Does Nick Griffin have a point? Yes, that Nick Griffin…

people have used the bible to justify both apartheid in South Africa and slavery in the US

Both of which are very similar to the BnB story. 🙂

Ah, i see you’re doing yourt usual ‘this discussion’s a bit too intellectual for me to get to grips with, so i’ll just make stupid provocative statements my mates down the pub might find amusing’ trick. Forgive me for taking you seriously, I shall endaevour not to do so in future. Enjoy your inebriation.

Mike, FFS! Its Friday afternoon. Wind your neck in, and for god (or Allah’s) sake, you really do need to get your sense of humour bypass filter fixed mate. You’ve just taken seriously a statement that gay blokes in leather chaps need to start blowing themselves up more often, like a cross between the shoe bomber and Freddie Mercury?

And as for resorting to comments like that, my first contribution was to suggest that ‘A Tyranny of Bumming’ would make a great name for a Japanese Death Metal Band.

Lighten up the moral outrage eh? Your head’ll explode otherwise 😉

You can’t prevent bigotry because that is a state of mind, and, at the moment at least, we have no government authorised mind control.

We do actually. It’s called ‘hate crime’ and it allows for offences that are racially or otherwise aggravated to be given differential sentences.

Also, inciting racial hatred is a crime. If I stand up and preach hatred and intolerance against Muslisms, I could be arrested and prosecuted for it.

Yes but neither of those are bigotry, they are actions motivated by bigotry. You still can’t be prosecuted for thinking something about someone, only for acting upon those thoughts. Anyway, this moves away from my real point, which was:

Discrimination is illegal and the law does apply equally to all groups! If I ran a B&B and refused to allow Christians I could be prosecuted, just as the Christian couple who refused to allow homosexuals were.

stupid provocative statements my mates down the pub might find amusing keep me here.

binners is the only reason this forum still exists.

MEDICAL FACT.

Both of which are very similar to the BnB story.

Have you not heard of pastor martin niemoller? Thin end of the wedge innit? 🙂

Mike, FFS! Its Friday afternoon. Wind your neck in, and for god (or Allah’s) sake, you really do need to get your sense of humour bypass filter fixed mate. You’ve just taken seriously a statement that gay blokes in leather chaps need to start blowing themselves up more often, like a cross between the shoe bomber and Freddie Mercury?

Why should I ‘wind my neck in’? My sense of humour’s just fine, ‘mate’. You made an idiotic statement, i challenged it, and now you’re a bit miffed. Go and have another pint or 8, mate.

Oh, i’m sorry; of course, you were only joking, weren’t you? Oh well that makes it alright then doesn’t it? Maybe you’re just not very good at making yourself clear. Must be all that beer you drink; i must admit I get a bit incoherent after a few too. Perhaps you might want to rethink the possibility of a career as a comedian, as Bernard Manning’s dead and that type of thing doesn’t go down too well these days. Mind you, I see Jim Davidson’s still about. He could do with a bit of competition.

Can’t see that you’ve made any real intelligent contribution to this thread other than to attempt a few ‘look at me’ type actions. Yes dear, very clever. Run along now will you; grown ups talking. there’s a good boy.

You can’t prevent bigotry because that is a state of mind

A state of mind can be changed through education, information and showing how ignorance is wrong. So you can actually prevent bigotry in all but the most closed-minded idiots. Or drunken alcoholics.

mikeconnor Just ‘cos he dresses his contribution up like a clown with a bucket of paint on it’s head doesn’t mean he’s not making a valid point that others understand and, perhaps, see some value in.

You’re not really getting this are you Michael. Just to illustrate…

a suicide bomber

a gayer….

In the name of equality, I’m cross-breeding the 2 to produce a race of militant, equality-driven men who like to touch other mens bottoms. Its for the good of society in the end. Just imagine how much semtex you can get underneath a velvet cape and a crown

wwaswas; I notice Binners is an ever-present regular on here, night and day 24-7. It must get a bit boring for him, as he’s surely run out of ideas by now. Hence the ‘hey lads look what a terribly funny guy I am’. reminds me of a certain fast show character.

Forgive me for not being taken in by his schtick; I just find the guy rather tedious and a tad blinkred. Maybe he should get out a bit more rather than spending his every waking hour on an internet forum.

you’re entitled to your opinion mike.

thankfully, it’s not your forum.

I’m sure he’s been for a mince with hora at least once so he isn’t *always* on here.

All I can say is, it’s good to see that his latest incarnation has dropped that pathetic faux-Cockney spelling schtick.

OK, he’s still tiresome and boring, but we should be grateful for small mercies and all that.

All I can say is, it’s good to see that his latest incarnation has dropped that pathetic faux-Cockney spelling schtick.

I thought he was from Manchester, no?

Binners is that Kevin from coronation street? Why’s he dressed like that?
I never know he suicide bombed? Is he not in it (corrie) any more?

I’m only ever on here in working hours Mike. Out on the bike last night. And all day tomorrow. Do you actually ride yourself? Apart from your monthly ‘celebrations, we all know all about

Ok Mike. Heres the deal. Shall we divide the threads up like they do in Fight club…..

I get to be Tyler obviously. Which self-help groups threads do you want? In fact…. If you could write me a list of stuff I’m not entitled to an opinion on, that’d be great

I believe you’d made a start on this already. Fire away…..

You all think it’s perfectly OK to marginalise Christian in about as derisory way as those Christians marginalise homosexuals.
bencooper: Show me one person who’s born a Christian, and I’ll concede your point.

