Anyone believe in UFO's?

I like science.. and scientists.. where have I said that I don’t..?

some of you lot are prize **** lemons however.. 😀

well.. that’s my quarterly foray into big hitting cock-nockery.. my curiosity is well and truly satisfied.. I part this thread traumatised..

Graham.. it’s been a complete chore.. pat yourself soundly on the back.. I am broken

I am just asking you to perhaps drop all the hysterical yunki baiting for a second and admit that you guys have been **** arseholes for the entirity of this thread..

You’re the one being the arsehole dude – try to take a step back then re-read this thread, especially all the bits GrahamS quoted.

infantile pricks..

Nice.

I like science.. and scientists.. where have I said that I don’t..?

I’d say the bits where you dismissed all chemistry, said spectroscopy was a religious cult, and described maths and physics as a “con art invented by scraggly little toads who can’t get laid”.

Somewhere around there.

scraggly blah blah blah

ok.. I take that back.. it was a tongue in cheek comment, a bit of banter.. I’m not 12 for christs sakes.. but who **** cares..

no grum.. I have been faced with deliberate obtuseness in every response and it’s worn me down..

sorry.. I’m not feeling very nice at all after that

graham – I didn’t realise that you took yourself so seriously old chap.. sorry to offend.. never my intention

I think there is a higher probability of alien life than a omnipotent god…

I didn’t realise that you took yourself so seriously old chap.. sorry to offend..

I don’t and you didn’t. (I like to think I conveyed this somewhere amongst my smilies, memes and general mickey-taking).

I part this thread traumatised..

Hope you recover from all the “cock-nockery” and nasty names that the “arsehole” “infantile prick” “science monkeys” called you. Well done for not stooping to that level yourself.

for the very last time.. I just like to consider that there are infinite possibilities and that space may yet hold new discoveries for us.. I’m gobsmacked that some of you find this view so offensive

Everybody knows this. There’s not a single person on this thread that’s argued otherwise, and I don’t think anyone is even remotely offended by the idea.

But people might have been offended- or maybe more accurately frustrated- by your claims that scientists are narrow-minded and arrogant because they prefer to work within the framework of what we do know or have sound grounds to suspect rather than indulging any fancy that crosses their minds. It’s just a waste of time.

I think there is a higher probability of alien life than a omnipotent god…

There is an interesting point here: certain-minded people dismiss talk of extra-terrestrials as fantasy, but happily worship an extra-terrestrial that they believe created the entire universe. 😕

The logic of that confuses me.

I’m sorry that some of you have misunderstood me.. and I’m sorry for colourful language.. and I’m sorry that I appear to have misrepresented myself

the arrogance thing seems to be the sticking point..

get over it.. we’ll have to agree to disagree..
I didn’t realise that science types were so insecure about their profession.. I’ve always thought science to be a pretty solid foundation and have always had utmost faith in it..

by the level of defensiveness I’ve encountered here I’m starting to doubt the wisdom of my judgement

When you apologise you need to be contrite not just continue to attack people.

I cant even be arsed that is just childish and petty. sadly this pretty much sums up how you have handled this entire thread but with more sweary insults.
🙄

haven’t read through 6 pages of arguing, so not sure if this has been posted yet:

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn9943-top-10-controversial-pieces-of-evidence-for-extraterrestrial-life.html

But people might have been offended- or maybe more accurately frustrated- by your claims that scientists are narrow-minded and arrogant because they prefer to work within the framework of what we do know or have sound grounds to suspect rather than indulging any fancy that crosses their minds. It’s just a waste of time.

Oh god Mr Salmon, this is so sensible and succint, I’ve just had to change my pants. Chapaeu.

Laz, now you are here surely you can use your immense and rad problem solving powers to end this.. 😆

head banging against a wall..

someone asserted that we know all there is to know about the elements present in the universe..
I thought this was arrogant and bad science

a hundred screaming demons descend on me to call me a hippie and delusional and an advocate of indulging fanciful notions.. I am none of these things and I was dismayed that scientists (in the loosest sense of the word) would be so quick to defend the original statement and so vigorously and obtusely..

