You won't get me I'm part of the Union?

Interested in other people thoughts on Unions. I’ve worked in public sector for 15 years and only been a member for the first couple of years. I’ve never felt like I’ve missed out by not being in the union but then I have happily taken the T&C’s that they have negotiated.

Are their links with politics a good thing?
Is there still a place for them when the workforce is much more mobile and people have choice where they work?
Do they offer any more protection than a good employment lawyer (if things go belly up)?
Do they see the bigger picture or are they too focused on the poor worker versus fat cat managers?

I’m firmly on the fence so interested in what other people think?

10 pages. Tj as a main protagonist. Milk and a HobNob please.

Yep is it Friday beers already?
Unions have a role, but a more collaborative approach will work best for people in the long term.

Unions are insurance for me. When an employer does something stupid and wrong it’s much easier for the employee if the union has their back.

For example, my wife’s employer wanted to get rid of her and drew up a voluntary separation agreement that they tried to get her to sign. A couple of emails to the union confirmed that the amount offered was far too low. Union negotiated the amount up and took the pain of trying to deal with someone who’s trying to stuff you away.

Contributions over the years have probably added up to what she got but as with insurance it’s sometimes easier to pay little and often.

*plumps up cushions*.

I put a £10 bet that the name Thatcher appears on the first page after my post.

Rich tea only in the office today, I might need to pop out for something more varied.

Some reference material.

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/trade-unions

Surely it depends on the union in question? the ways they seem to operate and the work they do seems to vary quite a bit.

Having said that, I’m a member although not really active. Only so that I don’t feel too guilty when the reps do manage to negotiate a good deal with management.

I might need to pop out for something more varied.

make sure they all cover for you 😉

I put a £10 bet that the name _________ appears on the first page after my post.

It’s said that the Aussie Unions got a lot of leaders during the 80’s from those who chose to leave the UK

I put a £10 bet that the name Thatcher appears on the first page after my post.

Right nobody mention Thacther until page 2!!

Shit…….

how many ‘people who thatch rooves’ does that Gold belong to?

Not sure where i should be angry about missing the apostrophe from.

I’m in the Fire Brigades Union and have been since I joined 18 years ago. They’re great and really do make a difference. We would all be at more risk if not for the work they have done over the years.

As an individual, they are great. Helped me and colleagues when “management” have broken rules etc

Collectively, now largely powerless. People can’t afford to strike, people can’t see the greater good might need them to make that sacrifice.

Which may or may not be a good thing.

I always take it to be not just about me, but also supporting other staff who may be in difficulties with the management.

It seems to me that belonging is the moral thing to do.

APF

Having seen how a council employer and manager can behave, often unintentionally, over the last few years with mrs_oab, I am a firm keep the membership, because one day….

I’ve never felt like I’ve missed out by not being in the union but then I have happily taken the T&C’s that they have negotiated.

It does depend on what you do. But as a teacher the protection is worth the money. I have had a relative hurt at work and the union “helped” sort things out. The outcome was not great but without a union they would have had no where to go without spending £££ on lawyers etc.

If you job exposes you to the risk of an unfounded allegation i would not do it without an organisation at my back to help me put if I needed it. Although I accept that I could find this cover from an organisation that is less political than a union

Alexpalacefan +1

I always take it to be not just about me, but also supporting other staff who may be in difficulties with the management.

It’s almost as if it was a unio….. Ohhhhh wait!

Mine, eis, are dicks but I’d rather have the annoying picky people on my side.

OHs, police federation, useless. Sometimes seems as though they negotiate a worse deal. ie the half hour free overtime per day.

At times people might have more respect for unions if they manage to ditch the idiots and wasters who take the piss.

Anyone got ginger snaps? Though I have some nice wine here so maybe some after eights?

For those concerned with my health and wellbeing, the kettle is on for coffee and a pre-lunch scoff of these.

I’ll raise you though much closer to saturday here…
Did you get one for everyone or just the union members Matt?

I think they’re more important than ever, as employers become more corporate, their owners (shareholders) more detached from the businesses they don’t see people they see share price and dividend and demand efficiency it’s the employees who suffer.

Ultimately ‘efficiency’ is caustic, efficiency says employee rights are bad, efficiency says that wages are always too high, efficiency says they workloads are too low and usually efficiency says British Employees are lazy and greedy and we should move to a country where they have less rights and are much cheaper and efficiency means the powers that be we make sure is financially viable to do so as long as they keep HQ in the UK because it boosts our currency value and means ‘the city’ can earn fortunes for doing not very much.

Efficiency and the decline and erosion of union powers created our unbalanced economy and our large ‘under class’.

Ultimately ‘efficiency’ is caustic, efficiency says employee rights are bad, efficiency says that wages are always too high, efficiency says they workloads are too low and usually efficiency says British Employees are lazy and greedy and we should move to a country where they have less rights and are much cheaper………..

