TrainerRoad – STW approved sessions

Yes I’m quite pleased with my new cave, it even has an ensuite :). Just need to finish those damn chocolates first though.

Kryton, nice work, there’s lots more to going fast than FTP

Over the last few days ive tried to think about this, based on feelings through proper riding and TR. i think two things have happened; my muscular endurance has definitely improved and my pain barrier has changed. For the latter i realised that i was riding conservatively, subconciously holding back when it “hurt” in case i couldnt finish the race/ride i was on. Now ive moved to Jens territory, whereby i can push through the pain, engage more endurance and use pedal / breathing technique to extend my power / range, then when that section is over carry on as before

Its odd that ive been doing that since September with TR but never before, and now it seems to be second nature on rides and is helping me. I’ve not turned into Schurter in 4 months, but I’ve certainly improved in my ability to ride to my limits. And I’ve still, 3lbs to drop 🙂

Im gagging to race / TT to see how these things work out under stress

Nice one Kryton.
I often find it remarkable how much punishment the body will take if you put your mind to it. 😀

Now ive moved to Jens territory, whereby i can push through the pain, engage more endurance and use pedal / breathing technique to extend my power / range, then when that section is over carry on as before

Good work. Much the same sort of thing here last winter. Did a lot of work and got a lot faster but FTP hadn’t gone up by much.

Im gagging to race / TT to see how these things work out under stress

Probably wrong side of London for you but Newbury do an early season club TT on H10/3A late Feb. Was bloody freezing last year. Silly time of year to be out in a skinsuit 🙂

Lol, skinsuit in February.
Castelli thermosuit maybe – not as aero, but i saw some graph from gore promoting windstopper that suggested significant performance gain from regulating body temperature.

Lol, skinsuit in February.

🙂 Actually went ok that day but blimey, standing around for some 10 mins waiting for my start, that was hideous!

Got thinking about 20 min and 8 min tests having done the 20 last night. A max 20 is quite hard to do as you’ll almost certainly set off with a pace in mind so from that point the result is somewhat set. If I’d set of 5 watts higher could I have sustained that, maybe, and that would give a different result. Highlights that it is just an approximation.

Anyone do MAP ramp tests[/url] instead? I wonder if this produces a more significant number as you basically go to failure so it doesn’t depend on guesswork on pacing?

With the increased usage from the smart trainer, even within a month of using it, happy to see some of my levels being raised from when I was in better shape and more commited a few years ago.

5 Second 972 31/01/2014
10 Second 913 31/01/2014
20 Second 768 31/01/2014
30 Second 612 13/02/2013
1 Minute 446 13/02/2013
2 Minute 367 13/02/2013
5 Minute 327 13/02/2013
10 Minute 296 05/01/2017
15 Minute 290 05/01/2017
20 Minute 286 05/01/2017
30 Minute 265 05/01/2017
60 Minute 242 05/01/2017
90 Minute 213 07/05/2013

When I started with this last month I wasn’t even close to this, I was struggling with an FTP of 200 now I am up to 270.

MSP, out of curiosity, what are you using to measure your power?

60 Minute 242

When I started with this last month I wasn’t even close to this, I was struggling with an FTP of 200 now I am up to 270.

Not according to your own stats?

If I’d set of 5 watts higher could I have sustained that

The last test I did where my FTP increased was a 20min test whereby I did exactly that. I rode it as a negative split, keeping to power +5w in the first 10, reamping up +10w from 11-15mins, then slowly ramp to all-out in the final 5.

Although I then started this way in 10m TT’s (remember I was new to that last year) I actually went faster riding consistently as possible to 120% FTP for the duration.

60 Minute 242
When I started with this last month I wasn’t even close to this, I was struggling with an FTP of 200 now I am up to 270.

Not according to your own stats?[/quote]
Max power achieved over an hour isn’t the only way to estimate FTP. 296 watts for 10 minutes suggests that 300 over 8 minutes is likely, which would correspond to an FTP of 270 watts.

When I started with this last month I wasn’t even close to this, I was struggling with an FTP of 200 now I am up to 270.

