come on zokes pull your socks up and tell us which ones you would do! Talk about not being in this together...
Boris even claimed the EU stops us exporting haggis to America.[url= http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/boris-johnson-haggis-ruth-davidson-bbc-debate_uk_5769a36be4b098ec71a01f66 ]Boris you're a tumshie[/url] The USA banned import of products containing offal in 1971
come on zokes pull your socks up and tell us which ones you would do! Talk about not being in this together...
I wouldn't want to spoil Jamby's thunder, he seems to have it all sussed, just waiting for him to divulge his masterplan.
[img] 
[/img]
I'm waiting but I have a warm feeling
jambalaya
Yet again I will say that the issue of immigration has not been well dealt with throughout the UK and indeed Europe. When you don't deal with a small issue it has a habbit of becoming a large problem.
What the right wing press have been good at, is dehumanising people from Eastern Europe. Making them seem like faceless automatons or worse, whose only capable emotion is 'desparation' is a tactic that has sadly worked.
The reports of a small town of criminals many from Poland, Bulgaria and Hungary were worrying. Not a mention that the second highest quantity of foreign nationals in UK prisons are from Ireland. It does not progress the isolationist cause to talk of Irish paedophiles and murderers. It is much better to demonise those of Eastern Europe.
The UK was full in the 40's and 50's before people arrived in numbers from India and ****stan. It was full in the 60's before people came here from The Carribean, it was full in early 00's before people came here from Poland, it was full 5 years ago before people came here from Bulgaria, and it is now full as people wish to come here from Syria.
Looking into bare statistics during the referendum I have been taken by how much UK migration is non EU. MORE THAN 50%. A points based 'Australian' system could have dealt with this half if people wanted it. People wishing to copy the Australian system and have a level playing field for all immigrants should remember that Australia has a special immigration relationship with New Zealand.
It would have been nice if remain had managed to say that the people coming here from Eastern Europe marry people born in the UK, have children born in the UK, spend their hard earned wages in the same shops, cafes, restaurants and cinemas as those born in the UK. Take their kids to the same soft play centres and visitor attractions.
If my sons school class is full and the new Bulgarian kid turns up for their first day, I would feel more proud to live in a country where the kids were told to budge up a bit to make room, rather than send the child packing back to where they belong with their 'desperate' parents.
Britain won't leave the EU.
As a nation we have walked to the edge of the cliff and looked over. Rather than seeing the promised land of milk and honey, we have seen a long drop and the rocks below. No one is going to be insane enough to push the A50 button, not least BJ. There will be some sort of fudge around the fact that the referendum was not binding and the winning margin was small. There might even be a second referendum, possibly with a slightly different question.
Athgray - terrific post.
If my sons school class is full and the new Bulgarian kid turns up for their first day, I would feel more proud to live in a country where the kids were told to budge up a bit to make room, rather than send the child packing back to where they belong with their 'desperate' parents.
Athgray - well said!
athgray +1
Athgray +1 post of the week
Yes Athgray +1, well said.
"disintegration of the EU practically irreversible." - George Soros ..
[quote=noltae ]"disintegration of the EU practically irreversible." - George Soros ..
He also said last Friday would be a financial meltdown in the UK.
It would be interesting to see the voting of the area posters are from
Mine was 72% leave. And yes there is a correlation with the number of eu migrants and the number of beers cans and rubbish lobbed in the hedges.
There is also a correlation of fly tipping and arrival of caravans in the summer time.
* not sure what tyskie or perla beer tastes like.. any opinions from stwers.
ROW for me...
I suspect you are right. The shower of shit in Whitehall are going to spend ages looking for their balls.Britain won't leave the EU.
I fancy placing some money on this - where can I get odds?
athgray +1
[i]Leavers don't seem to have understood that they have just left a comfortable exclusive club and are standing outside in the rain because they refused to pay a membership fee that amounted to less than half an hours work a week.[/i]
Yep. Worse-case scenario working on Leaves' numbers, it was a £1 a day for our household - at that rate I've spent more on dinner than it costs us for a years 'subscription'. Bargain!
