... more specifically, this one -
- and I'm going to add a quick list of pros...
- It's my most local LBS
- I'd like to buy it from a LBS
- I'm more a pootler than a gnar merchant
- I WANT IT NOW
- and a quick list of cons...
- non-removable battery
- I've been umming and ahhing for far too long, could afford at a pinch something like the Amflow but would it be more than i actually need? Though it would potentially fulfill the LBS remit given that Chase Cycles is only a bit further over there but i'd more than likely be on a waiting list
... are there more cons I should be considering?
I've never had anything other than a hardtail, and don't really see any reason to change that.
The alternative would be the Orbea Rise, if sticking with the same shop, and given the riding I actually do I can't see why spending another 2 grand (or thereabouts) would be justified?
So I ride on Cannock Chase because I live in Stafford, I ride there to ride, and am more of a Blue/Red rider both on and off 'piste' so to speak, so have never felt that rear suspension has been particularly necessary for the things I want to do.
Earlier this week I went for a ride on the Chase for the first time in ages - down from Walton to Brocton, up Oldacre Valley, followed the top of Sherbrook Valley to Brocton Coppice, down to Stepping Stones and back to Milford, back up to Walton via Jacob's Ladder then home. About 20km in all, with not really that much elevation.
Rather feeling my age (not ancient but getting there) I had* to push up Oldacre, and felt a bit beaten up the day after. Thought the time has come to get a bit of assist...
* maybe not 'had' to, but would've been more beaten up if I hadn't
I've never had anything other than a hardtail, and don't really see any reason to change that.
The extra weight on a hardtail will mean it will crash through stuff and the lack of rear suspension, combined with the extra stiffness from the massive downtube and battery will not make for a particularly comfy ride on anything rougher than a towpath.
Do you think the Rise would be a better option then?
I'm sort of tying myself to the LBS for reasons of convenience, and can stretch to the extra spend, but bear in mind that a lot of riding on the Chase isn't actually much rougher than most towpaths?
I've always ridden a hard tail, for the last 40+ years since I was a lad. Got my first FS in November. Never owned an e-bike but have had a play on a few.
Like someone said above if I was to buy an e-bike I'd definitely go FS for anything other than a utility bike that was going to be used on road only.
The extra weight and stiffness means the rear end of an e-bike hardtail tends to crash through stuff.
Doesn't need to be an ultra gnarpoon slayer I tend to ride more mellow stuff and although overbiked when I use the 140/150 FS it's still fun.
I've got an alloy 2022 Rise , wife has a Liv HT EBike.
I had to put both of them in the car last week , don't ask me why but hers felt a lot heavier, so I would agree that unless you are only riding the stuff she does of which the most is gravel paths through nature reserves ( she bought hers because of health issues) they I think you might regret it .
I don't know how the Urrun compares weight wise with the Liv though .
Just done some digging around, wife's E Bike weighs around 25kg ! The Orbea Urrun depending on model around 20kg which is about the same as my Rise .
Maybe somebody can explain why the difference?
I'm with everybody above. Ebike hardtail, a bit pointless unless you really only ride gravel.
Do you think the Rise would be a better option then?
Yes the rise would be a better option. I'd imagine the hardtail would be quite a harsh ride on anything other than flatish paths/trails.
Another reason for a full sus ebike is you'll find you want to explore more and go other areas rather than your usual riding spot.
But an extra 2k for the rise is a lot of money. Is it possible to hire one first to try a hardtail?
Rather feeling my age (not ancient but getting there) I had* to push up Oldacre, and felt a bit beaten up the day after. Thought the time has come to get a bit of assist...
It’s obviously your money and your life so you can buy a hardtail if you want. It’s an attractive price, it will clearly do the job.
I’ve never owned an ebike. But I’ve ridden FS for 15 years, prompted to do so by various aches and pains.
I’ve done 2 days on an ebike. A fairly obvious discovery is that because it’s easier and faster to go up you spend more time coming down. I think alot of that beaten up feeling comes from the downs. I’m not in any west a gnarr rider. Much more pootling along looking at the view. It’s just nice to do that from a stable platform that’s smoothing out the terrain.
Do you think the Rise would be a better option then?
How much is the Rise?
Ive got a mid/top range Rise and to me the £4K Amflow beats it by a mile.
