Bankerists.. Is RBS still taxpayer owned ?

Looking at the news this evening re RBS, several folk interviewed mentioned that it was still “owned” by the taxpayer… Doing a google on this shows a lot of pages circa 3 – 4 May 2012 stating that they had finished repaying their loans from the taxpayer…

RBS ‘clears £163bn debt to taxpayer’

What is the reality of this… if they have repayed then the journos are sounding like stuck records…

80% isn’t it…owned by us

Two different things. Ownership ie capital (still predominantly) the government. These loans were, as seen in several parts of the world, sources of emergency funding ie other liabilities, that RBS clearly believes that it now longer needs so is paying back.

RBS may well be in gov ownership for some time yet!

So if the article in the Telegraph and the link that takes you to the Metro say that RBS have repaid their loans, why do the taxpayer still have a liability here ?

Sorry if appearing daft but if the loan is repaid, shirley they are in the clear ?

Assets and liabilities can be confusing terms with banks and it is often not clear. For RBS loans and capital are liabilities as ultimately they have to be paid back. For taxpayers, they are assets – stuff that RBS owes to us. When RBS pays down a loan, its liabilities (to us) go down and our assets (a claim on them) goes down by the same amount (broadly speaking)

Where does it mention a liability for the taxpayer?

The taxpayer still has another asset ( not the subject of the article) as we own 82% of the bank still. The fact that they have paid back some emergency loans does not impact the capital (the shareholders)

A-ha.. thanks thm, bit clearer…

I hope so as I didn’t explain it very well!

The key is the difference in money borrowed by RBS during the crisis (the loans) and its ownership (including the 82% owned by the state). The story describes how some of the former (the loans) are being paid back. As long as you keep both things separate, it should be clear (I hope).

Owned or underwritten? I have a feeling that although the state (taxpayer is an odd media term in this conrext as non-taxpayers have the same voting rights every 4 or 5 years) may own 80 odd% it does not take an active shareholder role. Also, it only has a 75% voting right or RBS would be de-listed.

Also the public pretty much owns everything one way or another through pension funds, bonds, unit trusts etc, very little of major value is in truely private hands.