I was reading in the Independant of the people of Salfords who voted leave - they basically said that they knew tough times were coming, they have been through a lot of tough times already, and were willing to suffer the pain in the hope that things might get better, as they were already pretty bad in their view.
They saw four week waiting times for doctors appointments, unable to get into schools, etc. Problems that are just based on numbers of people.
So I have a solution to ignoring the referendum result:
We do not leave the EU, but middle/higher earner taxes are ramped up for a period of time to pay for infrastructure improvements in those areas of the country where immigration numbers have caused pressure on local facilities, like schools, doctors and hospitals.
Even if it is not actually immigraton numbers that cause the problem but just overpopulation leading to a perceived immigration problem, the problem remains and those areas will also be redeveloped.
Most middle/high earners will not complain of short term tax increases because we are not leaving the EU and therefore they won't see such financial turmoil/impact.
And the country will not look too bad in the eyes of the world as it is taking positive, socially progressive, action - from which the EU might learn something.
So I have a solution to ignoring the referendum result:
We do not leave the EU, but middle/higher earner taxes are ramped up for a period of time to pay for infrastructure improvements in those areas of the country where immigration numbers have caused pressure on local facilities, like schools, doctors and hospitals.
Even if it is not actually immigraton numbers that cause the problem but just overpopulation leading to a perceived immigration problem, the problem remains and those areas will also be redeveloped.
Most middle/high earners will not complain of short term tax increases because we are not leaving the EU and therefore they won't see such financial turmoil/impact.
And the country will not look too bad in the eyes of the world as it is taking positive, socially progressive, action - from which the EU might learn something.
You are Jeremy Corbyn and I claim my five Australian Dollars (not much point requesting pounds now)
(And please don't take that badly, it's what needs to happen IMO, and something as a higher earner I would have no problem with)
You are Jeremy Corbyn and I claim my five Australian Dollars (not much point requesting pounds now)
what's wrong with that then ? maybe 2/3rd of people will think they won from the result. 1/3 still hacked off with the neo-liberal EU.
Yeah, the tories will raise taxes for rich people instead of brexit, that's a real flier.
Genuine question to all those who voted remain. If we entered the EU wholeheartedly, and by that I mean use the Euro etc would you still vote remain?
Turnerguy, the UK is a low tax society, despite the mail and express arguing otherwise, and as far as roads, NHS etc go you get what you pay for.
Problem in the UK, is not and never has been Brussels, just far to easy for Westminster to blame them rather than actually deal with the problems.
Going forward
Would you want to be the Tory leader who presses the button. Have to admire Cameron on that, by resigning he really has ****ed his successor.
Sum up, the UK has been given a revolver and asked to play Russian roulette
No. The Euro was clearly a failure. Nobody is suggesting that it makes any sense as an economic option. As I may have said elsewhere. There is much about the EU that is had to get enthusiastic about. But overall, that doesn't mean we should leave.
those who voted remain. If we entered the EU wholeheartedly, and by that I mean use the Euro etc would you still vote remain?
The Euro is a tricky one. It's a great idea that would only work properly in a fully federal Europe with a unified fiscal policy. I'm not sure I have a problem with that end point provided all checks and balances were in place, but I'm not sure the Euro is so great in the status quo.
That is an interesting comment! But what of democracy?
@imnotverygood..fair point, how easy is it for the EU to ditch the euro and start again? It seems as though the EU needs to restructure.
Yeah, the tories will raise taxes for rich people instead of brexit, that's a real flier.
but the argument is that if we brexit then it will cost them more money than temporary tax hikes.
Plus there's not as many rich voters and poor, so the impact on a strong leader than implements it will be less.
