anyone on here voting tory. why?

How do the rich pay more VAT???

It is a regressive tax come on Jambalya you can do better than that.

@Pigface, because they spend much more overall and on items which have VAT levied on them. There is no VAT on food (in the UK unlike France, Germany etc), lower rated on gas and electricity. VAT is a very important tax as it raises money from consumption and is paid by visitors too.

ruined my pension

@thorpie, Gordon Brown reduced my pension by 25% by removing the tax relief on dividends.

because they spend much more overall and on items which have VAT levied on them

Buy-to-let properties?

Because they thoroughly deserve it. You reap what you sow, and all that….

@binners that applies to Labour in the period 1997 to 2010, they managed the economy terribly and far from helping the “working man” / poor they created a burden which had to me met by everyone. As I said the biggest disservice you can do for those reliant on welfare is to ruin the economy. Look at what’s happening in Greece, the country cannot borrow any more money so the economy cannot run as it used to to the detriment of the ordinary man/woman. Labour built an economy reliant on debt.

Buy-to-let properties?

stamp duty, vat on improvements/rennovations, income tax on rent, capital gains tax on sale. BTW the vast majority of people I know who would be classified as rich on STW have very little to zero investment property other than the home they live in.

No.

Why? So many reasons, but Michael Gove will suffice.

and the tories have fixed that jamby?

Jerremy Hunt is still signing off on PPI deals- he knows labour are to scared to criticise
and the tories have tried every trick they can to keep the housing bubble growing
im sure they are doing wonders on the national debt, while household and student debt soars

Labour in the period 1997 to 2010, they managed the economy terribly

Groundhog day again! 16 years of uninterrupted economic growth, most of that time in surplus, national debt below 40% of GDP, unemployment at record lows. Bloody terrible!

and far from helping the “working man” / poor they created a burden which had to me met by everyone.

That burden was a result of the financial crisis and the recession it caused, not investment in schools and hospitals. But of course you know that, but still continue with the idiotic national credit card rubbish.

Indeed it does – self interested parasite more interested in the contents of your own pocket than the welfare of others. Tory it’ll be then.

Why would I put the interests of people I don’t know/will never meet over my own?

Having grown up in a fairly rough area, I know all too well how benefits are spent – on people who can’t be bothered to work because it is easier to just have 3 kids.

@dazh – the charts of the deficit would show the Labour legacy was a massive deficit and the period in surplus was very short. The national debt started to spiral out of control under Labour due to the growing deficit and reliance on borrowing

@kimbers, no they haven’t fixed that totally but they are the road to doing so as opposed to Labour who would have made things far worse had they won in 2010 and who will do so again if they are in power from 2015

Apprecaite I will respond to posts but this was a thread about why people will vote Tory so it’s more interesting to hear from those posters as to why they are doing so than a debate about how non-Tory supporters cannot understand the rationale.

@binners that applies to Labour in the period 1997 to 2010, they managed the economy terribly and far from helping the “working man” / poor they created a burden which had to me met by everyone.

Sorry Jammy old boy. You really just don’t get it, do you? This isn’t about the consequences of economics. We understand that. Globalisation destroying heavy industry… blah, blah, blah…..

This is about the casual malice of intention within the Tory party. And a complete lack of empathy with the people who have genuinely suffered as a result of their policies. If you look at things purely through facts and figures then you’ll never understand the visceral loathing felt by many towards the conservative party. But then that a very Tory attitude. An accusation that they (rightfully IMHO) have levelled at them… that they know the price of everything, and the value of nothing.

People (again rightly) feel a general sense of disappointment towards nu labour, or a feeling of contempt towards blair. Both very different emotions from blind hatred. The Tories rightfully receive that in large parts of the country for very good reason. Because large amounts of people detect a true malice and nasty, uncaring vindictiveness in the behaviour of the tory party, which looking at the effect their recent policies have had on disabled people, for example, is difficult to argue with.

most of that time in surplus

That’s not correct is it. 13 of 16 periods in deficit (not counting the gold sell off)

national debt below 40% of GDP

Public sector up to 75% by the time they’d finished.

unemployment at record lows

It’s lower now isn’t it?

Why would I put the interests of people I don’t know/will never meet over my own?

Because it’s the fair thing to do and since I realise you won’t care about that, because it’s probably actually in your own self interest longer term but I suspect there’s not much point explaining that either.

