MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
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I work for a Norwegian company and this is exactly what my colleagues described their situations as...they think we are mad for wanting to leave!!
Here's a question:
Can Norway make trade deals with other countries outside of the EU?
If so, that's a plus in favour of Brexit to a Norway style agreement.
Dorset_Knob - Member
we can change the game with a general election and a vote for a party committed to keeping us in Europe - The Lib Dems.
+1Keep saying it!
Remain lost [b]not[/b] because of any racist or uneducated lables applied to Leavers, but because Remainers failed to show the benefits of the EU. By continually focusing on the negatives of leaving until people thought "yes, it'll be bad, but..." [b]we[/b] failed to give people what they needed/wanted to hear. Hope.
[b]We[/b] failed, Remainers failed the country - I'll be damned if in the next General Election [b]we[/b] let it happen again.
[b]We[/b] can change the future by learning from the past.
I don't think that's true, I think it's just that the benefits of staying in are more boring and ordinary than the free money, all problems ever will be fixed approach from coming out.
It's like the IT department at work; you don't even notice them, what they do is pretty humdrum, they're normally one of the first places to get cut in hard times, but you'd be buggered without them.
Can Norway make trade deals with other countries outside of the EU?If so, that's a plus in favour of Brexit to a Norway style agreement.
Is it?
Are the EU agreements worse than those that UK would realistically get?
Can Norway make trade deals with other countries outside of the EU?
It seems so.
http://openeurope.org.uk/today/blog/what-would-a-norway-style-relationship-with-the-eu-entail/
Might be an option. Join EEA, increase trade elsewhere. Leave properly when we're in a better position (or re-join when todays youth are old enough to vote)
molgrips >> Is it?Are the EU agreements worse than those that UK would realistically get?
They might be arranged a lot quicker (no need for agreement of 28 entities for example) and the UK could have the advantage that it has an agreement in place while competitors in the EU don't
I really don't know.
But if I had to guess I'd say no, just because it's gonna be so hard to push the button and I think there's probably more will to find a solution than is being communicated ATM.
Meanwhile, the Lib Dems? Seriously? After their coalition with the Tories? **** them, they deserve their obscurity.
Meanwhile, the Lib Dems? Seriously? After their coalition with the Tories? **** them, they deserve their obscurity.
I think we have seen, since the last election, just how much of a brake they were on what the Tories really wanted to do. I would certainly consider voting for them again, especially given the mess the two main parties are in.
The Lib Dems actually did quite a good job in reigning in the more outlandish/right wing side of the conservative policies, I'd be surprised if they did not make a decent comeback next election
edit : doh!...too late
chakaping - MemberMeanwhile, the Lib Dems? Seriously? After their coalition with the Tories? **** them, they deserve their obscurity.
The Lib Dems got crucified for putting the country (coalition) ahead of politics - the very thing we're asking for right now.
There will already be some trade deals in place. Countries have more than one on the go at the same time and negotiate new ones all the time.
Regardless of the outcome we had a vote, win lose or draw...the outcome has to be respected...so far (extremists on both sides excepted) that seems to be happening.
RE the Lib Dems,
I might agree that Brexit is 'good' for them - here's a quiz for you, without checking can anyone name their leader at the moment?
They'd need a monumental rebirth if a snap election was called tomorrow, the press has made UKIP the defaco 3rd party in the UK because Farage is so good as sound bites.
Amen to the lib dems. Even as a traditional tory voter I was disappointed they were not required for another coalition as they did temper the far right. I will certainly be voting lib dem at the next opportunity. And so will my wife and parents (they just don't know it yet).
The lib dems won a council seat yesterday with a swing of 27% from the incumbent tories. I wonder how much their pro-EU statement the other day helped?
Think about it - the LD reneged on two of their key manifesto pledges - Tuition fees (more students than ever are going to university, they're just having to pay more for it now) and Trident (and even this they managed to block for a term). Two areas where they secured most of their vote.