The Amflow has removable battery which is a huge positive. Plus it has useable technology on it ie you can charge other stuff off it, use the motor as a training tool. Orbea are in the dark ages in comparison
Thats before you even start talking about the power it has
As others have said a 20kg hardtail isn’t a good thing
Amd when you get an ebike it opens your world of riding so much more at least a full Sus your not limiting your opportunity.
I have a 2024 Rise and ride an analogue hardtail too (and an Orbea Occam that rarely gets used).
Brilliant fun and no regrets.
But:
- Buy local because something will probably go wrong (Orbea do send you to the local dealer if you buy off the web).
- Eebs are brilliant. I am riding a lot more than I used to. Those days you're tired and meh!, you can still head out on the eeb and feel better for it. In contrast, the analogue would be a slog and I'd probably not bother. You stlll get a workout (more Zone 2 than a red-lined Zone 4). Some weeks I do 4 big rides in a row - and can head out in the evening after a morning ride.
- An eeb changes the way you ride - I love riding up stuff that I used to think of as a decent or push. This is the first thing we show a novice eeb rider. You hear "this is insane" being muttered behind you as you climb up through the woods.
- The range of the Amflow is way superior to the Rise. I have a range-extender for the Rise and the Amflow still beats that, particularly if trying to keep up with the Amflows.
- The Rise isn't great for steep descents. I can't get the saddle down enough due to the long seat tube,
- You can always ride in Eco if riding with a non-analgue (Muggle) so don't worry about being over-powered.
Do it!
I have a three bikes in circulation - a cross bike, a trek HT (Pro Calibre) - and recently bought my first e-mtb. I used to have an FS - and when i did take it to trail centres (rarely) it was brilliant, the rest of the time i was overbiked.
All of the advice that i got steered me away from brands that didn't use Shimano/Bosch motors - and also directed me towards a FS vs an HT.
I've found that having the motor, i now look at big hills and think I can go see the view, vs cycling past as my fitness wouldnt let me get up there without being a sweaty mess.
IMHO - get the FS - make sure it can be serviced by lots of bike shops - not just one next to you...
enjoy the freedom that the powered pootling brings you
I have a 2025 Rise LT and it's an awesome bike. I got it for just under 4K from MTB Monster back in January.
If I was buying a bike now though, then the it would be hard to look beyond the 4K Amflow. More for the range than the power.
Like everyone else is saying, I certainly wouldn't consider a hardtail ebike unless it was for commuting/gravel/mellow forest paths.
As above, hardtail emtbs are harsh to ride. They are also prone to punctures at the rear.
^Why?
Extra weight, no give in the frame, they smash through stuff rather than skipping over it. Massive downtube and battery stiffens everything up too. On a full suss the ratio of sprung vs unsprung weight means the suspension works better, but without it, all that force from the extra weight and stiffness goes through your legs, arms and spine.
The Amflow has removable battery which is a huge positive.
Or a huge negative depending on your situation.
Pros
if you transport bike on roof or rear rack you *may* have an issue with weight limits where removing c3kg makes a difference
if you don't have a power supply where you store your bikes you can remove your battery for charging.
You can own more than one battery and swap between them (but a second battery is expensive and only of use on this bike)
Can potentially fly with a battery-less bike and rent a battery at destination
Negatives
Bike is heavier (mounting kit, frame needs to be stronger to compensate for hatch) Battery is heavier (mounting kit, needs to be generally stronger). cheap amflow is 2kg heavier I think? probably not all battery but I reckon at least a kg. Battery alone is 300g.
Additional points of failure. Battery connections often seem an issue on specialized. Hatches and mounting can rattle/stick/fail (I've seen a video of someone batter ejecting from a bike on a landing)
I've had 5 years of fixed battery ebike ownership and it's never yet been an issue for me. A good length outdoor cable has enabled in vehicle charging at campsites or in odd places on holidays.
Fast charging on Avinox means far fewer situations where a second battery is really necessary and a big battery pack to charge from is more useful and lasts beyond a single bike.
A hardtail will be fine. I bought a trek powerfly hardtail. I've been for a poodle over the peak district rocks this morning, it was great!!
Unlike the OP I am ancient and ride the same route as he does (except Jacob's ladder which would be a naughty thing to do and continuing along the Lazars bridle path to Walton lane isn't really any different). I also use the LBS I think he's referring to.
I have a gravel bike, which I would use for the route mentioned. I have a Scott Genius eRide, which is a chunky bish bosh bash sort of bike and wcauses me resentment and frustration if I use it on the same kind of ride I could do on the gravel bike. However: point it down some of the dozens of cheeky stuff that abound over there and it's a whole heap of fun.
