Lockdown issue camper van article

Worth looking at the boating world for fixtures and fittings.

Have a self converted T5 (bar the roof…. Had someone else fit that, but looking back I could have done it myself with lots less aggro but that’s another story).

Van cost 15k and I spunked another 8k including the roof. There’s nothing in the market that has a similar layout that suits my needs /desires…

Long wheel base conversions are rare.
I can cook inside or out under the tailgate. 20l gas tank under the floor saving masses of space.
I can load bikes and snowboards length ways.
I can sit 2-5 people and comfortably sleep 4 without having to fold any seats (pop top and pull out bed in the rear).
Space saving drawer fridge.
Solar and ~90l of water storage Madga we can be “off grid for at least a week at a time (assuming the GF doesn’t do the washing up; her water management is terrible).
I can still transport full sheets of ply and carry tools.

I’ve got a workshop, which helps.

Showers are outside thanks to a pump up shower (https://www.decathlon.co.uk/portable-shower-8-l-id_8333161.html).

Shits are restaurants or if necessary a long walk with a folding spade.

However, I need to sell it.

The bikes are generally outside on the rack and when away for long periods you need to be ultra organised or things get messy pretty quick.

Ducato is on the cards.

New new van costs 23k plus knowing what I know now around 5k to kit out to fit my wants and needs.

Hopefully sell the T5 for low 20s….

Went to a big trade fair for campers of all kinds in Feb. Even the likes of Sunlight, who claim to specialise in van for outdoorsy folk, came up with nothing like what I want….

Proper bike storage. Two seats up front with lounge type area in the rear (those tiny 2 seater 90° jump seats are bollocks whether you’re just chilling or cruising). No on board shower. Off grid solar capacity. No awful laminated sheet furniture with rubber moulded edging. No weird/shitty stripes or silhouette of animals or mountains on the side. Oh, and not 55k, either…!

No awful laminated sheet furniture

What you using then.

Caravan spec framing and 3mm ply ……

I built a SWB transit custom into a camper. Van was new. Aim was to able to live off grid for a week, bikes stored inside, but separate and contained away from living area. Also have ability to store the bike with both wheels on if just going for a local trip or day out.

Double bed, fridge, table, sink and two burners, heater, two opening side windows.

Specifically didn’t want it to look like a campervan so can park anywhere.

Full lithium solar and b2b system. Toilet inside, shower outside, proper one not a hand pump. Jet wash for bikes.

All achieved but no-one builds anything close commercially.

Seems like there is room for either selling a budget van conversion kit or new complete builds based around certain outdoor sports like cycling, kayaking etc. But can’t see this happening whilst camper vans and van conversions are so popular keeping prices high.

Ford does a bare chassis that would be perfect for a van build, not cheap though. Wonder how cheap you could buy them as a dealer or if you were buying say 50 of them at once. 🤔

https://www.parkers.co.uk/vans-pickups/news/2018/ford-transit-skeletal-chassis-cab/

Have been round this one a lot having had lots of vans and hired lots of motor homes to work out what worked for us. Main things were originally – not having bikes on a rack having had mine cut off the van and a few attempts that were unsuccessful, not too much internal jenga every time you want to cook and space for when it’s wet. Owned a few VW California and for 2 people fine but fail the test. Now we are a family of 3 we need to sleep 3 and have a bog. Hot water also very useful. Tried a few compromises and I seriously thought about buying a new 4motion Crafter and building something. Hymercar were close. Ended up with a sub 7m Swift box – has bunks in the back which having removed the bottom one and put some corflute boxing in means we get 4 bikes in plus associated bags and stuff hanging, it’s not perfect but it works. Has full shower, water toilet and has drop down bed plus a double underneath if we want to use that. Plenty of space and drives alright. Cost me about 60% of what my Cali sold for as well. Has 200ah of battery and 2 solar panels to quite happy off grid. Downside is it’s mostly white still although front is being wrapped grey and we are de-whiting some of the rest of it. When you get to >2 people space becomes a priority !

Having hired a few I see zero point in the “showers” you get in campers. A dribble of lukewarm water in a cupboard you cant turn round in.

I would like to self build one tho – for much the same reasons as others – I want a internal layout that no one offers. Medimum size van with a big bike “garage”, a permanent double bed that you can use without using your sitting space. But I won’t be putting a shower in and the on board bog would be for emergencies only

We have never used the internal shower in our motorhome, it’s just extra storage space for wet coats and wellies. We do however use the external shower, for washing off muddy legs at trip centres, washing filthy dogs, that sort of thing.
Not having internal space for the bikes is the only real shortcoming for us of our coachbuilt.
it’s 6m long but has parallel lounge seats which make either a massive double or two singles which are over 6’ long. Decent size kitchen with proper oven and a good amount of storage and worktop space & the washroom is a good size (even though as above, the shower isn’t used).
We looked at van conversions and they just felt too cramped inside, like long narrow corridors with no real lounging space other than the rotated cab seats. Self building was an option but when I fitted up the cost of what I wanted the coachbuilt was better value.

We use ours all year round so having decent heating and space to move around was important, means we don’t feel quite like we are cooped up in a metal box when the weather is awful. The lounge is as good as it’s name for afternoon naps etc…

We’ve done nearly 4 weeks away in it with plenty of room for everything we needed. If I could find the same layout in the same sort of size but with a garage I’d be all over it

There are only two of us but with two dogs and all our riding, climbing and walking kit the T5 conversion we used to have was just too much of a squeeze and I got sick of camper van Tetris pretty quickly.

