Another nail in Newsnight's coffin. Lord McAlpine misidentified

It would appear the Police provided the wrong information in the sinister North Wales pedophile ring story to the victim.

Clicky

It’s all kind of interesting this one. Do you know which airstrip the McApline private jet used to land at when it travelled to Wrexham, that’s it, Borras.
Do you know how far that is from Bryn Estyn?
The shit is still flying and nowhere near the fan yet.

Guardian are claiming it was another member of the McAlpine family who lived locally. You seem to know the area so like me you know who they are referring to.

My faith in the BBC has seriously been knocked by this. Not because of the Newsnight report – although that sounded a bit shoddy by any measure – but because I’ve just listened to John Humphries try to draw George Entwistle into a resignation trap. This whole culture of heads must role is really starting to get on my wick.

I’m just astounded that, given the amount of legal and editorial scrutiny the piece was under for days prior to transmission, and that they had free access to the person making the allegations, that no-one stuck a picture under his nose and said: ‘Is this the bloke?’. What exactly goes on in their editorial meetings?

Sadly, Entwhistle is in a spot of bother now though. After the Jimmy Saville/Newsnight debacle and the reputational damage it caused to the BBC, you’d have thought he’d have been taking a close interest via the Head of News in the run-up to this one.

What’s most damaging for newsnight and the BBC is its now looking like they’re employing the same scrupulous journalistic standards as Philip Scolfield on this morning!

Which is hardly the benchmark you want to be looking at for your flagship news programne

this seems a smokescreen,abuse did happen on an organised scale, and yes a certain person who is now dead was ‘implicated’ by many …..

The thing is, the abuse happeened in the 70,s when the lads where young, and the abusers where a lot older,memories become altered, and so do faces and bodies, so easy to make a mistake especially against someone bearing a similar name.

Yes indeed Borras airfield and Bryn Estyn are very close, with road a connecting them both.

Also a lot of the abusers will be in their 80,s or even dead,so litle can be achieved by prosecuting them, we just need to ensure lessons are learnt and it never happens again.

Also a lot of the abusers will be in their 80,s or even dead,so litle can be achieved by prosecuting them, we just need to ensure lessons are learnt and it never happens again.

Eh?

Could you provide a list of crimes which should be ignored due to age?

apologies that doesnt sound right,prosecutions will cost a lot of money, compensation to the abused will be a lot cheaper,and hopefully allow the lads to get on with their lives,but as i said lessons must be learnt from this very sad episode.

project – Member

apologies that doesnt sound right,prosecutions will cost a lot of money, compensation to the abused will be a lot cheaper

I’m genuinely taken aback by your response.

What the hell has cost got to do with it?
Apparantly, very annoyingly and inconveniently, the victims appear to want justice, not compensation.

Yes indeed Borras airfield and Bryn Estyn are very close, with road a connecting them both.

But the airfield is in the quarry complex that belonged to the McAlpine who is now dead, did Lord McAlpine even have a plane as davidjones15 seems to be implying?

Rusty, weare not going to agreee,perhaps next time youre in liverpool we can chat.

Justice has been denied to them for over 30 plus years,by those in charge and those in power higher up, what is going to change now, massive fees for the inquiries, and the court costs, money that should and must be given to the victims.

Rusty, weare not going to agreee,perhaps next time youre in liverpool we can chat.

No worries.

Justice has been denied to them for over 30 plus years,by those in charge and those in power higher up, what is going to change now, massive fees for the inquiries, and the court costs, money that should and must be given to the victims.

I suppose that depends on whether you value justice over cash?
And it’s not up to the victims to decide.
We as a society ultimately decide what happens to our criminals.

I’m just astounded that …. no-one stuck a picture under his nose and said: ‘Is this the bloke?’

I’m astounded that, having been told by police that McAlpine had abused him and shown a picture, this guy did’nt remotely follow the career of McAlpine (who, after all, was pretty high profile for the next 10 years).

Wouldn’t he have seen him on tv/papers before now and said “hang on, …” rather than waiting ’til the shit hits the fan and the expensive lawyers start getting involved ? I think I would have, but then nothing as awful as that has ever happened to me so I can’t know that

all a bit odd though, IMO

Isn’t Internet tittle tattle as we have above part of the problem with this investigation?

I thought the main problem was that it’s many, many years overdue ?

I’m with you scardeypants, very fishy indeed.

This shouldn’t be a BBC story anyway, justice for the victims is somewhat more important.

And just how would the BBC be behaving now if it had been a Murdoch outlet that produced this “story” and run in on every news broadcast for a week ?
This is another nail in the BBC coffin hopefully.

I see Entwhistle told Humphries he wasn’t even aware of the Newsnight package before it was put out. Remarkable. The national press pretty much all led on the prospect that Newsnight was going to ‘out’ a big name politician that evening. What DG, after ditching the Newsnight editor over Saville, wouldn’t be interested or aware of a second, potentially even more explosive, story?

Unfortunately for him, I don’t think that excuse is going to stick. Humphries rightly put the boot in.