Am genuinely going to look at putting a few quid on us not leaving. Have we done the FB post that's circulating yet (and I assume swear filter will butcher)
Right. **** this. We're ALL up shit creek and we need a paddle. Now, not in three months.Fellow Remain voters: Enough already. Yes, we're all pissed off but navel gazing ain't gonna help. Not all 17 million Leave voters can possibly be racist northern pensioners without an O level to their name. Maybe they have a point about this quitting the EU thing? Maybe not. Whatever, we are where we are and no amount a whinging is gonna change that. Allegedly we're the intelligent ones, so get your thinking caps on.
Leave voters. Well done. Good game. We hear you. Now you need to get stuck in to the aftermath and not just piss off back to Wetherspoons. (Just banter, ****s!). And the first person to say they "want their country back" gets deported to ****ing Gibraltar. OK?
Politicians.
David. **** off. Shut the door behind you. Now.
George. You may be a **** but you're our ****. Plus you know the passwords for our Junior Savers account. Get your calculator. Drop the face-like-a-slapped-ass routine. You're on.
Boris. Sorry mate. That photo of you abseiling by your scrotum over the London Olympics while waving a Union Jack can't ever be un-taken. Plus, you'll never be able to appear on Question Time again without some sturdy Glaswegian nurse asking where the **** her 350 million quid is. Not only will she have a very good point, she'll be wearing a T shirt that shows you gurning in front of that ****ing bus! No captains hat for you I'm afraid.
Theresa. You're in charge love. Get the biggest shoulder pads you've got. We need Ming The Merciless in drag and you'll scare the shit out of 'em.
Nicola. Yep. Fair cop. You probably could get us on a technicality, as could London. But we ****ing love shortbread. And oil. And to be honest you're probably the best politician we've got, so we need you on side. Sort your lot out and we promise never to mention that Jimmy Krankie thing again (although it is pretty uncanny) and we'll make you a Dame once we're sorted. Bring Ruth Davidson. She kicks ass.
Opposition party. We'll need one. Someone take Jeremy and John back to the British Legion Club where you found them. Take Nigel as well. Give back their sandals, buy them a pint, then go to Heathrow and collect David Milliband. **** it. Lets gets Ed Balls as well. He keeps George on his toes. I think he works on the lottery kiosk at Morrisons now?
Oh. And Mark Carney. Give him a knighthood and tell him to keep that shit coming. We definitely need more of that good shit!
Everyone set? Right. Hold the Easyjet. We're going to Brussels and this ain't no hen party.
I heard the brexiters now at least have a name for the plan they are formulating.
"The Edinburgh Defence"
@zokes For me that's half the problem..If we're all in then so be it we'll get on with it..but if there's no stomach for that then we may as well do our own thing..
What's going to happen to Londons financial reputation if world markets fall further ? Losing a lot of international investors lots of money on a whim is not going to help with investment and trust in the future rUK further down the line. Not a fan of globalization and corporations but you can't grab the world economy by the throat and stab it in the back without expecting some kind of penalty.
MSP 😀
I've been away this weekend (TUTB), but saw this- apols if this has been posted, but I'm now wondering about Cameron's strategy in all of this- has he outplayed BoJo, Gove, and the Brexiters?
"Did we do this yet? I've been away a couple of days:
If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.
Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.
With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.
How?
Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.
And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legislation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.
The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.
The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?
Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?
Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-manoeuvred and check-mated.
If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.
The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.
When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.
All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign."
Hmm.