In return, they got fairer taxes for low and middle income earners, pupil premium, less tax on schools, 2 million new apprentices, break-up of the banks, protecting the post offices, blocked data snooping, no identity cards. Along with all this and as stated above, they were a massive brake on extreme Tory policies such as inheritance tax cuts for the rich...
or re-join when todays youth are old enough to vote
unless they are then less politically niave and are as hacked off with the way the EU push the UK around. Malta has 15 times more clout per capita in the council than we do.
We should article 50 now and stop messing around - uncertainty is not good for anyone.
Lots of companies that trade all over the world were for brexit - they trade ok - maybe they should be asked. JML for example.
I might agree that Brexit is 'good' for them - here's a quiz for you, without checking can anyone name their leader at the moment?
I've seen him on the telly, and would recognise him in the street, but I can't remember his name.
Tim something.
Tim Farron.
the EU push the UK around. Malta has 15 times more clout per capita in the council than we do.
We have 12x the MEPs and hence votes that Malta do.. so it seems fair to me. I think exiters put too much importance on the council and commission because it suits their argument.
the whole thing is a disaster. We won't exit without terms on the table, the eu won't negotiate until we've pressed the button.
Whilst I have very little faith in either our government or the Lords, surely we can rely on them to not take such a huge leap of faith without knowing what is and is not available
I watched a quick street interview with Tim Farron the other day, it was weird, he almost seemed to be speaking honestly about stuff.
My vote is starting to swing his way.
[quote=tpbiker ]the eu won't negotiate until we've pressed the button.It's not like the rules changed since the referendum.
he almost seemed to be speaking honestly about stuff.
That didn't work out well for the last guy that tried it.
Hmm.. imagine going into a GE with honest decent people leading two main parties...!
Look at Tim Farron's voting record - He seems to be very much of the [u]promise [i]only[/i] what you can deliver[/u] and [u]deliver what you promise[/u] school.
Unless things go really southwards for Europe, It won't happen. Will need a vote through parliament and the PM and majority of MPs and Lords will not want to be responsible for the break up of the Union, an end to peace in NI, the border moving to Dover, etc...
Someone I know (who has worked in finance for 30 years) calculated the cost of the drop in projected growth made by the Bank of England... £90m a day.. well done leavers in saving £350m a week!!!!
Let's call a general election and then pu it to vote... as this PARLIAMENTARY democracy is supposed to work
Let's call a general election and then pu it to vote... as this PARLIAMENTARY democracy is supposed to work
Unfortunately, given the chaos of the two major parties, that may not work out so well, and I can see the growth of UKIP. We need the Tories, Labour and the Lib Dems to sort themselves out first.
Problem of going for a general election is that con and lab are likely to have brexit as a manifesto promise, and then feel obliged to follow through. There's lots of pompous "will of the people must be respected" stuff being spouted.
Yes. Brexiters seem spread across the political spectrum, so any party that doesn't promise brexit will lose out to the one that does.
But this is irrelevant in some ways because the MPs themselves are mostly remainers. So.. the parties can promise Brexit all the want, then put it to the commons, and it'll be voted down - problem solved.
Look at Tim Farron's voting record
I did politics A level with him
# trivia
Unless things go really southwards for Europe
That is an asolute nailed on certainty and in a massive way (imo of course stw-ers 😉 )
We'll have Brexit probably via Article 50 trigger fairly soon, either early 2017 or possibly (probably?) after French and German elctions so we can get a good lay of the land as to who's in power andnwhat they've got to say. Could well have had a very eurosceptic GE in Austria too
Jambalaya is living in a dream world of EDL supporters, who have proven their opinions to which the educated despise
Why not listen to this from Radio 4 [url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/scathing-mark-carney-interview-on-radio-4 ]Thread linky[/url]
I'd be stunned if the Lib Dems did much of anything in 2020. Their organisation was devastated post the 2015 election, staff numbers where slashed and they have zero personalities. I got to know the local Surrey infrastructure fairly well and the moral is at rock bottom. Their rise to the coalition was slow, their demise fast.