26killed in america. sky news now.

For them all everywhere – possibly NSFW but its just about a gun 😉

Happiness is a warm gun
( bang bang shoot shoot )
Happiness is a warm gun, yes it is
(bang bang shoot shoot)

When I hold you in my arms (oh yes)
When I feel my finger on your trigger (oh yes)
I know nobody can do me no harm
Because
happiness is a warm gun, momma
Happiness is a warm gun
-Yes it is.
Happiness is a warm, yes it is…
Gun!
Well don’t ya know that happiness is a warm gun, momma? (yeah)
Comes from an advert

I have the strangest boner.

Tough luck you aint getting any for months 😉

My youngest celebrated her 5th birthday party today along with 5 other friends of her age.

I can’t imagine what it must have been like to experience what went on 🙁

We do not watch very much in the way of television so we have avoided to watch the news.

I don’t think it would have been right to have watched coverage of it when we are celebrating the life of a wee ‘un.

Will this event change the views of that country? I doubt it unfortunately.

nice one ho hum i can read the crap accent
🙂

I think it’s totally precient if you live there to bring up the gun laws in a political conversation, especially if you are the president. Surely Obama could change one thing before his office is ended. these weapons have to end
.

If I didn’t have the virtual outlet of the various incarnations of GTA over the years, goodness knows what I might have done in real life.

Sadly some of my more religious FB buddies have started posting this drivel…..

So apparently its not to do with crazy people and easy access to guns after all.

Cultivating an appetite for violence is not healthy for society. Wether or not you might actually be the next Thomas Hamilton or Michael Ryan.

Who knew that playing “cowboys and Indians” with toy guns would turn me into a mass murderer?

Not sure taking extreme views here will help

I think few of us will think that violence in games and society in general will help reduce violence but how causal it is in creating violence we can never really know.

FWIW experiments consistently show that kids who watch violent stuff then play more violently. I am not sure I would generalise this to mass murder but I would be sure it is not helping reduce violence

just been reading about Victoria Soto, one of the teachers who died. she hid her class in a cupboard and faced the gunman so he wouldn’t look for them, telling him the kids were in a different part of the school.
that’s **** brave that is. well done girl. rip

Is it standard practice to have cupboards large enough to hide a whole class full of schoolkids in?

i dunno, my school had big storecupboards that were certainly big enough to get the whole class in. but it was an old victorian/edwardian building so didnt really lack space

I struggle with long sentences but Morgan Freeman had this to say.. pretty sage I reckon

Morgan Freeman’s brilliant take on what happened yesterday :

“You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here’s why.

It’s because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed
people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he’ll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN’s article says that if the body count “holds up”, this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer’s face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer’s identity? None that I’ve seen yet. Because they don’t sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you’ve just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man’s name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news.”

Is it standard practice to have cupboards large enough to hide a whole class full of schoolkids in?

Everything is bigger in America.

Including their gun problem.

TBH, I was wondering if these cupboards were actually “panic rooms”. The idea that such a thing would be standard in school design……

yeah i figured that was your thoughts, i dont think so, it was described as a store cupboard. i think a panic room would be a better idea then arming the teachers though for the reasons mentioned above. shame either option needs consideration really…

Morgan Freeman’s the man.

Not sure that the car v guns argument really holds up. Alcohol, tobacco and drugs probably kill more than cars so where do we stop with the banning of specific items. We then end up with steam irons kill more than hair dryers so ban steam irons. There really is no correlation between vehicle deaths and gun deaths particularly in the UK where guns are restricted and vehicles are freely available.

As it happens there are more vehicle deaths in the US than gun deaths.

I cant understand why the thread degenerates into personal arguments when we should be thinking about the tragedy. Unfortunately the “right to bare arms” is part of what the US hold most sacred, their constitution. Until they realise the world is now a very different place than when the constitution was formulated they won’t begin to prevent this.

I can only assume that the next tragedy will be an attempt on “the record” to create the worst gun tragedy in US history.

