National Trust Vs Right Wing Restore Trust

@kelvin

By cultural Marxism I mean the strand of Marxist thought that goes from Gramsci, to Critical Theory of Frankfurt School, Marcuse, then morphs into Critical methods by way of Kimberle Crenshawm etc., and CRT to the present day.

After three seconds googling,

I said white superiority, not white supremacy. Despite using similar letters, those two notions aren’t quite the same thing…

A lot of the “Stately Homes” were given to the nation/National Trust in lieu of taxes, some arrangements have the family still living there and the NT picking up some of the bill. There is no doubt that good things have been done looking after parts of the countryside but the origin of wealth for the big houses is often somewhat obscured. We were members until a couple of years ago and visited Penrhyn Castle. Money made from slavery funded quarrying in Wales that was very much akin to slavery. We left the property and then the NT. In conversations with people around the country they are terrible landlords, talking to a farmer in the Lake District a leading figure had visited had said that it would be great “without people”. They are currently selling off community assets in Derbyshire and according to rumours pressurising local tenants not to assist anyone objecting. They are supposed to hold assets “for the people” which I would presume includes informing “the people” too?

I know what you mean cakescoffer. And it’s nonsense fed to gullible people. It’s not real. It’s made up. You’ve been misled. You’ll be happier if you check out what is really happening… go and see what the NT are actually doing, and come back to us if you find something genuine to complain about, a real example, not that “cultural Marxism” nonsense. The NT are not part of that imagined conspiracy in any way.

We can trace a lot of land ownership in the UK to the Norman conquest too. Are we going to have a ‘reckoning’ with that? The harrying of the North was not pleasent.

Quite a few castles, too. I wonder if any of them make reference to the Normans?

@kelvin

I take your point but just because there’s a conspiracy theory in that name it doesn’t mean it’s also not an apt rubric for a strand of thinking.

You could say the same about the associated Frankfurt School. It was also an actual school!

Culture and identity become key to neo-Marxist thought from mid 20th century on. The goal simply is communism.

an apt rubric for a strand of thinking

An example of some NT communication at any of their properties you have a problem with please, show us something real, in the real world.

After three seconds googling,

I said white superiority, not white supremacy. Despite using similar letters, those two notions aren’t quite the same thing…

Fair enough.

OK cakey – one little bit of evidence that BLM has anything to do with communism. One tiny bit of evidence? Just a tiny bit.

Moreover, there was slavery all throughout human history so to keep raising the salience of British involvement in slavery is to completely miss the historical context; there is nothing remarkable about the British being involved in the slave trade, what is remarkable, however, is the British stamping it out and that includes the Arab/Muslim slave trade which bought and sold more slaves, for longer, than the Atlantic slave trade.

The idea that Britain was at the forefront of getting rid of slavery is a strange one. Yes parliament passed the abolition of the slave trade act in 1807 which was against the Atlantic trade/shipment of slaves but didn’t abolish slavery until 1833. That was later than most other countries. I wonder why it took so long? Too many rich people still making money from it perhaps.

OK cakey – one little bit of evidence that BLM has anything to do with communism. One tiny bit of evidence? Just a tiny bit.

Why do you think they keep talking about dismantling and disrupting things like the nuclear family? Why do they believe that a cultural hegemony exists called white supremacy? These aren’t intelligible concepts outside of neo-marxism. Culture supports the structures of Capitalism. Knock over the culture, knock over Capitalism. The marginalised are the new proletariat.

The idea that Britain was at the forefront of getting rid of slavery is a strange one

Which navy did then? Not just that Atlantic trade but the Arab/Muslim trade which used East African waters?

Here we go…

I take comfort in the fact that the gammon reactionary brigade like cake-arse tend to be a bit on the older side and the nicer pro equality (cough woke cough) people tend to be on the younger side. So we can reasonably expect that the overall change in society will be for the better as the gammons die off over the coming years.

In fact we could expedite their demise by simply holding up placards outside their houses depicting pictures of refugees wearing rainbow lanyards heading towards the white cliffs of dover. That should have them reaching for their angina tablets.

Why do you think they keep talking about dismantling and disrupting things like the nuclear family? Why do they believe that a cultural hegemony exists called white supremacy?

They don’t.

Unless you can demonstrate otherwise, of course. You were asked for evidence, this is conjecture. Again, not quite the same thing.

It’ll be a photo of a black person and a National Trust member standing next to Jimmy Savile next. Makes you think.

Which navy did then? Not just that Atlantic trade but the Arab/Muslim trade which used East African waters?

You need to ask yourself why did they clamp down on the Atlantic slave trade but not abolish slavery. They knew it was wrong so why not abolish slavery in 1807?

I find it odd that someone speaks at length in academic terms, when their entry point into a thread contained unqualified rumours, straight from the tabloids.

Guess it’s all about finding any way to justify your own beliefs.

BBC PM just now… their Restore Trust guest had a real world example… some beanbags… six years ago to make it easier for people to focus on an intricate ceiling… that was the real world example that they reached for. That warranted a campaign group.

🤷🏻‍♂️

This thread would’ve fallen away in obsolescence if it wasn’t for the cake-eating Gammon/Troll. As it happens there’s probably a few more votes being cast at the AGM against the racist shills.

LOLZ.

The idea that Britain was at the forefront of getting rid of slavery is a strange one.

The idea that slavery has be gotten rid of is a strange on. Theres estimated to be 40 million people world-wide currently enslaved, including around 10,000 in the uk.

