Drugs n' booze

Two stories in the press in the last week have got me wondering, firstly this story on how the “Baby-boomers” generation costs the NHS more in treating alcohol related ailments than younger generations

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-19913431

And then this story today about a study into how we treat drug use in society

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19942378

It does seem to me that policy makers haven’t got a clue what they are talking about sometimes.

it is not joined up thinking because we have a generation still ingrained with the view that all drugs are bad and should be banned as they are dangerous. You can hear them say this in the pubs and coffee shops throughout this land or in the smoking shelters

Its obvious prohibition does not work I am not sure why they try

The Alcohol Concern report found the cost of hospital admissions linked to heavy drinking among 55 to 74-year-olds in 2010-11 was more than £825m.

That was 10 times the figure for 16 to 24-year-olds

Stunning results comparing much larger sample of population who might have had 40 plus years of drinking against smaller sample of population who might have been drinking for 8 years.

Because in general the electorate is not in favour of more liberalisaton (because of the lies the media peddle?), also the US is so against any relaxation and would place a huge amount of pressure on any government, anywhere, relaxng the laws. So it’s not really in a polititians interest to champion a change, so they wont.

Stunning results comparing much larger sample of population who might have had 40 plus years of drinking against smaller sample of population who might have been drinking for 8 years.

Surely you’re not suggesting that a charity might have cherry-picked the data to support its claims? The horror!

Apparently, all drugs are evil and you’ll be on smack eventually in the contast quest for greater highs.

But it’s aboslutely fine to come to work stinking of booze on a monday morning and include consumption of alcohol in most social situations, including those where children are present. It isn’t really addictive and the only people who have problems with drinking are those who have got to the level of vodka on cornflakes for breakfast.

I fail to see why i should listen to a government that can’t decide on who will run a railway line without having to refund £40 million to the prospective parties.
Parliamnet is just a bunch of arses **** off to the sound of their own voices.

also the US is so against any relaxation and would place a huge amount of pressure on any government, anywhere, relaxng the laws

How about, I don’t know, Portugal?

It does seem to me that policy makers haven’t got a clue what they are talking about sometimes.

For the vast majority of the electorate, drugs = bad.

It’s a black and white situation for them. Only bad kids do drugs and all drugs are as bad as each other. There is no grey area.

Policies are designed to keep this electorate happy.

I’ve taken all sorts, but I’m not sure I want them legalised. I think people shouldn’t be sent to jail for personal use though.

Alcohol is a cultural norm. A lot of dangerous drinking is self-medication for stress, depression or low self-esteem.

Only bad kids do drugs and all drugs are as bad as each other.

except the ones they do that are legal which are safe

I’ve taken all sorts, but I’m not sure I want them legalised.

prohibiition did not stop you and the legality [ or inability to get hold of] is nto what stops you now

I get the decriminalised bit as well but IMHO most harms comes fromt he fact that criminals control the supply /quality control.

Yes, please

Drugs is drugs, alcohol is drugs, why the distinction?

The thread should have been titled “Drugs”

It boils down to the fact the government cant tax or control the distrobution of certain social drugs, yet in america they can grow cannabis for medical reasons and provide you with a card to claim it, its a joke, the same again, money and power.

emsz – Member

I’ve taken all sorts, but I’m not sure I want them legalised. I think people shouldn’t be sent to jail for personal use though.
Agreed

it would be progressive to remove ‘drugs’ from the criminal justice system and place them in the right area– health and education.

Junky, you’re sort of right, didn’t stop me, but I wouldn’t take drugs now anyway (choice thing)

Rudwboy yep that sound right, making it illegal is half the attraction I think.

+1 Emsz;.I spent most weekends of the 90’s on 48 hour benders and while I luckily came away relatively unscathed and know plenty who didn’t and shake like Ozzy Osbourne now.

At the time I thought it was cool, but its not; there’s a lot of lost and wasted talent out there because of them.

It’s fun until its not.

I wouldn’t take drugs now anyway

Shakes head **** yoof of today wasting th ebest years of your life.

The thing I always remember is drugs never helped anyoine – ie use it for fun not a prop.
No one expects to end up a junkie and no one ever wants to become one.

Pretty much everyone I know has stopped with middle age but the drinkers still drink

If everyone who went drinking alcohol to excess every weekend took ecstasy instead, wouldn’t it be better for everyone? Casualty would be a much nicer place on a saturday night anyway…no stupid fighting on the high street…

I’ve never taken ecstasy though so might a load of cobblers. well I took a half once but I also drank half a bottle of rum so was generally quite up for things anyway.

bigphilblackpool – Member
It boils down to the fact the government cant tax or control the distrobution of certain social drugs, yet in america they can grow cannabis for medical reasons and provide you with a card to claim it, its a joke, the same again, money and power.