Alt Facts available

Efficiency and the decline and erosion of union powers created our unbalanced economy and our large ‘under class’.

efficiency is the ability to produce more from the same place at the same cost which then reduces the cost per production.

I’m in ours, however I do think that their overall power has waned slightly in recent years & would agree with Morecashthandash on the reasons.

I know a few people whose jobs are supposed to be relocating & those who aren’t in the union are largely relying on those who are relaying second hand information regarding what management’s legal obligations are, as they seem to have kept quiet about a few options available to staff for whom this causes massive problems. Those in the union have been back & forth numerous times to meetings with HR where the union rep has been absolutely worth his weight in gold, whereas the others are pretty much saying – “yeah, i want what he/she’s doing”

Did you get one for everyone or just the union members Matt?

As I am the sole office dweller this afternoon, just myself. 8)
*waddles off*

As I am the sole office dweller this afternoon, just myself.
*waddles off*

I don’t think that will help you on the picket line.

This is a small survey, but all the union reps I have had the fun to deal with have been terrifying zealots. I won’t go into details, but of the five conduct/performance/attendance issues I was taking forward with somebody once, the union rep argued eloquently, tirelessly and remorselessly about how many (paid) smoking breaks it was acceptable to take in a day.

And it was a number above zero.

I may a few of the right of centre posters with this assertion, but one of the reasons why low paid workers continue to be low paid is because collective bargaining is a relic of the 1970s.

the union rep argued eloquently, tirelessly and remorselessly about how many (paid) smoking breaks it was acceptable to take in a day.

It does sound a bit like they were trying to represent their member. Seems fair enough.

It does sound a bit like they were trying to represent their member. Seems fair enough.

when your a dick why do you need defending? That is kind of the problem, if you assess the case and tell people to jog on if they are in the wrong then go for it.Defend them all?

I’ve never felt like I’ve missed out by not being in the union but then I have happily taken the T&C’s that they have negotiated.

Well you have not missed out as you have freeloaded off their back

Depends on many factors but there was a reason why owner tried to make unions illegal when they were first created.

Perhaps in the 70’s they were too powerful – i was a kid then but these days the employers have too much power and are able to shit on us – “gig economy” zero hours contracts etc to erode those hard won legal rights and protections for all workers

Whether you want to join one is your choice but arguing they are all shit or they are all brilliant is a big pile of BS whether we add the word union to the statement or employer/boss.

.

@mikewsmith

For the majority of businesses the biggest cost is labour. I’ve worked in a few industries and studied many more. I don’t know of any who strived for efficiency to do more with the same workforce and its unknown for and employer to strive for efficiency to reduce their workforces workload. Be it by mass redundancy or ‘normal shrinkage’ but the workforce gets smaller.

Efficiency has meant greater profits for corporates and less opportunity for individuals.

Worked for the Pru, a rather successful heavily unionised company- when our division was sold off to Churchill Insurance, the prick Martin Long promised us that there was no need to retain our enhanced redundancy package since Churchill was a new and fast growing company that would never make anybody redundant. Without the union applying sustained pressure to Pru management we would have been stripped of the package in the transfer, which was subsequently needed when Long cashed out 12 months later, and sold out to RBS/Direct Line making just about the entire IT division redundant.

For that one service I’d be happy to pay union subs, and support them, if I ever go back to employment.

when your a dick why do you need defending?

Everybody deserves to be treated fairly, whether you think they’re a dick or not. Can you not envisage a situation where a manager behaves unfairly and victimises an employee, maybe misrepresents their behaviour as unreasonable in some way? I’ve had a few dealings with shop stewards and workers reps and though I’m sure it sometimes happens I’ve never known them to champion one of their members who’s just being a dick, IME they’ll usually have a word and get them to wind their neck in.

We are certainly better off with them than without them!! People often love to run them down, pointing to things like the London tube strikes as an example why (kind of fair enough!) but also whilst enjoying all the things that unions have achieved fo us like having a weekend, safe working conditions, no more child labour, sick pay, annual leave etc etc etc! 🙂

Union member (RMT). Mainly as an insurance policy as the company and HSE will seek to blame me if an incident occurs in certain roles I perform (whether it is a staff screw up or system screw up) as history says that’s they’re SOP. Union lawyers are there to stop me going to prison/losing my job.

I’ve also enjoyed some good pay rises, have pretty good T’s&C’s and up until recently, protection of my final salary pension (dropped a bit of a bollock there as only goes up with RPI now but as I’ve only 13 years to go I’m not too fussed).

As a long term shop floor worker for a large multi billion pound British manufacturer , I feel we need unions more than ever before.
Zero hour contracts, unpaid overtime,banked hours,exploitation of agency staff, annual lay offs,massive inequality,etc,etc are/have become the norm ,whilst the corporations profits go through the roof.