We use the term ‘abolished’ in relation to slavery as it its ended, it hasn’t. Its not legal any more but it hasn’t been stopped. There are more slaves alive now, almost three times more, than the total that were traded across the four centuries of the slave trade.

You might have participated in the slave trade today. I you like a lot of chocolate on your biscuits you may well be in that club.

They have altered a lot of their publicity material to appear more bourgeois recently.

link

The beanbag scandal has reverberated for years you know. Im sure heads lolled….

There are more slaves alive now, almost three times more, than the total that were traded across the four centuries of the slave trade.

That’s an interesting point although I don’t know exactly how modern slavery is defined.

It’s an interesting point, but unless the NT are involved, I’m not sure why that makes a case for them removing > insert example here, we still haven’t seen one < from > insert property name here, we haven’t been given one <.

The beanbag scandal has reverberated for years you know. Im sure heads lolled….

Bravo.

As it happens there’s probably a few more votes being cast at the AGM against the racist shills.

Well, quite. I’ve never voted in a NT election before, but I’ll definitely vote in this one.

They have altered a lot of their publicity material to appear more bourgeois recently.

link

See, that’s better.

If you provide sources to seemingly wild claims, we can verify them. And possibly go “gosh, you’re right, I had no idea!” Otherwise, you’re just typing words, you might as well claim that the head of the NT is a chameleonic alien from the planet Spork.

Let’s take a look then, shall we? You said:

> Why do you think they keep talking about dismantling and disrupting things like the nuclear family?

It was mentioned on their website. It’s no longer mentioned on their website. That’s not “keeping talking about it,” that’s mentioning it once and revising your stance when you realise you made a mistake.

> Why do they believe that a cultural hegemony exists

They don’t.

> called white supremacy?

Now, we actually have some substance here.

The US, or parts of the US certainly, has a huge problem with white supremacy. We don’t really had a direct frame of reference here – our Neon Nazis and EDL quarterwits are left-wing extremists compared to some corners of the States.

Can’t imagine why anyone might want to eradicate those sorts of groups, can you?

If you provide sources to seemingly wild claims, we can verify them.

… plus of course, it gives you an opportunity to do your own fact-checking of what you think / believe before posting.

This thread would’ve fallen away in obsolescence if it wasn’t for the cake-eating Gammon/Troll.

My money’s on it being ernielynch or one of the starmer harriers in which case good work given, the result is likely to be a few more votes against this right wing actual conspiracy (of low importance in the scheme of things, this whole culture wars nonsense being stoked up to distract).

OK cakey – one little bit of evidence that BLM has anything to do with communism. One tiny bit of evidence? Just a tiny bit.

not just a load of meaningless words chucked together – just a tiny bit of evidence

Or as it appears do you not actually know what either BLM or communism is?

Setting up a second account doesn’t really strike me as ernie’s style.

Ernie also would find it hard to dumb down his debating style to this level

He is both knowledgeable and a expert at debating

I find a lot of this puzzling as to some of the language used. If I was a NT member, (I have to be careful how I type that) I wouldn’t vote for anyone who ignored history, surely, that’s what the “stately homes” exist for? To remind us of the depths that humanity can descend into in the pursuit of money? The bonus is we can buy overpriced food, tea towels, mugs and bird food to make us feel better!
Visit Southwell Workhouse for a proper taste of NT..

To remind us of the depths that humanity can descend into in the pursuit of money?

Does everything have to be didactic, to carry some moral lesson?

Most people just want a nice day out, not a social justice sermon.

Then don’t read the information boards and just buy the cakes on offer?

Does everything have to be didactic

You’re now arguing against education.

Does everything have to be didactic? No, of course it doesn’t. But, and I’m amazed I haven’t already mentioned this, it isn’t.

Most people just want a nice day out

So what’s stopping them?

TripAdvisor: “Our otherwise pleasurable family outing to Strawman Hall was ruined when we were shocked to discover that there were all these ‘words’ everywhere. Our little Hemione was traumatised for life, even though she can’t read yet. One star.”

not a social justice sermon.

Because there are (allegedly) words on a card that we’ve already established they aren’t reading anyway?

Have you got your browser set to write-only? We’ve already explained this.

So can I confirm when visiting a nation trust property (other property owners are available) that following a quick look around to oh and ah at the grandeur and landscape we’re to proceed to straight to the cafe to eat our body weight in cake. At no point are we to read any interpretive panels, speak to the guides or go into the old kitchens in case something offends us.

I wonder how the I_Scoff_Cakes would view Dunrobin Castle, the Manie and the Highland clearances?
Are the clearances part of the story or a bit that can be ignored while we’re having a sneak peek at how the other 0.1% live?

The only person I’ve ever heard use the term ‘cultural Marxism’ IRL was a huge Tommy Robinson fanboy. Makes you think…

I had to look that word up, nice one. Everything doesn’t have to be a moral lesson, just both sides, or in some cases, all sides of the story. If you look into Hardwick Hall for example you find that it was home to one of the richest families in Britain, the devonshires, who abandoned it to the National Trust in lieu of death duties. They could then carry on with massive profit making at Chatsworth and their other estates whilst basking in the glory of the house on the hill. If you visit Hardwick you’ll hear a lot about royal connections but not a lot about how the money was made, and continues to be made. Huge land owners with vast estates and tenants. Plans to opencast vast areas of lovely land a few years ago… the repression goes on you see just in a different way.

*didactic I was referring to, a slow writer I’m afraid!

Yaxley Lennon, to use his proper name?