carbon or alloy

Hey thought I’d get some opinions away from bike shop assistants who always want you to buy the most expensive bike in the shop…Got got a alloy hardtail, wanna upgrade it, just want a good all rounder bit of hard single track..use it for work other days..I wanna go for carbon but I do lock my bikes up, to bob in places etc, they do say carbon chips and weakens quite easy, locking it up against objects could make a carbon bike more likely to get a chip or two…any thoughts.

I went alloy as the carbon version of my bike was a gopping colour. The alloy one was black 🙂

I wouldn’t buy Carbon.

That’s just me
I’m awkward and can’t see the point I could elaborate but I don’t want to start a muhassive debate involving armchair Riders.

Upgrade? Easy,

chromoly. End of.

Shop assistant (well owner) here…

I’d only recommend a carbon MTB if a) you have a very healthy budget, there are far better upgrades to spend the difference between alloy->carbon on imho; b) it’s going to get looked after, not ridden every day for work etc

What bikes are you looking at, out of interest?

Not sure im an armchair rider discoduck,we got the guild wheel in preston 26 miles,i do a couple o laps of that often…Yeah im looking at the scott 760 with 27.5 wheels

Carbon for my money, unless there were huge compromises elsewhere in the spec. That said For the budget you’re looking at I’d probably go alu.

they do say carbon chips and weakens quite easy

Who says that? I was under the impression its quite a durable material.

I have a similar viewpoint to njee20, If I can afford it then I’d go carbon. But usually the cost of the frame is a lot more so you usually get a reduced spec to keep the price sensible. Carbon frame and decent spec usually cost mega bucks.

Carbon for feel and stiffness though not all carbon is equal so demo first. (owns 1 carbon, 1 steel and one alloy bike)

Keep your current bike for going to work on and then buy whatever bike is best for your mtbing.

ok..so no problems useing a carbon frame for every day rideing,its not going to shatter if dropped on a hard surface etc

Carbon is pretty tough. you can chip the paint the same a you can with alloy or steel frames. But its also very repairable. Much more so than an alloy frame.
I wouldn’t bother about 27.5 wheels, find an extra £249 and get one of these ( unless you need a small)
http://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m1b8s2p5089/SCOTT-SCALE-620-2013

Cheers.. but my mrs would beat my ass if i had two bikes laying around the house ha,so im looking at a compromise really,a good allrounder to last me a couple o years..I deffo get the impression carbons best left for the trails.

ok..so no problems useing a carbon frame for every day rideing

Absolutely not. I believe airliners get used pretty regularly, they seem to do ok.

I doubt you will shatter a frame if it’s dropped on a hard surface ?

Repetitive abuse will no doubt cause some damage, in my limited exposure to carbon it suffers more from lacerations, like a side plate sized slab flicking up and damaged the down tube, B/B area or the knuckle mount that attaches to a rear link underneath the B/B area like on a Nomad for instance.

I’ve never ridden a rigid carbon bike but assume characteristics are similar to a FS bike, they are less buzzy whilst still offering some flex and feel different to the same alu version of same design.

To get it right I think you would have to spend a significant amount on the frame and as has been said at a cost else where ?
Wheels ? Finishing kit.

If it were me which it isn’t I’d buy a nice Steel frame and enjoy the strength and movement in a proper steel frame, unles weight is an issue, then go Carbon.

I’ve never ridden a rigid carbon bike but assume characteristics are similar to a FS bike, they are less buzzy whilst still offering some flex and feel different to the same alu version of same design.

Not to anything like the same extent. You can make carbon bikes compliant yes (as you can alu), but nothing like FS.

Love my carbon FS, its a Mojo so couldn’t have an alloy version 😆 Cleaned it this afternoon after a ride and though its a few years old it looks amazing. I really don’t know why they paint carbon frames, when the carbon weave is something really special to look at IMO

had an aluminium alloy Stumpjumper 29’er hardtail

had an issue with the BB shell in the frame

had it replaced with a carbon fibre Stumpjumper 29’er hardtail frame, moved all the same parts across

rode on the same trails

definite difference to the carbon, much better ride quality, stiffer yet smoother on rough ground

this is used for mountain biking though, i would not use it for commuting if being left or locked on the street

@njee

In what respect ?
The variation between a rigid Alu & carbon you mean or the variation between Alu full suss and carbon full suss ?

I’m interested myself as I’m liking the look of the GT gravel bike elsewhere on here, and fancied carbon especially if it looks like that one, obviously wait till no one buys one and take one from wiggle with a hefty discount on last years model in another 12 Months.

I know I said above I wouldn’t buy carbon but I think I’ve been had by the advertising moguls who described the rear seat stays as pencil thin and the square section chain stays…….

Sorry back on track,

they do say carbon chips and weakens quite easy, locking it up against objects could make a carbon bike more likely to get a chip or two…any thoughts.

“They” are speaking rubbish. My carbon frame must get stones hitting it while riding well into the hundreds a week – not a single chip even to the lacquer (it does make a horrible sound every time you get a big stone though!)

If you helitape it you will protect the lacquer also. There are areas on my bike where the lacquer has been scratched or chipped – but thats also due to On Ones legendarily questionable lacquer. It’s not down to the fibers in any area – just superficial.