If you’ve not ridden the turbo in a long time much of this is likely you adapting to riding on the turbo rather than a big bump in fitness. Reckon if you’ve not used the turbo much it takes a few weeks of consistent riding to make the adaptation and for you to be able to test to the maximum of your potential. Some turbos need more adaptation time than others. Still cool to see the numbers go up though 🙂

Not according to your own stats?

I have been bumping up my FTP in TR according to how I feel dong sufferfest sessions, if I feel I could give more I bump it up a bit for the next session. 270 is the level I currently have it set at. That may not correlate to the science, but it is what I am working to.

MSP, out of curiosity, what are you using to measure your power?

Virtual power from my trainer, I would love to have a power meter, but it isn’t the highest priority on my list of shiny things.

On my own looking after the kids last night so took the opportunity for my first turbo session, 2hr beehive whilst watching hateful eight (rubbish). soles of my feet and arse are a bit sore this morning. Think I need to break myself back in…..

Rode Lamarck yesterday (4 x 10 mins at FTP) and felt surprisingly in control all the way through. Think it’s about time to retest my FTP.

For Gods sake. Beta Blockers might blunt your performance the Doc said…

Too right. Couldn’t get above 120bpm at VO2max w/kg and couldn’t maintain the power either, I guess my muscles are starved of oxygen from my heart being limited to 2nd gear…

Once you start using your Neo in Erg mode, all of these problems will go away…

Tried the Neo in erg mode today and felt fine at fairly low power (~200W) but awful at higher powers (>350W). Like riding slowly through treacle. Felt much more like road out of erg mode. Shall have to see what config can be tweaked.

For Gods sake. Beta Blockers might blunt your performance the Doc said…

Time to work on your base!

I’ve just started using it as part of recovery from a knee injury. Can’t put much power through it yet but like the structured nature to help keep my interest. Mind you, even if I could put more power out without knee being painful it wouldn’t last long as haven’t ridden since a cyclocross race in November! So unfit.

It’s a good excuse to listen to some loud rock as well 🙂

mrblobby – Member
Actually went ok that day but blimey, standing around for some 10 mins waiting for my start, that was hideous!

Get some of the outer edge zip tights if you haven’t already, not exaggerating when I say they are a game changer for winter racing, can whip them off on the start line with a couple of minutes to go. Means warm up isn’t totally futile!

Could I ask you chaps for some advice?

I’ve had trainerroad for about 6 months and have been doing 1 x session (sometimes a sweetspot or a Sufferfest) during the week and then a regular Saturday morning 50k chaingang with the club.

I’ve just decided to do the Sweet Spot base plan, which is 3 x sessions per week. Here’s the thing – do I just do the two sessions on the turbo then ‘count’ the 90min session as my chain-gang outdoor ride?

Or do I do the three in the week then THEN the outdoor ride?

For context….it’s a quick ride 4 laps of a 10k loop with long flat and then a climb. It’s quite ‘competitive’ shall we say 🙂 and I like to be fresh for it.

I know it’s a bit tricky to say, but if any of you have done the same thing it would be god to get advice.

I do the former oafisb – my third or weekend ride is outdoors unless time / weather means I’ll do the TR workout.

It helps me to remember that technical skills – regardless of discipline – are training too. Even club rides can be intervals – someone will beast a hill, or you can, or pull a lead out for 5 mins… it’s why I put a power meter on my road bike.

Thank you for the insight, Kryton – that seems very sensible.
Did you ever do the base plan?

I do the same, currently in week three of sweet spot base mid volume. The weekday sessions are done on turbo, Saturdays session is done on turbo if weather vile or busy, otherwise mimic the interval length outside. Sundays longer lower intensity ride is almost always done outside. As it gets lighter I start to sub in midweek outside rides for turbo too, again mimicking what tr is saying I should be working on. A bit hit and miss without a power meter (just use HR and perceived effort).

Just dipping in and out of TR but most recent FTP test is finally over 300. Woo hoo. Told wife but she gave me a blank look so you lot will have to do instead. Only problem is I’m riding like gash at the minute outdoors. Ride longer than an hour – don’t think so.

It’s time for me to take another FTP test as I move from base to build. I use the Tacx T2240, is it possible to get this into a slope mode for the duration of the test?

I’m sure that you can just select slope mode whenever you like in TrainerRoad.

is it possible to get this into a slope mode for the duration of the test?