As someone who lost his hobby after Dunblane (and I fully understand why the new measures were put in place) I can see it from the gun owners point of view. What’s needed is a sensible approach with all parties coming to an agreement on the best plan for moving forward to try to make their country a safer place to be…..but by all parties, I mean just that.

It’s easy to blame it all on the access to machine guns but there are way more factors that need to be taking into account rather than just blaming the NRA for the ills that America suffers from. There are plenty of countries around the world that allows their citizens access to guns, allows them to defend their property and themselves but not the extent that America does.

The Morgan freeman thing is fake. Standard for the sh**e that’s posted on facebook

still.. fake or not.. the message has some value..

I suspect that you too are fake comrade.. but thanks for the useful input there.. 😉

@Comrade – Let me ask how you know the Morgan Freeman thing is a fake. Plus wether or not it is it does have some substance and the best you can come up with is that its fake. I guess that you consider that a worthwhile contribution!

the ownership of guns in america as more to do with Nathaniel “Nat” Turner than the 2nd amendment,he is still the american nightmere

druidh – Member

Is it standard practice to have cupboards large enough to hide a whole class full of schoolkids in?

Was at my school. I think they were supposed to be full of stuff- books, paper, etc- but they were nice and empty because Thatcher.

You’ve not been to the 3rd world then? Maybe if their rich/powerful gave a toss, then we could be accused of doing nothing – but until those countries do more to help their poor, then I’m doing nothing else.

….I understand the sentiment, it helps us sleep easy knowing its not our fault. On some level though, their our poor.

I was wondering if these cupboards were actually “panic rooms”.

Might well come

One of the teachers was desgnate as responsible for security – not really sure what this means
The school had to be designated as a gun free zone

I would say you are in deep do do if you are at this stage

When suggestions for solutions include letting god in or arming teachers then it makes me want to shake my head in disbeleief

Its a strange a country – they think they are the envy of the world but tbh living like that would not appeal to me in any way shape or form and it has a dark under belly to the American dream and such complete individualism.

It seems that those at the margins are so disenfranchised [ with easy access to guns] that stiff like this will keep happening

What they want to do about is their problem but it would seem clear there is little need for militia or for folk to be armed lest the govt oppress them.

I dont think many will willingly give up this right so , tragic though it clearly is, I fear they may need to get used to one of these every year or so 😥

bwaarp – Member

What really concerns me is I think that the cats out the bag in terms of guns in the USA, there are millions and millions of illegal guns in the US and loads of recorded crime using illegal weapons….those states that have concealed carry laws have lower crime rates.

Indeed. The problem is that the country has been living with the wild west/Rambo/right to bear arms fantasy nonsense for a long time.

The public are heavily armed so criminals are heavily armed.

The argument that people should be free to own weapons to protect them from the government is somewhat twisted.

So the Americans it seems have so **** their country by allowing easy access to semi automatic weapons that it’s become like nukes….ie certain countries have nukes and can’t get rid of them because international security is effectively a mexican standoff.

Yes, an “Arms Race” is the phrase used. It just escalates ad infinitum …until somebody decides to stop it.

There’s a lot of fear and paranoia about crime. I’ve heard a lot of US citizens using the terms “bad guys” and “good guys”, which suggest a somewhat quaint, over-simplified view.

It wouldn’t surprise me if gun sales increased after each of these school/college/mall shootings, although handling a handgun in an emergency situation – whipping it out quickly and accurately, then shooting the armed assailant(s) without harming bystanders is easier said than done.

If the legal guns are gotten rid of, it does seem that there will still be plenty of illegal guns and crime will actually increase.

It’s not going to be a quick or easy solution, but something needs to be done to begin changing the arguably sick culture of violence and gun use, both domestically and with regard to foreign wars.