There is much about the EU that is hard to get enthusiastic about. That doesn't mean we should leave
@imnotvery the problem for Remain was that's a bl00dy hard strap line for a campaign 8)
1) Cost us less
2) Regain our "sovereignty"
3) Reduce immigration
4) Improve productivity
5) Lift living standards
6) Increase trade
@zokes it amuses me that as I have no clue, idiot, ... Insert insot of choice here ... I keep popping up on the "winning side" even on the Referendum where I though institutional support and resistance to change would me a Remain victory
1) No budget contribution, zero - if EU won't budge we'll go with full tariffs and make a profit
2) No ECJ jurisdiction over anything except EU specific trade, freedom to set taxes and regulations, freedom to agree trade deals with who we like
3) We may chose to incease immigration, eg tech savvy IT bods from India and China to boost our tech sector (compare us pound for pound with Isreal whcih kicks @rse in that area)
4) Focus on tech, as an aside productivity will likely fall in traditional industries as wages rise
5) See 6
6) Focusing on high growth regions of the world rather than the corpse that EU will beome post Greek default and contagion. EU markets already down more than the UK as investors realise its more of a problem for them than us
@imnotvery the problem for Remain was that's a bl00dy hard strap line for a campaign
Dunno - Jezza did OK:
[b]The EU: Seven out of Ten[/b]
This just keeps getting more and more ridiculous... "There is no brexit plan":
http://news.sky.com/video/1717859/islam-there-is-no-brexit-plan
4) Focus on tech, as an aside productivity will likely fall in traditional industries as wages rise
Company i work for is also in high tech stuff, no way they can continue working here outside the EU as we deal with all the European car manufacturers.
If you want high tech, you going to have to start again from scratch, because a lot of the existing companies focus on the EU.
I'm just going to leave this here.
I've just been chatting to a mate who's a teacher. She spent Friday trying to comfort an inconsolable Polish kid (great student - speaks better English than mosy of the class). The kids of the more triumphalist hard-of-thinking parents had been relentlessly bullying him saying how 'your lot' are all going to be 'sent home'.
Welcome to post referendum Britain 2016. Twinned with Berlin 1933
I feel ashamed of what my country has become
Facebook, Uber, Google, Apple ... all those EU based and focused tech co's eh ? I discovered the Sat Nav app I used was Israeli (until bought by Google recently)
Tech is probably the leading business where location makes pretty much zero difference. Write an app stick it on the app store. Write software and sell it where you like, absolute worst case you hire an EU saleman and stick him in an office somewhere
@binner a terrible story indeed but why didn't his parents make it clear to him that he'd have the right to stay so that when these yobs piped up he could respond
As an aside his native Poland is far less accepting of immigrants and refugees than is this country
'm just going to leave this here.I've just been chatting to a mate who's a teacher. She spent Friday trying to comfort an inconsolable Polish kid (great student - speaks better English than mosy of the class). The kids of the more triumphalist hard-of-thinking parents had been relentlessly bullying him saying how 'your lot' are all going to be 'sent home'.
Welcome to post referendum Britain 2016. Twinned with Berlin 1933
I feel ashamed of what my country has become
As you'll be aware Binners, kids have always taunted other kids, and while there are lots of reasons to feel a little ashamed of your country, I don't really feel this is a great example, and certainly not worthy of the comparison you've made.
@Horatio - how silly of you to have taken any notice of what tech start-up bosses say about the prospects for their business. You should have just asked the resident experts. Bet you feel daft now!!
@binners - ****less Polish parents not teaching their kid the details of the Treaty of Vienna. Bloody foreigners.
DrJ indeed the Guardian that well known tech journal.
DrJ indeed the Guardian that well known tech journal.
The interviewees said what they said. Of course they lack your profound insight, but hey, nobody's perfect.
@binner a terrible story indeed but why didn't his parents make it clear to him that he'd have the right to stay so that when these yobs piped up he could respond
Yeah that's the way the world works 🙄
My 9 year old son was upset on Thursday morning as he was told by others that he would not be able to go to see his French family if Brexit won.
DrJ indeed the Guardian that well known tech journal.
jambalaya, I currently feel absolutely shit about this entire situation, and would literally love to see some reassuring links to alternative sources which describe how any tech companies are going to invest more money now we've decided to leave the EU??
Naming some US tech giants, or telling us about a satnav you've bought isn't reassuring in the slightest.
Here's a non guardian link:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/06/24/tech_firms_reel_at_brexit_vote/
A compassionate bunch these Brexiteers.
I'll make no further comment. You're making my point for me....
if you think Britain is racist now you should have seen what it was like being a kid in the 70s.
That included the teachers too!
