[Closed] Enclosed drive

The final Nuseti production model is expected to weigh 10.7kg

As the chain isn't directly involved in the gear-changing process it's almost impossible to break, and it's constantly lubricated by the oil sealed inside the framework.

Didn't Nick Larson (owner of Charge bikes) do a beach bike with enclosed drive years ago ?! Think when he was with Pashley.

Weight will be an issue also the frictional losses from the drive system and extra complication as well.

Reading town bike hire scheme use prop driven bikes - not a bad idea for their intended use..

Reading town bike hire scheme use prop driven bikes - not a bad idea for their intended use..

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Awesome...

Interested to see how you do swap the chain out...

Completely sealed from the elements and oil bath lubricated, it'll last 10's of thousands of miles.

Saw a few old bikes at the Yorkshire bike show the other weekend with enclosed drive, oil bath was used to lube the chain, BB and rear hub.
Its not the future, its the past!

Been done before, admittedly with a rohloff

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Or it will snap under load, unbreakable chains go with unsinkable ships like the Titanic

All speculation of course, as it's a development project so they've probably not done any accelerated testing but I'd risk that far more than an unproven carbon frame and £4k+ to a upstart comapany.

Think it's been up before, the weight is ridiculous considering it's carbon.

Eh? 23.5lbs for £3750? Not that bad!

Yeah, honestly the "unbreakable" chain claims were low down. Considering I can get a 100mm 29r full sus for that sort of money coming in at 10kg.

It also looks rubbish

Considering I can get a 100mm 29r full sus for that sort of money coming in at 10kg.

Can you?

It's 100g lighter than the Canyon Lux 9.9 CF at a similar price, and 1.5kg heavier than the Grand Canyon CF SLX 9.9 Team - which is a full on XC race spec. I'm not saying it's the lightest thing out there, but it's hardly an anvil!

Rocky Element Carbons come in around that mark. A hard tail should be coming in less than that.

I wonder if the chain will slap the insides of the frame making loads of noise?

Surely arguing weight is a moot point? Was it principally designed to be light? And its certainly not heavy is it? The only issue I can see is making a maintenance free bike then sticking a Fox on it.

I wonder if the chain will slap the insides of the frame making loads of noise?

There wouldn't be any slack to bounce would there?

Rocky Element Carbons come in around that mark. A hard tail should be coming in less than that.

Do they? [url= http://www.bikerumor.com/2013/01/31/long-term-review-rocky-mountain/ ]BikeRumor's 970RSL[/url] is 26lb 5oz. So nearly 3lbs heavier for a bike retailing at $5000...?

Why should a hardtail be less? Who says? Giant, Trek and Specialized offerings aren't.

I like that. Unenclosed derailleur systems are fragile, open to the elements, get filthy and wear out quickly. A fully enclosed transmission makes perfect sense, especially for mountain bikes.

It also looks rubbish

I totatlly disagree. I think it loks good:

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Unenclosed derailleur systems are [b]relatively[/b] fragile, open to the elements, get filthy and wear out [b]relatively[/b] quickly.

And are light and efficient and generally relatively cheap.

And therein lies the problem. Derailleur systems are far from perfect but they're a very good compromise for what most people actually want.

Ok let's not ever bother trying to find better solutions to antythng then. 🙄

It would be the 990's and we are getting better prices over here in Oz. They are hitting the 10kg mark the 970 is the same frame and a 1x conversion gets you fairly close.

But that's not what's been said. It's great that people are working on this as that will eventually get us there. We're just not there yet so I'll be keeping my money and letting others pay for the R&D 🙂

TBh it looks a lot better than I anticipated... I'd have nothing against owning one that's for sure.

Or it will snap under load, unbreakable chains go with unsinkable ships like the Titanic.

Thousands of cars on the road that use a chain to connect the bottom half of the engine to the top, they will happily cover tens of thousands of miles with no attention whatsoever, it's not very often they snap.