And over here the government has granted GW Pharmaceuticals a license to grow cannabis in order to produce sativex.

Not in a bad way i think if it can help people then so be it, after all its a plant!!! Same as tobacco.

Yes but it’s the double standard, there’s no medical benefit and it’s dangerous unless it’s produced by a pharmaceutical company. Couple of my mates are big activists, one with MS uses cannabis to control the symptoms and the other with Crohns who uses cannabis to function ‘normally’. Both have been mugged by people they’ve been forced to buy from because they aren’t allowed to grow a few plants to provide medicine for themselves, and when their respective ‘safe’ go-to guys don’t have anything but they need it to stop spasming/shitting pants then what choice do they have?

The thing I always remember is drugs never helped anyoine

dunno, lance won a few TDFs with their help.

BenH and emsz, “Drugs are illegal, I did them anyway, I don’t think anyone else should” come on, bit hypocritical eh? Would legalisation, regulation and a proper support network being put in place not be a much better way to deal with drugs? You’ve already proved prohibition doesn’t work.

I think most politicians are astute enough to know prohibition doesn’t work as a drug policy. But no mainstream political party will ever have legalization as a policy, it is too risky from an electoral perspective.

But I don’t think drugs are a big societal issue, only a very small % of people are dependent, Alcohol is a bigger issue….most crime is committed under it’s influence, it has made our town centre’s no-go areas during weekends and has a huge cost in terms of healthcare, policing.

Labour tried to develop drinking culture into the cafe style European occasional drinking by deregulating licensing laws. This has failed.

This was kind of the point of the post, the drug report suggests that we are wasting £2bn a year on trying to prohibit drug use and wisely spending £1bn on effective treatments, they also said that rather than legalize or de-criminalise drugs that small amounts of possession should be a civil rather than criminal offence, much like speeding in a car.

The response from the government is laughable, essentially “Thanks but we are going to ignore you.” It just doesn’t make sense, there was a mini series on tv a few years ago in which a customs offical said that they spent £1bn a year on stopping 1% of the heroin being sent to our country getting through, 1% FFS!

DONK, I know, didn’t say my idea was well thought out!!

I don’t think people should be sent to jail for trying drugs it having drugs on them. But I don’t think it would be a great idea to have all these potentially dangerous drugs on legal sale, alcohol and cigerettes do enough damage don’t they?

Ha ha! The commonly held misconception drug users have that they are profound. Hilarious.
I used to take acid and all sorts and I expect came out with some right old hit/s.

alcohol and cigerettes do enough damage don’t they?

Think they do more than illegal drugs the real issue is whether you think the harm from the above would be greater or less if it was legal or illegal

The commonly held misconception drug users have that they are profound. Hilarious.

I would be very surprised if anyone who took them reguilarily had not had a profound moment on drugs

I used to take acid and all sorts and I expect came out with some right old hit/s.

What makes you think you dont now you are drug free 😉

Nothing, of course I come out with utter rubbish when straight, I’m human.. 🙂
Just makes me laugh that a lot of drug users think that the carp they come out with is some kind of revelatory and profound theory or something….it’s not, you’re stoned…
🙂

The biggest reason I think certain drugs are illegal is down to the supply chain.
We’re led to believe that drugs are illegally produced by bad people in other countries, then smuggled into this country either by more bad people or innocent drug mules, before making their way to your local dealer (who probably drives a BMW with blacked out windows) via criminal gangs.

Until the production of drugs is regulated & there aren’t people being taken advantage of (like the food, tobacco & clothing industries… 😉 ) & the workers on the drug farms in the far away countries get basic human rights there is no way they’ll ever become legal.

I would be very surprised if anyone who took them reguilarily had not had a profound moment on drugs

Of course, you don’t need to take drugs to have a profound moment. I have them frequently, usually either when pooping or Fell Running. Not biking though for some reason.

Personally I’m not convinced they should be legalised. My mind suffered more rot than expansion during my youthful days of hedonism and I’m a happier person for not partaking anymore. Fortunately I don’t even drink that much these days, half a bottle of wine or 3 pints a week is enough. Cheaper too, my tolerance is way down and half a bottle is enough to knock me out.