Well that's ok then. We're not as bad as 1970? Job done then. The benchmark we've all longed for. Is that because we don't call them ****s and ****'s any more? At least not in public. Or is there more to it than that?
Oh... and I was a kid in the 1970's. So ... been there, done that
A compassionate bunch these Brexiteers.I'll make no further comment. You're making my point for me....
Argued like a true Brexite(e)r. 😉
Actually, seriously, I see no reason to undermine the seriousness of the occasion by conflating your friends experience with Berlin in 1933. There is no similarity, but arguing that there is just confuses and inflames the situation. Ill founded statements and beliefs are what got us into this mess, and the stuff you've just said isn't going to help.
Is it really?
16million voted remain. Yet remain voters focus on 'only 17.4m voted leave so it can't be right'. Would 16million be right to ignore or overturn a democratic vote? No.
I've been called a few names over the past few weeks. I've not risen to any of this and one lad prompted my partner to intervene. I think all sides should look at their conduct but I find it especially sad when narrow minded thought, invective and bile is aimed at another just because he has a different viewpoint to you.
Instead of the 'I heard a story of a mate who heard from one person's experience' we should focus on being positive, look ahead now and stop being increasingly bitter. As I get older I've realised that the press exists to stir negativity, put a negative angle and spin on all reporting whilst only reporting half the facts to create a clear to palete story. There's alot of trolling going on in the press at the moment. We'd be better off not reading any news articles for a while.
Peace to all. We are all in this for the journey and full duration.
I do apologise. A newly emboldened gang of right wing facists is just fine
Sorry.
Shall I wave my little Union Jack now? I've been dying too. I'm so chuffed we're 'Taking Back Control'. It's all very exciting! When do we get to send them all back?
I think all sides should look at their conduct but I find it especially said when narrow minded thought, invective and bile is aimed at another just because he has a different viewpoint to you.
I think its worse when its just because someone is another nationality.
if you think Britain is racist now you should have seen what it was like being a kid in the 70s.
That included the teachers too!
Perhaps binners, like me, had hoped that we had moved on further than we obviously have.
It has not been pretty - but that is why freedom of speech is important. It much better to know exactly where people stand. And we have a much clearer view of the society in which we live as a result of this referendum.
yes on the receiving end of racism both back in the 70s and even now .. funny how most people think its black and asian people that suffer racism and any one else is ok just because we dont make a song and dance about it. Interesting how even now racist views from the 70s are still present and highlighted by binners
jambalaya
As an aside his native Poland is far less accepting of immigrants and refugees than is this country
This was the case I discovered speaking to one of my colleagues, which is exactly why in my opinion not only Britian suffers but also Europe. The free movement of people in the EU had allowed us a greater understanding of the people and culture of Eastern Europe as well as showing them how tolerant and accepting we were. Sadly any potential immigrants from these countries won't get to experience the UK's tolerance.
On UKIP's breaking point poster and the press again, it's like a centipede with many hundreds of bearded human heads. This centipede is here to take your job in its 'deperation' for a quick buck to pay for razor blades and shaving foam. It will slump into your hard earned hospital bed when its many legs breaks down, and its great many offspring will sit at the school chair filling their brains with the knowledge previously destined for your child by birthright.
All the 'leftie' press could reply with to this onslaught, was a description of who these people are, where they are, and why the are there. Shocking.
Numbness has passed since Friday, and am now feeling appalled and shocked quite frankly.
John Pilger on why Britain voted for Brexit and why it might be a good thing.
[url= http://johnpilger.com/articles/why-the-british-said-no-to-europe ]Linky[/url]
Blames everyone
The more that I think about this and read about it, the more confident I am that we won't activate Article 50.
- no Tory PM will want to go down as the one who broke the Union and restarted the Troubles (I love that euphemism)
- the Establishment will not tolerate anything that harms their country based on just 1 million (1/65th of the population) votes from Daz and Shazz in Dudley and Burnley. There are big names coming out against Brexit, and when the only people congratulating you on your victory are Sarah Palin, Donald Trump and Marine Le Pen, the writing's on the wall.