I’m not a very even tempered person.. far from it

I got quite upset and lost the plot.. some of you deserve an apology.. some of you don’t

Garry Lager.. you are a razor of a troll.. I’m having a breakdown.. my wife has left me, my kids are screaming neglect and I’m driving to my pigging appointment now..

chapeaux

edit: I have learned that fanciful notions have a time and a place

someone asserted that we know all there is to know about the elements present in the universe..
I thought this was arrogant and bad science

Actually Garry_Lager said: “chemically there’s only one periodic table in the universe”

which may be a bold statement, but is not the same thing as saying “we know all there is to know”. I think that may be your misconception.

He also said: “carbon’s the only game in town for prospective lifeforms” which several people rightly corrected him on.

what a humdinger of a misconception 😯

who would have thought that such a tiny teeny misunderstanding could lead to so much buffoonery.. 😳

such tragic bellendery

Now how’s that second coming thread progressing..? I feel my input would be invaluable.. 8)

Laz, now you are here surely you can use your immense and rad problem solving powers to end this..

OK, I’ll make a statement on the matter:

There have been or are currently intelligent life forms in existance somewhere other than earth. We (humans, and I speak for all of them) don’t know about it yet.

THREAD CLOSED

Thread still open.

Foo Fighters anyone?

Edit: Link here

You know, saying “thread closed” doesn’t actually close the thread, it just makes you sound silly and implies that you can’t really back up what you’re saying. Even if you put it in capital letters and press the keys really hard.

Foo Fighters anyone?

Definitely exist:

They’ve come for our sun!

http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2012/04/what-the-hell-is-this-incredible-alien-spaceship-looking-thing-caught-on-camera-circling-the-sun-by-nasa/

😀

I haven’t read the whole of this thread, as a lot of it looked like bitching to me. 😆

Anyways, NASA Satelite picked up a UFO near the sun yesterday..
Of course its real, its in the Daily Mail. [/url] 😉

I tend to the view there ‘must be’ other life forms out there, but often wonder that if they did turf up here they would be mad to make contact if they didn’t have weapons superior to our own.

I also wonder what would have happened to science had we evolved with three digits instead of ten, how different would our measurement perceptions be.

I also wonder if we had developed on say Mars, wether a light year would be ‘faster’ than our light year.

I can’t help but notice the power of circles, everything seems to be round, orbits, planets, suns, maybe the Universe is also and maybe it is continuous.

Then I think about weight and wonder how gravity would be measured on a much bigger planet and wether coming from a big place, aliens would be able to bound about here and would they need full suspension or be content with hard tails.

Then I consider one of the only really known truths which is the Electro Magnetic Spectrum and recall in my youth and school physics Light being explained to me as particles when I believed it to be a wavelength and I turned out to be right. So that perception only came about in the last fifty or so years.

My point being we do know relatively little, what we do know is constantly changing and that knowledge is only based on earthly perceptions. There is no time per se, even our measurement systems (google parsecs) are crude and earth based, getting back to the Electro Magnetic Spectrum, what we view as visible light, even here other life forms view differently, so it is highly likely that Aliens from bigger or small planets might view things using other parts of that spectrum and we may not be even able to view them with our perception.
I even consider consciousness (gonna get deep here) tunes into this spectrum at different wave lengths, how else could we explain some natural occurences of anticipation of future events, wether by animals or even those we might refer to as gifted or mediums.

One could go as far as to suggest consciousness itself might be transferable, who knows maybe it’s the answer to the eternal question of what is it all about, so maybe our own consciusness becomes an alien elsewhere once it’s done here…

Only one way to find out, but it is an interesting discussion.

Allow me to paraphrase:

derekrides – Member

Duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuude…….

😉

There is no time per se, even our measurement systems (google parsecs) are crude and earth based,

You should take your own advice, parsecs are a measurement of distance not time (despite what Han Solo would have you believe). (-:

A couple of proper answers from my limited knowledge (I ain’t no scientist):

f they did turf up here they would be mad to make contact if they didn’t have weapons superior to our own.