Like Gray said I’m pretty sure you can just select slope mode. When I did the ftp test I left it in erg mode – it uses this on the warm up and then automagically switches to slope mode for the test intervals.

Hmm, I’ve been connecting via an iPad and not seen that option anywhere, but will take another look. Thanks.

I’ve mainly used the Windows version. TrainerRoad support are generally pretty responsive – drop them an email if you can’t find it.

Thank you for the insight, Kryton – that seems very sensible.
Did you ever do the base plan?

Sweet spot base, i am time crunched.

Question, will it be a big issue if I switch the Saturday and Sunday rides around (sweet spot base mid vol 1)? Have no time for a long ride on Sunday, but on sat could concievably have a couple of hours riding in the sunshine then do the 1.5hrs sat ride on Sunday

Of course not!

Everything’s flexible, and it has to be fun.

There may be more than one reason why I’m not an Olympic champion. 🙂

So how you all getting on with your winter training?

Finding January a bit of a slog here. Having had a pretty decent base phase I’m trying something different for build phase and gone polarised. But that’s coincided with me and kids picking up colds. And frosty roads leading to too much turbo doesn’t help either. Could do with a week somewhere warm with the bike to kick start my motivation!

Confession time too, I’m mostly zwifting now. Though this does seem to be the default STW thread for training chat 🙂

Found the settings to drop into resistance mode, thanks folks.

FTP test went well (relatively speaking, it was still horrific), now at 310 watts. Let’s see how that feels once I start General Build.

Finding January a bit of a slog here

Health issues here also have led to some inconsistent training, although when I do get a whole session in I’m on target and have a dogged determination to get through them. I too want to be out on the bike – the roads were covered in white frost this morning so its not worth the risk – I’m trying to remind myself the heady Spring/Summer/Autumn days arent far away.

With the current cold/cough I’m supposed to be Msrshalling from 7:30am tomorrow with a break to ride a Vets CX race. I thought it’d be a good session. But seeing as next week is actually “rest” week on my speciality plan and I start racing proper on 25th Feb, I’m thinking I shouldn’t stand in a field all day but should rest, do some light intervals then hit pt2 of my plan hard up to the race.

I’m planning on ticking over with it – although nothing big as the CX season is a long way off [still going in some places]. Just got a power meter so would be good to get a decent ftp to take on the road for some tests later in the year.

Saying that, managed to bollox the turbo up earlier today by melting the plastic side of the roller. I must have reversed the skewer as the wheel was sitting quite far over – still on the steel but only just. Started an 8 min test and the cadence seemed high for the power output, one of the spin ups at 540W felt like a crazy effort instead of just hard. Then there was a burning smell so I stopped.

I might be able to clean it up, but was thinking of getting a new turbo anyhow. Is there a cheap design that doesn’t drift (much)? Or do you need to spend some money to get that sort of cadence stability?

Bloody hell! ^^

I’ve decided to sack off tomorrow. Over the years and through my posts everyone knows I never try to rest when ill. I’m going to this year!

Thought this thread was a bit quiet recently!

Winter training going ok for me. December was rest month, lots of messing around on mtb but no effort to any rides. Started sweet spot base at hte beginning of January. Given that I became a dad two weeks ago, I’m fairly pleased with how I’m managing to stick to plan. Missed the first Sunday ride (was in the maternity ward!) and bailed on a couple, one from tiredness and one from getting called to help with nappies :lol:. Otherwise plugging away and starting to feel the fatigue in hte legs. Switched round this weekends, rode outside yesterday (much shorter than planned) and did Saturdays today. Eclipse was brutal on five hours sleep. Nearly bailed every interval but managed to hang on.

Further to the above turbo issue, thinking of maybe getting a set of rollers to train on instead. I’ve never used them, so wondering if there are any drawbacks to be aware of [think I recall earlier posts on this thread saying they can be a bit unstable on very heavy efforts?]

Given that I became a dad two weeks ago

Congratulations! Oh and good luck.

was in the maternity ward!

Be careful with that shit, i managed to pull a calf muscle during the process and could i get anyone in a room full of nurses to help? Hurumph!

Oh and congrats ferrals. 🙂