Could be a winter bike winner if they get the weight / pricing down to competitive levels.

I think it's pretty cool but would have to wait until gen 3 or 4 before I tried it out, early adoption isn't my thing.

It would be the 990's and we are getting better prices over here in Oz. They are hitting the 10kg mark the 970 is the same frame and a 1x conversion gets you fairly close.

So it's heavier than a more expensive bike, which is designed to be light. Or lighter than a similarly priced bike if you fit some lightweight parts to it?

Not convinced we're looking at an apples:apples comparison here...

You could save a kilo out of the Nuseti too - wheels and finishing kit. Would 9.7kg be acceptable?

Looks like a pinion p18 gearbox with enclosed chain. I'm all for people developing sealed systems, just love the fit and forget nature of them. Dangly derailleurs may be light and cheap but they get manky and are highly vulnerable to the slightest knock, misalignment and premature wear. Sure these internal gear systems are heavy and expensive, so were computers and CD players when first introduced. Give it time....

probably but still think it's pig ugly, not convinced by longevity of chains, it's going to be a lot thinner than automotive ones and if it does pop the replacement looks like a nightmare - the modern equivalent of glued in batteries. Current 1x drivetrains have gone a long way to give good spreads and good chain retention. On top of that what is the real benefit to running an external chain from a gearbox in the frame with easily accessible tensioners etc.

I reckon that's OK.
Now can we have a bouncy version please.

mikewsmith - Member

probably but still think it's pig ugly, not convinced by longevity of chains, it's going to be a lot thinner than automotive ones and if it does pop the replacement looks like a nightmare - the modern equivalent of glued in batteries. Current 1x drivetrains have gone a long way to give good spreads and good chain retention. On top of that what is the real benefit to running an external chain from a gearbox in the frame with easily accessible tensioners etc.

Motorbike camchains are only about 10mm x 5mm links, so I can't see them needing to be smaller than that in the above application. Add to the fact you're putting minimal power through them, can't see why they wouldn't last a VERY long time.

Even if the chain should last thousands of miles, there's always a chance of a snap, just as can happen with cars. Rare perhaps, but if it happens a new bike is a costly expense to fix it!

Or maybe they can just warranty the chain and replace the bike in the rare chance it does snap.

Still looks ugly though. I prefer that Katz.

Replacing the chain might be a pain in the arse but where does this idea of replacing the bike come from 😕 Right hand casing off gearbox, and it looks like similar at the back.

It's a serious workshop job though, lots of dangling chains down slots etc. then you need to refill it with oil and get the covers back on without getting crap in it. Sounds like at least a 3 hand job. Maybe not the top of the list but is it worth it?

but if it happens a new bike is a costly expense to fix it

It might be fiddly and annoying to fix, not impossible.

There has to be access to assemble it and for service/oil change, might be a bit awkward on the trail but it's hardly 'new bike' to fix territory.

Maybe not the top of the list but is it worth it?

Depends, at what point does it become worth it?

Would a drivetrain that lasts a decade or more with nothing but occasional oil changes make it worth it?

A drivetrain that's not vulnerable to being bashed or knocked?

I'm sure for some pople it won't be, but for others it could be.
Sounds like you've already written it off because it might not work [i]for you right now[/i].

An we're already speculating about the maintenance side of it, it's entirely possible ease of serviceability is right up there at the top of their design spec and it could be a one-allen-key, 10min job.

I would love an enclosed chain tbh. This is a great solution I reckon.

It's enclosing the [b]gearbox [/b]that is the real step forward. Motorbikes, including dirtbikes, work with external [b]chains [/b]just fine.

mikewsmith - Member

It's a serious workshop job though, lots of dangling chains down slots etc. then you need to refill it with oil and get the covers back on without getting crap in it. Sounds like at least a 3 hand job.

TBH it depends on how well they've designed it but if they've done it right it'll be pretty straightforward (the question is basically how the oil sealing works- what's in the oil bath, what's not- and how many special tools they decide to inflict on it.)