Given that a gravel bike is so much easier to ride than a mountain bike (last week I did that route, but extended to 21 miles all on the fun trails like (ahem) Big John's with 9 gold silver and bronze Strava segments and didn't have to push) I would demo a couple of different bikes first. I love both of mine and they could hardly be more different. But I don't think I'd want a hardtail ebike of any kind. Mrs BigJohn has one but that's so we can ride together when I'm on my old Cotic Soul.
I admit I did use my eBike this morning to ride from Weeping Cross into town to visit Parkers for fish and Tomlinsons for meat but that's because my little legs were tired after yesterday afternoon windurfing and then 4 hours on my feet visiting Villa Park and watching us humiliate the current Champions.
I received the '10' version of that bike about a week ago, and I could not be happier.
It's really fun to ride off-road, it's good on the road as well (most of my rides are about 20-25% off-road, the rest getting there and back). The range seems to be great - I've been mostly in eco, I've done about 100km on long hills, and the predictor is still suggesting another 100km. It's light for any e-mtb, which helps a lot when I've been lifting it over styles and squeezing it through kissing gates, etc. It's not very Gnar, but for my uses it's just about perfect.
Incidently, I got mine from Bike Inn as it was more than a £1000 cheaper than I could find it in the UK. The '30' that you are buying is £2272.49 there:
(you need to use a code, but it's right there on the page), or you could get the 20 for an extra couple of 100 - which I'd recommend just for the battery. I did have to wait a month for mine to arrive, despite the claim on the site. Oh, and you'd get £50 to spend in-store.
I know LBS is great, but my nearest Orbea dealer is 80km away, so not really local. And I'm prepared to spend a bit extra to support local shops, but not that much.
Anyway, as I said I think I made a great purchase. Let me know if you need any more info about the bike before you pull the trigger, and enjoy your bike.
Edit - I think this is worth adding:
Before buying I borrowed a Ghost e-mtb to try as I'd never ridden an e-bike before. I enjoyed it, but found that I could barely ride it without assistance, and that the Bosch engine always felt it kicked in and dropped off really harshly.
I can ride the Urrun perfectly well without the engine turned on, and the assistance in eco mode is much more subtle - I hardly feel it come on, and by the time I'm doing 25km/h I don't really notice it drop off. It feels much more natural, almost like riding a bike!
I got mine from Bike Inn as it was more than a £1000 cheaper than I could find it in the UK.
And when the motor goes wrong how are you going to get it back to Bikeinn ?
No way would I buy an emtb abroad to save £1,000
"when the motor goes wrong how are you going to get it back to Bikeinn ?"
Bikeinn provide a collection service at their cost for defective items under warranty and send them to the brand (Orbea). I've read mixed reviews about how slow this can be, but it seems to get sorted in the end. As I don't live near any Orbea or Shimano dealers it would be painful wherever I bought the bike. I've used BikeInn for loads of things, and they have never had any issues - the only time I got a defective item they sent out a replacement without me having to sent the old one back.
Oh, and I didn't save £1000, I got a better bike. I was working to a budget and wanted to get the best bike I could for the money I had to spend.
You make a fair point though, I took a calculated risk. If I had a £1000 to spare and lived close to a dealer I'd buy from there, but as I don't and I don't it seemed a good deal. I'll let you know how it worked out in 5 years or so 🙂
Wife has an "Urchin" 30, it has replaced her gravel bike and e-town bike and means she can get out to places that the climbs would prevent her from doing.
She had no intention of riding anything more technical than a what I would class as an easy gravel ride but the Urrun is more comfortable on the rougher stuff so can and does do a bit more than the bike was brought for.
The cues gears are surprisingly ok.
Things that let the bike down was the basic Suntour fork as they are coil sprung and don't really have any damping. She would have just kept putting up with them but I had a set of fox 34 that we put on to try and see if there was a noticeable difference, they have made a massive difference as they can be set light enough to suit her and damper that actually does what it should.
Other changes; dropper post and the original Shimano controller display didn't have Bluetooth so no connection to the app for info, setting etc (fitted a the SW-EN600L switch and not bothered with a display.
Today we did over 30km with 1000m of climbing, she had 50% battery left at the end of the day and could keep up with me on a normal bike on the climbs with out worrying where my Garmin was going to end up deciding to take us that I hadn't asked it to.