Besides, drugs being illegal was half the fun. No way of justifying that of course but there it is.

I’m a happier person for not partaking anymore. Fortunately I don’t even drink that much these days, half a bottle of wine or 3 pints a week is enough.

so basically you just decided you preferred being straight/sober, nothing to do with the legality of certain substances.

Besides, drugs being illegal was half the fun.

people doing dodgy stuff just coz it’s dodgy is pretty pathetic fortunately legalisation should help sort that out too 🙂

I don’t think it would be a great idea to have all these potentially dangerous drugs on legal sale

they are on illegal sale and being sold in vast quantities, pity we’ve no idea what the ingredients actually are most of the time – that fact increases the dangers in itself. Regulation, maybe sell heroin but you’ve got to sit through a half hour lecture of the dangers of the drug you are choosing to purchase and then you can only buy one hit, next one you sit through it all again. Once you’re 18 no retailer gives a shit how much booze you buy and how completely off your face you and your mates get. UK drugs policy is pretty ****ed up and seems to be an area where the government(s) regularly completely ignore professional advice

I think go the whole hog, or not at all. The hog being, legalise and regulate.

Who here would buy a bottle of whisky from some guy on a street corner, unlabelled and made by god knows who, rather than from the off license?

So, when drugs are available from the pharmacy, made to known standards and strengths, who the hell is gonna buy from the street corner? And they’re taxed, so drug use is now creating not draining government revenue. It’s also NOT contributing to criminal revenue or driving dealer turf wars. The pharmaceutical companies making them now have more money to spend on curing disease. (We’ll add some Laws that blah percent of party drug revenue must be spent on medicinal drug research.)

(Seriously, why am I not in charge yet?)

Seriously, why am I not in charge yet?

you’ve got my vote

@DONK

Too much selective quoting there. “Not convinced” (which does not imply a belief either way) and “No way of justifying that of course but there it is.” was the other bit you missed.

Just makes me laugh that a lot of drug users think that the carp they come out with is some kind of revelatory and profound theory or something….it’s not, you’re stoned…

it makes you wonder though, doesn’t it… 😉

I’ll be rather frank and honest here and admit to having tried pretty much everything there is including various forms of illegal hooch along with pretty much every possible legal alcoholic beverage, l personally consider it should be up to myself what i choose to ingest as long as it does not impeach on others – what i do with my life has sod all to do with poorly thought out political and legislative laws nor the police force acting upon those laws, which i admit has ended up with a few court appearances and a few days inside one her majesty’s finest holiday camps for arguing my well thought out and coherent case with the judge so to speak before my lawyer could get me released..

Over the past 25yrs ive tried the following listed below in no particular order and certainly not in any order of preference :

Cannabis – hydroponic or thai, durban,columbian etc.
Hash – moroccan double zero, afghani, quality polm, bubblehash, charas, hand rubbed tola, unpressed resin etc.
Speed – pink champagne, cut powder, etc.
Cocaine – always 70%+ only (tested beforehand).
Acid – blotters, microdots, liquid sugercubes.
Mushrooms – psilocybin,mexican cubensis, fly agaric, philosophers stones etc.
DMT – just WOW!….. 😯 .
Ayuhuasca – similar to DMT but more earthy feeling?, nah that’s not right but impossible to explain ??????.
Mescaline – peyote cactus, san pedro cactus.
MDMA – pills back in the 90’s, mdma crystals ever since.
Ketamine – Actually got given this in india for spinal pain, not a recreational drug i would ever use.
Opium – Hmmmm?, certainly stopped my trots in india.
MDEA – Cheers sasha (alexander shulgin PHIKAL & THIKAL)
MDA – see above

And prob quite a few other’s i’ve forgot about 😉 , of what is listed above i guess in the past year i’ve partaken in cannabis,hash, bubblehash,mdma,acid,mushrooms,cocaine.

My choice, my body and if/when so called drugs are ever legalised or not it’ll make very little difference as to whether or not i continue to use them, admittingly i don’t smoke anymore so i very occasionally use a vaporisor and any other drug use is so sporadic and such a small amount that it doesn’t feature in my life but if i so desire or take a notion then i pay absolutely no heed as to whether or not drug use is illegal in my decision making process, same for my friends, in fact i would find it hard to think of one friend that doesn’t/hasn’t used drugs in one form or another to be honest.

Drugs aren’t bad for you per se – over consumption or reliance on any substance is bad for you and the sooner the idiots in so called charge realise that then the world will be a better place.