So bencooper,

You think people are born gay? It’s genetic? There is a Gay gene? have you published these findings?

You think people are born gay? It’s genetic? There is a Gay gene? have you published these findings?

*not sure if serious*

I thought he was from Manchester, no?

Who said I was talking about binners?

I am serious. Are there folks who really believe that people are born gay?

Are there folks who really believe that people are born gay?

See, a simple yes or no would allow some engagement and discussion. If you would rather avoid that, then carry on posting those kinds of responses

I really just don’t know how to respond.

I guess the short answer is that a all of the gay people I’ve known who I’ve had this type of discussion with believe they were born gay. Who am I to argue?

Right, so what what do you think is the mechanism of that? Do you think it is genetic?

Who am I to argue?

I was hoping, a reasonable rationale, research-informed person who is capable of making up their own mind and not just taking someone else’s post-hoc rationalisations.

binners; since I joined this forum, you’ve done little but make crass and provocative comments towards me. Are you one of the ‘big hitters’, who everyone has to look up to? This forum’ syour ‘manor’ and evertyone has to respect you?

sorry, but I don’t see how your earlier comments about ‘explody’ Muslims are at all funny. And I suspect you’d not make them so readily if you were in fact in a place where there are lots of Muslim people. So I don’t see as how you should go unchalleneged for making them on here. if you don’t want to be challenged, then don’t make ignorant statements.

Now, how about attempting to justify your comment from earlier:

You can’t discriminate against Muslims. They get a bit,… you know… a bit… explody!

So, is that all Muslims then? It’s just that all the ons iknow and work with are pretty amicable peaceful folk who like a good laugh. Hence why Sun reader style comments like yours aren’t actually ‘funny’ to me. Or to a group of people who\’ve had to endure mistrust, hate and ostracisation since the west decided Islam was the new Communism. Do you actually know any Muslims yourself? i don’t imagine you meet an awful lot in that pub you spend so much time in (when you’re not on here of course. which, i wouldn’t imagine, leaves much time for biking).

Speaking of pubs; it’s home time. Once again, have a nice weekend mate.

I am serious. Are there folks who really believe that people are born gay?

Yep. Definitely home time. have a good one folks!

See, a simple yes or no would allow some engagement and discussion.

Do you think that there’s a choice?
I mean, do you believe that you could give sex to a man? (I’m assuming you’re male)

Do you think it is genetic?

Unless they’re indoctrinated in the womb by a mother with an agenda one must assume it is, yes?

The nature/nurture debate is very interesting, on many levels, but perhaps not so relevant to this debate. I know people have asked about “being born Christian”, which does imply that they do believe you can be “born gay”, but, whether nature or nurture, or both, are responsible for sexuality is rather irrelevant. The point is, it’s not a choice, or an opinion. People can, and regularly do, change their mind on religion, but I’m not aware that anyone has changed their mind on whether to be gay or not.

Even that though is fairly irrelevant to the debate, since you cannot legally discriminate against people for either their religion or their sexuality, they are treated the same in law.

Unless they’re indoctrinated in the womb by a mother with an agenda one must assume it is, yes?

Then you would expect that there would clearly be lots of identical twins who would share the same sexuality, right?

The nature/nurture debate is very interesting, on many levels, but perhaps not so relevant to this debate.

Well, if one line of argument is ‘Show me someone who was born Christian’ then it is relevant

Maybe one of them is pretending to be heterosexual?

People can, and regularly do, change their mind on religion, but I’m not aware that anyone has changed their mind on whether to be gay or not.

Why do you see it as a polarisation rather than a continuum? People may become more or less gay over time. Have you never ‘experimented’?

Maybe one of them is pretending to be heterosexual?

Is that the extent of your argument?

binners; since I joined this forum, you’ve done little but make crass and provocative comments towards me.

I try to resist Mike. Honestly I do. But nature abhors a vacuum 😉

Are you one of the ‘big hitters’, who everyone has to look up to? This forum’ syour ‘manor’ and evertyone has to respect you?

*shudders* Jesus! If anyone respected me, I’d be off like a shot, never to return. Why would anyone respect someone who spouts constant flippant shite? 😆

Anyway… have a good weekend. Pity I couldn’t join you in the pub. You sound like an absolute barrel of laughs.

People may become more or less gay over time

Is there a ‘gayness’ scale that you work from?

Quentin Crisp at one end and chuck norris aty the other?

Is that the extent of your argument?

well all you’ve done was ask a question. At least I’ve answered one…

Well, if one line of argument is ‘Show me someone who was born Christian’ then it is relevant

I did suggest that that argument was not relevant either.

So on a scale of 1-10 how gay are you?

Can I just ask if anyone has seen that Cameron chap in the same room as Mr Griffin?

Is there a ‘gayness’ scale that you work from?

Not Specifically but if you think such a thing is necessary for you construction of ‘gay’ then you might use the Kinsey scale or any elaboration of it since 1948, if you prefer, you could use the Klein Grid which has more dimensions.

Does the specific scale I work from, have any bearing on your argument?

Is that the extent of your argument?

well all you’ve done was ask a question. At least I’ve answered one…

Ok, then so you are telling me that gayness is genetic, and where it appears that identical twins are of different sexual orientation, it is only because one of them is pretending?

Quentin Crisp at one end and chuck norris aty the other?

that only works if the line that your sliding scale is on is a circle