Plyphon, have you ridden Cut Gate at full yacker ? There’s some hoofing great stones there that put a rather large slice in my shin bone last week, I’ve also seen an Ibis mojo up there sliced and a carbon Santa Cruz on the crags at Wharncliffe sliced, these aren’t stones there about the same size and dimension as a family sized plate pie.

Mines got invisiframe tape on and it’s not shy at gouging that out the way and denting the downtube, it’s only vinyl wrap not armour.

My carbon fibre armchair is miles lighter than the old fabric/wood one I used to sit on. It’s miles stiffer, corners better, and you can really feel the ground underneath

these aren’t stones there about the same size and dimension as a family sized plate pie.

Any frame regardless of what material its made from can be damaged when subjected to that on a regular basis. If designed correctly a carbon frame isn’t any less durable in that aspect. But the advantage of a carbon frame is that it can be repaired much easier than a Alu frame.

Until recently I would of considered carbon but after watching my mate take a slow speed tumble on his carbon Rockhopper and crack the non-drive side chain stay I think I’ll stick with alloy/steel.

I know it’s a freak one off accident but it wasn’t confidence inspiring for plastic bikes.

I’m guessing you think that an alu or steel frame would have been fine in the same situation?

Fairly sure yes, they would of been fine.

And if it had of been steel I could of fixed it for him, he’s been quoted £130 to fix it.

like breadcrumb, been put off by a mate who cracked the seatstay on his intense tracer as it fell against the bath in his hotelroom, trip ruined!

ive craked frames b4 (2 ally, 1 steel-got that one rewelded by teh garage that does my MOTs) but im just scared of carbon, in the alps last week i put a fair size dent in my ally chainstay, im not convinced a carbon frame wouldve survived it

so for that reason, im oot

Alloy gives and bends before it cracks…carbon just cracks and I’ve seen this happen to my mates carbon frame and another mates carbon wheels.
Maybe I’d consider a carbon road bike but never would I buy a carbon mountain bike unless all I was riding was trail centres! 😆

@breadcrumb

Carbon rockhopper?

Alloy gives and bends before it cracks…carbon just cracks

Errrr, so you’re saying carbon doesn’t flex ? Don’t think so.

Young enduro shredder for Cannondale, Ben Cruz:

“I ride an alloy-framed Cannondale Jekyll most of the time. I choose to ride alloy just because of the way I train. It may sound kinda odd, but I love freeriding. Not straight “huckstible” stuff, but just finding new ridges and valleys with no trail and just letting loose and pinning it through the woods. Carbon doesn’t take as kindly to violent dismounts, so I ride alloy.”

esher shore – Member

@breadcrumb
Carbon rockhopper?

Yes, he’d just got it too, second hand so no crash replacement option.

It was it’s 2nd outing, Whinlatter, top of the South. Slow tumble on to a pointy rock.

Plyphon, have you ridden Cut Gate at full yacker ? There’s some hoofing great stones there that put a rather large slice in my shin bone last week, I’ve also seen an Ibis mojo up there sliced and a carbon Santa Cruz on the crags at Wharncliffe sliced, these aren’t stones there about the same size and dimension as a family sized plate pie.

Mines got invisiframe tape on and it’s not shy at gouging that out the way and denting the downtube, it’s only vinyl wrap not armour.

Well aye of course thats going to do some damage, but then again it would damage anything.

Beside, we are talking about carbon “chipping” from being locked against a pole or from general pootling – which it doesn’t 🙂

A mate came off and buried the brake lever into the top tube of his carbon ht, 1 week later it was repaired perfectly and back in action. I saw a rufty tufty alu am bike from Halifax that had a swing arm written off by somebody doing slow low speed tumble onto a rock. Not repairable.

In what respect ?
The variation between a rigid Alu & carbon you mean or the variation between Alu full suss and carbon full suss ?

I thought your post was comparing carbon hardtails to feel like alu FS (perhaps misinterpreting)? Carbon frames can certainly be made to be more compliant (it’s not a given), but an alu FS bike is likely to be more comfortable than a carbon hardtail. Gravel bikes would be a good place for carbon I’d say – as you say, they can filter out high frequency vibrations.

Right there with the first reply we have just about the perfect answer. Buy which ever one you like the look of the most, as that matters far more than the material used.

I like carbon but agree with the comments that it’s low in the list of upgrades, for a frame- there’s generally somewhere else you can spend the money that’ll give more reward.

Was talking to a fella up at liesure lakes today, those from the NW will no this shop, on the carbon v steel question…He viewed it that modern day carbon frames from the big boys like cube specialised trek scott etc are engineered to a higher standard over last few years but also carbon protectors protect the lacquer from further damage from chips etc and a carbon frame would be fine for everyday use as well as hammering those trails at weekends.

I like carbon but agree with the comments that it’s low in the list of upgrades, for a frame- there’s generally somewhere else you can spend the money that’ll give more reward.

Not sure about that in some ways, having ridden alloy and carbon versions of the same bike back to back the carbon in those cases added more to the package than just weight saving, stiffness and a direct feel in the back end. Seemed to make it feel more responsive in the snappy acceleration/power down situations.

Alloy gives and bends before it cracks…carbon just cracks

Errrr, so you’re saying carbon doesn’t flex ? Don’t think so.[/quote]

Carbon can have an elastic modulus comparable to anything from magnesium at the lower end to a structural steel at the upper.
The variables in manufacturing technique between manufacturers are huge, so It’s probably a bit simplistic to make sweeping judgements about any material really – best to test ride a few bikes you like and take it from there.