Also a lot of the abusers will be in their 80,s or even dead,so litle can be achieved by prosecuting them, we just need to ensure lessons are learnt and it never happens again.

You can’t learn lessons without establishing the facts and publishing them. If there was organized sex abuse, doing that would likely involve identifying responsible people. You can’t have the government going around calling people sex a users without being put to proof. For my part, the fact that accused might be old is not something that worries me in itself – the harm stuck around a long time, so should the guilt for causing it. Prosecutions of WW2 war criminals still take place.

What’s the life expectancy of the witness now then? An accidental death before he changes his mind again?

Edukator is Kaesae, and I claim my £5.

did Lord McAlpine even have a plane as davidjones15 seems to be implying?

That’s not at all what I was implying.
I am just saying that the McAlpines flew in and out of Borras airfield on a regular basis, almost weekly, which is about 200m from what was Bryn Estyn and how that would fit in with carefully worded statements. If he flew in, would the Rolls Royce that he claims not or never to have owned been his?
Due to family connections, did he only make one visit to Wrexham? I know it’s a crap hole, but…
Clearly this whole episode should be directed at getting closure for the victims and taht the perpetrators are brought to book regardless of age or status.

FTFY

😆

as i understand it macalpines brother was the abuser, he owned the roller

but the police massively screwed up and IDd teh wrong guys

the previous investigation however didnt focus on this because they were only examining abuse carried out in care homes

children were taken out so several of the macalpine owned country estaes nearby and used as cheap labour and the abuse took place then
as well as at hotels

either way none of that was looked into last time which seems to be a massive fudge up and the lord macalpine thing is detracting from that

the fact is at least one tory is implicated in child abuse

cant believe people would actually want to loose thator the rest of the bbcs news output for that matter

That seems to be what is alleged kimbers so I don’t know why dj15 is still going down the Lord McAlpine route. As far as I remember there was a family feud between the brothers so no reason for Lord McAlpine to come up to wxm. Shockingly, it appears the poor kids were taken down to London for sex parties – http://news.sky.com/story/1009280/care-home-abuse-victim-tells-of-sex-parties

Hmm, Clark answered those allegations in 1994,

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/clark-denies-exposing-himself-to-harkess-girls-1419799.html

Seemingly there was no police involvement, no investigation, and throughout there was the involvement of clifford.

I’d suggest it may be worth recalling other ‘sex scandals’ that have involved Max Clifford as the main conduit – Neil & Christine Hamilton & John Leslie for example..

I don’t know why dj15 is still going down the Lord McAlpine route

Because dj15 is keeping an open mind and isn’t gullible enough to simply accept a public denial on the part of one of the named abusers and like most top tory boys, he won’t be too familiar with the truth will he?
Let’s see what comes out in the wash.

I think you will find that Steve Messham has apologised for mistakenly naming Lord MacAlpine. Still, if it makes you feel better go ahead and bash the torys 🙂

The truth will come out and justice will be done irrespective of any political allegiance.

I think you will find that Steve Messham has apologised for mistakenly naming Lord MacAlpine.

I wonder if any pressure was put on him there. I’m more than happy that the turn around of events has happened so quickly, nothing suspicious there.
You appear to believe that the tories have never lied, if you’re happy believing that, then knock yourself out. Too many poor tory wannabes here in sunny Wrexham.

You appear to believe this is a political issue.

if you’re happy believing that, then knock yourself out.

You appear to believe this is a political issue.

No, I do believe it is possible that a leading member of the tory party, or indeed any political party, could have less than a good relationship with the truth.
Would you blindly believe everything that Blair/Cameron says?
It’s the position in politics and not the political party.
It doesn’t always have to be a political issue simply because politics is mentioned, or does it?

Some of this sounds a bit far fetched but still kind of believable. Even if half of it’s true then things are going to get really messy!

http://mountzion144.ning.com/group/thetruthrevealed/forum/topics/the-paedophile-ring-that-encircles-british-politics-by-s-c-name?xg_source=activity

You appear to believe that the tories have never lied

You won’t get me defending the tories dj15, and if you want to go down the tory route take a look at the daily mail article that links Peter Morrison with Bryn Estyn. You also don’t know wrexham very well with your refernce to ‘wanabee tories’.

I believe the establishment were involved in the abuse at Bryn Estyn and people in and around wrexham want the full truth to come out, especially around one establishment person who is not related to any political party.

Entwistle falls on his sword.

I wonder what his retirement fund looks like.

I listened to Today this morning and Humpharies just wanted Entwhistle to resign on the spot. The DG of the BBC cannot micromanage all the news output generated by the BBC (which also includes the Today programme). I would expect a producer to be axed for failing to follow editorial rules, but not the DG.

Just to keep a couple of facts straight. Newsnight did not name Mcalpine, in fact the entire BBC was very keen to not name him. It reported that an abused child had claimed that he was sexually assaulted by a senior tory.

Perhaps ITV should be conducting a similar investigation against Philip Schofield – who on that programme authorised that!

You also don’t know wrexham very well with your refernce to ‘wanabee tories’.

You see the problem here, it’s simply the case that I’ve only been to Wrexham once, and my memory might be failing a bit.