As somebody pointed out earlier, there is a very large difference between rural folk hunting wildlife in the forest with rifles and urban dwellers carrying semi-auto pistols on their person -something which seems absolutely ludicrous to members of other supposedly orderly societies…

“Hmm, I need some milk and bread from the local shop… Where are my keys, my wallet, possibly my phone and, oh silly me, I almost forgot, my 9mm semi-automatic pistol with hollow-point rounds. I’ll not walk because my assault rifle is in the car and, you never know, I might just need it “

Having travelled about the world (USA included) without any form of firearm in my pocket or vehicle I’ve never felt that I needed one.

Its difficult to legislate for the insane, without trampling the rights of the sane. Makes a mockery of majority rules.

lazybike – Member

Its difficult to legislate for the insane, without trampling the rights of the sane. Makes a mockery of majority rules.

Why should the majority have the right (or the need) to carry semi-auto pistols around though?

urban dwellers carrying semi-auto pistols on their person -something which seems absolutely ludicrous to members of other supposedly orderly societies…

I spent a week in Texas at a shooting competition, the thing that truly shocked me, was the fact that you can do a one day course to legally carry a concealed weapon.

Junkyard

One of the teachers was desgnate as responsible for security – not really sure what this means
The school had to be designated as a gun free zone

I would say you are in deep do do if you are at this stage

When suggestions for solutions include letting god in or arming teachers then it makes me want to shake my head in disbeleief

This was a fairly rural area too.

To the outsider it seems that they are missing the point. Ramping up the firepower isn’t solving the problem.

Junkyard

Its a strange a country – they think they are the envy of the world but tbh living like that would not appeal to me in any way shape or form and it has a dark under belly to the American dream and such complete individualism.

I like the US (the parts I’ve been to), but what struck me when I first went there was the number of visibly poor people, very run-down neighbourhoods and the level of ‘scruffiness’. Outside of large cities, nobody walks anywhere either. Middle-income people had a very pleasant lifestyle though.

Despite what some people like to think, the UK has more in common with our European neighbours.

Why should the majority have the right (or the need) to carry semi-auto pistols around though?

No idea…I think it’s a principal thing with them.

lazybike – Member

Why should the majority have the right (or the need) to carry semi-auto pistols around though?

No idea…I think it’s a principal thing with them.

It’s fairly screwed-up, that’s what it is.

You or I could jump in our car and drive down to Southern Europe. At no point would we consider the need to carry fire-arms.

“Joe Middle America” considering a similar journey would probably have to consider how/where he would carry his personal side-arm and, possibly vehicle weapon, as he passed through the various states. If stopped by the law he would be careful to keep his hands in view so as not to concern the officer (with his pistol drawn).

If you or I travel to the USA and make the same journey, we would be unarmed….

How many (non-military/law) people feel that any point in their life would have been enhanced by carrying one of these concealed about their person?

or one of these in the house/car?

Ramping up the firepower isn’t solving the problem.

It does seem they think more armed folk will stop armed folk…you can sort of see their argument but it is obvious that the best way to reduce gun crime is to massively restrict access to guns- works here for example

That said there seems to be something in the psyche of americans as well as the huge numbers of weapons.

Its a strange one in all honesty if I knew hoodlums were armed on the streets etc i suspect I would also be armed – how they break this cycle I dont know

Re concealed weapons reducing crime the picture is somewhat unclear as the reduction also coincides with the massive increase in incarceration so it may be an effect of that rather than guns per se.

While Americans only represent about 5 percent of the world’s population, nearly one-quarter of the entire world’s inmates have been incarcerated in the United States in recent years.[3]

Just WOW at that

It’s fairly screwed-up, that’s what it is.

as are many things 🙂 I did notice whilst I was there that people are really polite, even on the roads, I guess knowing people maybe armed keeps everyone calm.

Junky – thats very interesting when you look at it against this:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2c/Violent_Crime_Rates_in_the_United_States.svg/518px-Violent_Crime_Rates_in_the_United_States.svg.png

Prison works?

Zulu-Eleven – do you think that the residents of the US feel safer now than they did in 1990?

I like that the rates all tail off after Ecstacy use became mainstream..