Voting conservative (or labour actually since they’re clearly not interested in much other than getting into and staying in power by promising whatever they need to) would be in my self interest. They certainly won’t be getting my vote. I can cope with some waste and piss-taking by scroungers (particularly as the actual cost is pretty low in relation to what else our money goes on) if it means that the poorest and most disadvantaged aren’t actually living in poverty.

I was pretty shocked (given that he’s a hippie at heart) to hear that my Dad was going to vote conservative though. Not because he likes them but because he reckons they’re the least bad – all the other parties only know how to spend and not how to balance the books. I get the argument but I just don’t reckon he’s right.

Because it’s the fair thing to do and since I realise you won’t care about that

I spent years studying whilst working full time to get a half-decent job, if others can’t be bothered to do the same then that is their problem.

Understand both my initial, and this statement, are sweeping generalisations and are to be taken with a pinch of salt.

I don’t disagree with help for those who need it, however I have seen overwhelming evidence that this is not how most of it is spent.

Having grown up in a fairly rough area, I know all too well how benefits are spent – on people who can’t be bothered to work because it is easier to just have 3 kids.

It’s true, I grew up in an area like that and recognise what you’re talking about. I was lucky and got out as even though there was a tory govt at the time, there was still a consensus that the govt should support people through subsidised higher education and other things that helped. The difference now is that those people are given no help and are blamed for all the ills of society, and rather than simply jumping on the bandwagon, I’d rather question whose fault it is that many people now think their best option in life is to drop a few sprogs and live a life on benefits?

Unemployment graph here, I’ll leave others to make their own conclusions:

Graph1

Currently after Germany we have the lowest levels of unemployment in Europe.

Is this not a silly question on here? 😆

Unemployment graph here, I’ll leave others to make their own conclusions:

I’m not arguing against that, just that the established orthodoxy that the tories are good at managing the economy, and labour bad is a myth. There’s no real difference between them as far as I can see and certainly isn’t a reason on whether to vote for one or the other.

I’m not having Miliband leading the country

Not sure which of the other less rubbish parties I’m going to vote for yet

I don’t disagree with help for those who need it, however I have seen overwhelming evidence that this is not how most of it is spent.

I agree. If we had been less helpful to the banking sector, we wouldn’t be in this sorry mess.

I don’t disagree with help for those who need it, however I have seen overwhelming evidence that this is not how most of it is spent.

Have you hell.

You’ve seen some benefit scroungers. You’ve no idea of the actual statistics have you?

Having grown up in a fairly rough area, I know all too well how benefits are spent – on people who can’t be bothered to work because it is easier to just have 3 kids.

Far more goes on deserving cases than non-deserving ones. This isn’t even controversial. And it should be fairly obvious that cutting benefits to those who need it because other people are abusing the system is pretty shitty.

What rankles the most is that most of them try to justify it through spurious logic of tough-love and ‘unfairness’ against ‘hard working people’ rather than just admitting that they don’t give a sh*t.

Really? I thought the main reason is that they say Miliband is ugly.

My priority is to my family, and despite the fact that there are other people in the country who need money, I will vote for whoever I think will enable me to provide best for them. I don’t work in the public sector or claim benefits, I’m not poor, but I’m a looong way from rich (and have no desire to be); long enough not to be able to afford to vote to the detriment of teamW out of some feeling of benevolence.
I just want someone who wont rock the boat too much, a coalition of opposites or a change every term so it limits the opportunity for any party to FUBAR the UK (although I’m sure some would try given the chance). For this reason, I quite like the lib dems but I fear their ship has sailed.

I’m not poor, but I’m a looong way from rich

You earn (I’m guessing) more than the median income in one of the richest countries in the world.

You’re rich.

My postal vote is Tory. Mainly because I want one of the two big parties to win a proper majority so they tale full responsibility for their decisions. Labour won’t make much of a showing in my constituency so Tory it is.

You’re rich.

Well that means Labour want to **** me into oblivion. The choice is becoming easier.

My priority is to my family, and despite the fact that there are other people in the country who need money, I will vote for whoever I think will enable me to provide best for them.

Mine too. However, if I’m well off enough, a few quid a month won’t make a difference and is going to a good cause. If I’m poor enough for a few quid a month to matter, then I should be the receipient of the money rather than the donor.

