifying materials.