If anything deliberately makes it this far then they have technology vastly superior to anything we have.

I also wonder what would have happened to science had we evolved with three digits instead of ten

Erm… not much. You can count in pretty much any base you like:
00.. 01..02.. 03.. 10.. 11.. 12.. 13.. 20

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaternary_numeral_system

It would be a bit odd having two fingers on one hand and one on the other. Wouldn’t alter my typing skills much though.

I also wonder if we had developed on say Mars, wether a light year would be ‘faster’ than our light year.

A light year is a measure of distance, not speed, so it can’t be “faster”.

A year on Mars is 686.98 Earth days. So yes a “light year” is a much greater distance if you are using Martian years.

I can’t help but notice the power of circles, everything seems to be round

Minimum surface area for maximum volume innit?

wether coming from a big place, aliens would be able to bound about here

Yep – same as us going to the moon.

recall in my youth and school physics Light being explained to me as particles when I believed it to be a wavelength and I turned out to be right. So that perception only came about in the last fifty or so years.

Erm.. sounds like they didn’t explain it very well.
Did you ever do the double-slit experiments at school (circa 1803):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-slit_experiment

There is no time per se

Mmmm… I’m pretty sure there is.

even our measurement systems (google parsecs) are crude and earth based

That’s just a scale. As someone said earlier: just because a “milligram” is scale invented on Earth doesn’t mean there is no weight/mass.

it is highly likely that Aliens from bigger or small planets might view things using other parts of that spectrum and we may not be even able to view them with our perception.

Quite possible – but we can detect a very large range of the spectrum.
We can see wavelengths from 400 nm to 700 nm with our eyes.
But we can detect a huge range, like 10^-15m up to 10^8m

three digits = three fingers…. not numerical digits…

three digits = three fingers…. not numerical digits…

Yep got that (hence the typing quip).

We count in base 10 cos we’ve mainly* got 10 fingers see.
Seems reasonable to assume that if we had 3 fingers we might instead use base 3 or 4.

(* obviously the worldwide average is a bit lower than that)

three digits = three fingers…. not numerical digits…

Where do you think decimal comes from?

In the shower I once randomly sketched out a set of glyphs that could be used in a base-5 counting system with the constraints that numbers could be written as a single continuous block and easily etched with a stonemason’s chisel.

My wife thought I was quite mental. 😀

Three digits per arm, er could even be three arms.

But my point, the decimal system does it not come from our ten fingers then the next,

So if three were the multiple then 6 then 9 then it would start over ..

Then would there be eight bits in a byte.

Would their music have 9 beats in a bar?

I’m trying to illustrate in that crude post that our givens aint givens at all and that aliens could be a whole other thing that would be awkward to sya the least to see and communicate with, a bit like the earth worm spoken of earlier.

Clearly I’m no scientist, I’m interested, but not sufficiently to be governed by the discipline of proof, I just like to speculate.

The point about Mars was the difference in length of the year.

The point about Parsecs wasn’t time related, a clumsy sentence, I meant as I recall it’s a triangulation based from earth, how can that be considered a measure for ‘universal distance measure’ and distance has a relation to time if we are to travel. It’s as obscure as Miles are to Continentals.
So given my Martian length of a year, then maybe it is possible to travel faster than light. If the martians happened to measure the speed of light in the same method.

And anyway, yoda has 3 digits and he’s a Jedi master.

GrahamS – Member

Erm.. sounds like they didn’t explain it very well.
Did you ever do the double-slit experiments at school (circa 1803):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-slit_experiment

No, and that looks fascinating and I shall consider it tonight.

I went to school in the early sixties and it was particles and straight lines with light through prism experiments.
I reasoned that was improbable since light emanating from a single source would eventually diverge and there would have to be gaps, therefore it must be like waves as from a stone dropped in a pond, radio wave like, it follows that like a radio wave it must expand in a bubble. I don’t think quantum physics had reached Grammar school physics at that point (and ironically I’ve never gotten on with physics teachers, they tend to be cocks.)