- no government is going to make a call of this magnitude based on a 4% majority. There will be an election, after enough time that the muppets who voted Out will have reconsidered.
- there are too many loopholes: the referendum is non-binding; there might be a new mandate from an almost inevitable general election (given the ongoing leadership contests); there might be a parliamentary vote; an EU leader (such as Merkel - make no mistake, the elected leaders don't want us to go, regardless of what the bureaucrats might say) might offer face-saving concessions.
And if none of that happens, all I have to say to the Leavers is: you stupid ****ing fools.
Numbness has passed since Friday, and am now feeling appalled and shocked quite frankly.
+1
My god. Did someone just actually respond to a story about a gang of kids bullying an individual by blaming the parents for not arming him with the correct debating points in return?
Asides from the utter halfwittery behind that comment, what do you think would have happened had the kids answered them back confidently? Most likely they would have kicked the shit out of him as that is what thugs do when words don't work.
Over the next few weeks I can also see the police getting incredibly pissed off with having to deal with shit like this day in day out.
Sorry, Brexiters, time to face up to the elements in our society that you have courted and are now desperately back-pedaling away from. The sheer cynicism behind the Leave campaign has been breath-taking. Farage has paraded himself to all the old farts who would have voted BNP, but didn't like being associated with 'that sort'. Now Farage has done a passable impersonation of the 'right sort of chap' they had someone they could get behind without looking overtly racist at the golf club.
My god. Did someone just actually respond to a story about a gang of kids bullying an individual by blaming the parents for not arming him with the correct debating points in return?
Asides from the utter halfwittery behind that comment, what do you think would have happened had the kid answered them back confidently? Most likely they would have kicked the shit out of him as that is what thugs do when words don't work.
Over the next few weeks I can also see the police getting incredibly pissed off with having to deal with shit like this day in day out.
Sorry, Brexiters, time to face up to the elements in our society that you have courted and are now desperately back-pedaling away from. The sheer cynicism behind the Leave campaign has been breath-taking. Farage has paraded himself to all the old farts who would have voted BNP, but didn't like being associated with 'that sort'. Now Farage has done a passable impersonation of the 'right sort of chap' they had someone they could get behind without looking overtly racist at the golf club.
There is a lot of chatter about Brexit but not Brexit. See article below.
We might end up with soft Brexit with keeping the UK together trumping the hardline leavers. If there was enough restriction on movement for parliament to keep the leavers happy.
Who knows bit of a cliffhanger this whole malarkey. One would hope they been yakking to each and their counterparts while citizens anxiously chew their fingernails.
@corroded the insults are pretty boring. The EU is financially bust, its anti-democratic, its corrupt, it exists to frustrate international trade. No thanks we are far better off out.
@binners immigration has accelerated markedly. I went back some time ago and looked at the census going back 40 years (only 5 documents of course). Immigration has accelerated markedly and especially since Poland joined the EU. The number of Poles now outnumbers the previous #1 country India, so in 10 years we've had more Polish than 100 years of immigration from India. I found before that in 2001 Poles didn't really feature and by 2011 they where the #1 nation. See how much has changed in 2013/14 where EU started outsripping non-EU (I mean thats the whole rest of the world). This is why its an issue, its the numbers and the pace and the trend.
Finally let me be clear I have no issue with the Poles at all but they are there as an example.