I realise that I’m not any more important than other people, and since I do okay I’ll vote to help those who need it.

Well that means Labour want to **** me into oblivion.

Don’t be stupid. Inflammatory rhetoric does no-one any favours.

Well that means Labour want to **** me into oblivion. The choice is becoming easier.

I’ve lived most of my adult life under a labour government and earning reasonably, and still appear to be ok. But then I’m not tempted to lapse into ridiculous hyperbole.

My priority is to my family, and despite the fact that there are other people in the country who need money, I will vote for whoever I think will enable me to provide best for them.

So why is voting for your family’s interests separate to voting for everyone’s interests? There’s tons of research out there that says more equal societies are more happy societies. By reducing poverty and hopelessness, everyone benefits. or would you rather live in a society like the US or South Africa with gated communities, private security guards, severely mentally ill people and beggars on the streets, people unable to afford basic healthcare etc?

Don’t be stupid.

Steady.

Inflammatory rhetoric does no-one any favours.

There’s LOADS of far more “Inflammatory rhetoric” on here than I’d manage in 4 pages of posts!

there was still a consensus that the govt should support people through subsidised higher education and other things that helped

You should vote Tory then, more poor go to University now than in the past, more to do to get them to better universities but progress.

Despite fears that the introduction of tuition fees would discourage less wealthy students to apply, the figures show that the poorest young people are now over 10% more likely to go to university than they were last year and a third more likely than five years ago.

Guardian article

That Gove what a tosser, let’s post a picture of pob or a cartoon of him trying to shoot down an aeroplane.

a million more pupils are now at schools rated good or outstanding. This title cherishes education. Such success cannot be ignored.

Independent editorial

Could not vote for the Tories. Most of the parties have come out with stuff I find disagreeable but the Tories are the only ones to make me shout obscenities at the radio.

Complete failure to give the slightest crap about the UK housing bubble and increasingly bonkers schemes to prop it, protecting their vested interests whilst damaging the UK’s competitiveness.

But then I’m not tempted to lapse into ridiculous hyperbole.

There is plenty on here, that’s for sure.

You should vote Tory then, more poor go to University now than in the past, more to do to get them to better universities but progress.

Yes, their tuition fees policy was so badly thought-out, that it has had the opposite effect of what was intended.

Even if I was solely motivated by my own personal wealth, I wouldn’t vote Tory. They inherited a weak recovery from Labour, then snuffed it out with over aggressive austerity for two years. They reverted back to Labours slower deficit reduction plan, which gave us very weak growth. To make things look better we had a minor housing bubble inflicted upon us (debt fuelled boom) which was then snuffed out by hints at interest rate rises from the BoE and we’re now back to very weak growth for this quarter. They’re also offering more aggressive cuts for two years which I fully expect to push us back into recession.

I’d hardly call that best with the economy. GO’s one success was from switching from a Tory financial plan to a Labour one. Oh the ironing….

As for rebalancing the economy away from housing debt fuelled bubbles, not one iota of progress!

Edit: just seen it on the previous page.

@Pigface, because they spend much more overall and on items which have VAT levied on them. There is no VAT on food (in the UK unlike France, Germany etc), lower rated on gas and electricity. VAT is a very important tax as it raises money from consumption and is paid by visitors too Because I ignore what the actual facts and the published research states about what % of their income they spend on VAT and just waffle on instead.

FTFY – all the research agrees on it being regressive. There is no way it can be both regressive and the rich pay more. They poay sa lower % of their income on VAT its a fact you can argue with Facts if you like but its pretty foolish

I’d hardly call that best with the economy. GO’s one success was from switching from a Tory financial plan to a Labour one. Oh the ironing…

THIS they missed all their targets – blaming the Eurozone iirc then did what Labour planned then declared themselves brilliant and some folk swallowed it

There’s LOADS of far more “Inflammatory rhetoric” on here than I’d manage in 4 pages of posts!

Aye, it’s not just you! It’s everyone.. more’s the pity.

everyone want to earn their money, inflate it at an unbelieveable rate through property, pass all of it to their children, draw a full and liveable state pension and live out their days being cared for by ‘government’ money. There is more than a generation of it and nobody is gonna derail that train

its not sustainable, but there doesnt appear to be a single person who can/will change it.