And there was the fact you couldn’t actually ‘see’ light, Only what it touches, so the whole photon particle thing I wasn’t convinced by as you can’t ‘see’ a light stream from the side.

Anyway, I shall read that thing tonight wether it will convince me or not….

I could well be getting trolled here, but sharing knowledge is always good so:

But my point, the decimal system does it not come from our ten fingers then the next,
So if three were the multiple then 6 then 9 then it would start over ..

Yep so 3 fingers (in total) might mean they use a base-3 (aka ternary) number system.

Instead of the thousands, hundreds, tens and units “columns” of a decimal system (which equate to 10^3, 10^2, 10^1 and 10^0) where each column can be 0 to 9, a base-3 system has columns based on powers of 3 (3^3, 3^2, 3^1, 3^0) where each column can be 0 to 2.

So counting up to the equivalent of decimal 20 in that system would look like this:
1, 2, 10, 11, 12, 20, 21, 22, 100, 101, 102, 110, 111, 112, 120, 121, 122, 200, 201, 202

None of that changes any maths – only the representation of the numbers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ternary_numeral_system

Then would there be eight bits in a byte.

Quite possibly. It isn’t something determined by our decimal system, since computers count in binary (base-2).
And it is a pretty arbitrary number: early systems used 4 or 6 bits in a byte. The adoption of 8 bits was due to the use of the ASCII standard for encoding letters and numbers, which uses 7 bits plus 1 for a parity check: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASCII

I’m trying to illustrate in that crude post that our givens aint givens at all

Ah but you’ve shown many of them are. Maths is a great example of this. If you have 5 things and take away 2 of them then you are left with 3. This is fundamentally true regardless of how your civilisation actually represent the numbers.

The point about Parsecs … I recall it’s a triangulation based from earth, how can that be considered a measure for ‘universal distance measure’

Same as above really. Distance exists. It doesn’t really matter what names your civilisation give to its scales.

A ‘universal distance measure’ doesn’t mean that when/if we ever meet aliens they’ll somehow know what we mean when we say “parsec” – though if they have come to our solar system then it would be a fairly simple thing to explain!

So given my Martian length of a year, then maybe it is possible to travel faster than light. If the martians happened to measure the speed of light in the same method.

Erm no. The speed of light is unaltered. All that happens is a Martian’s light year is a considerably longer distance than an Earthling light year becauses they are two entirely different things – leading to all kinds of hilarious confusion at Interplanetary Earthling/Martian Astronomy Conventions.

There is substantial evidence from all periods of history to prove that there are races of being far in advance of our technological level.

Even if that was not the case, there is also the fact that on this world alone in the past few million years at least 3 different humanoid species have evolved, cromagnon , neanderthal and us.

Any logical person would conclude from this fact that we or beings very similar to us are a product of natural evolution when the appropriate planetary / biosphere conditions occur.

I would think that this world being as old as it is has probably birthed several very ancient races, who would see it as sacred!

Unlike the parasites that now defile it!

There is substantial evidence from all periods of history to prove that there are races of being far in advance of our technological level.

Go on, tell us more.

Has this been done yet?:

Contact

Top bit of Sci-fi and not a bad film either. The film has a great twist in the tail but is totally trumped by the twist in the book.

Sagan didn’t die. The mothership came for him…

Best if you research it for yourself, ancient cave paintings of ufo’s, the sumerian texts, any number of sources really.

I’m sure if you really want to learn the truth you will be able to find it! or even better just watch TV and you will know everything you’ll ever need too 😉

This guy ran the british governments UFO investigation project.
He’s gone from being a complete sceptic to a firm believer, how many documents and witness’s do you think he has had access too?

http://www.nickpope.net/

Any logical person would conclude from this fact that we or beings very similar to us are a product of natural evolution when the appropriate planetary / biosphere conditions occur.

How do figure that? The dinosaurs ruled the planet for a fair while and I don’t think they looked much like us.

The “pinnacle” of evolution this planet might be a bipedal hairless monkey, but that doesn’t mean it would work out that way on any planet suitable for life.