In 2014, 1 in 8 (13.0%) of the usual resident population of the UK were born abroad. This compares to 1 in 11 (8.9%) in 2004
There was a statistically significant increase in the non-UK born population of the UK between 2013 and 2014. The non-UK born population increased from 7,921,000 to 8,277,000 (an increase of 4.5%)
In 2014, 1 in 12 (8.4%) of the usual resident population of the UK had non-British nationality. This compares to 1 in 20 (5.0%) in 2004
There was a statistically significant increase in the non-British national population of the UK between 2013 and 2014. The non-British national population increased from 4,987,000 to 5,344,000 (an increase of 7.2%)
The number of usual residents in the UK that held EU nationality (excluding British) was higher than those that held non-EU nationality (2,938,000 compared to 2,406,000) for the second year in a row – prior to 2013 this had not occurred since the Annual Population Survey began in 2004
India is the most common non-UK country of birth in 2014. An estimated 793,000 usual residents of the UK were born in India (9.6% of the total non-UK born population resident in the UK)
Polish is the most common non-British nationality in 2014. An estimated 853,000 usual residents of the UK have Polish nationality (16.0% of the total number of non-British nationals resident in the UK)
[url= http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/internationalmigration/articles/populationbycountryofbirthandnationalityreport/2015-09-27 ]UK Census Summary - Country of Birth[/url]
If there was enough restriction on movement for parliament to keep the leavers happy.
@ff If the EU had offered some real change in the pre-Referendum negotiations on free movement that alone could have made a difference but they did not, I personally would have wanted much more but I suspect free movement reform would have got the result to 52/48 the other way
@jambalaya - why don't you come back when you can spell a simple word like 'fierce'?
jambalaya - Member
Facts appear to disinterest you, and most of those who voted leave.
You win today's head in the sand award, which is quite an achievement I have to say as the competiton was fearce.
Now that we finally have some links, where in the documents used as sources does it mention "many millions of Poles"?
Finally let me be clear I have no issue with the Poles at all but they are there as an example.
Smacks of 'I'm not racist but..' What about the 300,000 French people in London? I'd bet that they contribute more to our society in terms of taxes and pastries than 300,000 northern Brexiters. Judging people by the flag that's in their passport is a slippery slope. If we have to judge people's merit (and I don't think we do) then I'd rather judge them on their contribution to Britain. Which would put most Poles and Frenchies ahead of Brexiters.
I haven't actually met many of these Poles who are everywhere, but the ones I did meet seemed like nice people.
You've no issue with Poles. All sounds s bit....
Yip, utterly shameless.dannyh - Member
My god. Did someone just actually respond to a story about a gang of kids bullying an individual by blaming the parents for not arming him with the correct debating points in return?
Racists be racismin'
While maintaining they're not racists, but.....
Polish immigration is nothing new. My father-in-law spent much of WWII on the run and eventually ended up with the British army in Italy before being demobbed with TB in a desolate camp in Yorkshire. He couldn't return to Poland as the soviets were in power - his father died shortly after release from a Soviet prison having been imprisoned for having served with the Polish military. His friend flew in the battle of Britain (Google 303 polish squadron). He lived most of his life under an invented identity going as far as making an incognito visit to family in communist Poland in the 70s taking his kids including my wife.
He spoke German and enjoyed speaking the language with my son and I, spoke French too and loved visiting us in France. In retirement he worked for Amnesty International. He knew as much as any man can about wars, borders, iron curtains and secret police. Our generation has had peace and freedom handed to us on a plate. I'm thankful he can't read this thread.
From a few pages back, but I've been off the forum and it probably deserves an answer:
[quote=duckman ]Aracer, are there examples of the sort of alliance I mentioned? I am sure there must be one or two in the EU.
in reply to:
[quote=aracer ]
duckman » What stops us having trade agreements with both England,and the EU?
Nothing at all if you're totally independent - I thought you wanted to be an EU member though and that was the whole point?
No, I don't think there are any examples of that sort of thing, because one of the fundamentals of the EU is that the EU has trade agreements with countries outside the EU, individual countries within the EU don't have their own trade agreements. Hence the lack of UK civil service lawyers with experience in trade agreements, and what I consider to be one positive argument for leaving - that we can set up better trade deals with Commonwealth countries for example. Feel free to try and find an example - I'm not wasting my time on what I expect to be a fruitless search!
It doesn't really come as surprise, but certain contributors on this thread are revealing their true colours & it is a pretty nauseating spectacle.