I would like to self build one tho – for much the same reasons as others – I want a internal layout that no one offers. Medimum size van with a big bike “garage”, a permanent double bed that you can use without using your sitting space. But I won’t be putting a shower in and the on board bog would be for emergencies only

I’ve tried to work out a compromise without ending up with a massive van, and it’s just not happening tbh.

So, I’ve gave up on the idea, and I’m gonna buy a wee XLWB Merc Citan, seats 5, rear seats fold flat to get full bikes in, but can also fold 2 of the 3 rear seats down for 3 of us and 3 full bikes. 60mpg, and I can also sleep in the back at races as well, and I’ll just use Bed and breakfasts when we’re going as a family.

Every van is a compromise, but it’s your compromise, needs to suit you.

no doubt about it – even the smallest of coach builts feel bigger internally than an equivalent van conversion .

Even ancient ones.

the trade off is i don’t have to wonder if i fit through a gap.

The big vans we hired on the highland roads felt like every time i met something coming the other way i was going to have a pile of kindling on my hands.

i still want a ducato for my next van some day…..if kid 2 comes along as there is no way to get 4 passengers into my current layout.

The price of coach-builts are horrific, wee old place near us that sells stinking looking faded yellow-but-used-to-be-white things for like 25 grand! I wouldn’t spend a night in them, they look like a pish stained junkies couch.

they look like a pish stained junkies couch.

as oppopsed to a out-of-work-builder-come-hippy that the self-made conversions look like?

you want one of these. https://www.newmarcorp.com/luxury-motor-coaches/king-aire/

coach built, plenty of room for bikes. what’s not to like?

All they basically are is injection moulded pieces, a few wires, pump and circuit board. It can’t cost them £20-£40 to build

Which is fine, when all you do is count the component cost. Any idea how much getting an injection mould designed and made is? Now spread that across what is a relatively small market…

View this post on Instagram

Love the smell of a fresh mot in the morning. To another year of scooting aboot and generally making the place into an eyesore ! #ivecodailycampervan #ivecocamper #vanclans #postbus #mot #roadworthy

A post shared by Terry Davidson (@trail.rat) on Aug 22, 2018 at 6:36am PDT

Out of work builder ….. Nah . We lower than that. We are out of work delivery driver.

I’m quite ok with it looking rough as tits as I don’t mind too much where I need to put it at events etc.

Let’s just say it wasn’t 17 grand despite being as ancient as the OPs example of a coach built van.

I wouldn’t say the market for a Thetford bog is that small, and the classic bench style has only had one facelift on what must be a 30 year old design so it’s had plenty of time to recoup any tooling cost!

When you look at what you get, it certainly doesn’t cost that much. And until recently they were the standard supplier for caravans, and motorhomes, and DIY conversions.

I can’t fathom why motorhome type campers are so expensive, even second hand. They generally feel a bit cheap/depressing inside too.

I *think* it’s because they have a ‘proper’ chassis rather than monocoque, so the vehicle will effectively last forever – you just bolt new bits on as bits break.

…and they do hold their value. My folk bought theirs new for £22k and after 8 years hard use they sold it to a *trader* for £19,000. They’d looked for a used one but found the same issue – the used prices were not much different to the new.

When you look at what you get, it certainly doesn’t cost that much

Sounds like a lucrative market. You should dive in – you’re sure to clean up. 😉

I quite fancy building something around a Kip Shelter format in the back of a van. With a tailgate.

Having hired a few I see zero point in the “showers” you get in campers. A dribble of lukewarm water in a cupboard you cant turn round in.

You can get pretty big showers these days. The pumps are still weak as anything though, consequence of 12V.

The price of coach-builts are horrific, wee old place near us that sells stinking looking faded yellow-but-used-to-be-white things for like 25 grand! I wouldn’t spend a night in them, they look like a pish stained junkies couch.

Is that the place across from MFI? Assume you don’t mean Borders!

@tjagain

Having hired a few I see zero point in the “showers” you get in campers. A dribble of lukewarm water in a cupboard you cant turn round in.

I would like to self build one tho – for much the same reasons as others – I want a internal layout that no one offers. Medimum size van with a big bike “garage”, a permanent double bed that you can use without using your sitting space. But I won’t be putting a shower in and the on board bog would be for emergencies only

We’re pretty much building what you want, except we are having a shower. Getting rid of the shower would give you a 180cm wide bed with matching garage under.

Our shower tray arrived today 🙂

Is that the place across from MFI? Assume you don’t mean Borders!

Na, wee sales place on rhs entering Prestwick, just before petrol station, though it seems to have went west recently.

Borders is the opposite end of the market!

Na, wee sales place on rhs entering Prestwick, just before petrol station, though it seems to have went west recently.

Borders is the opposite end of the market!

Don’t think there was anything in it last I drove past a couple of days ago.

We had a look in Borders before buying the van last week, they’ve got some nice looking stuff and some that look like they’ve been designed for my 90 year old nan. None that would fit bikes in though!

Actually one thing I will add was that I spoke to a guy who is on the design team at Hymer. We had hired a Grand Canyon S on the Sprinter platform, which by the way was the most amazing drive for a van, and had managed to squeeze 3 bikes in under the bed but it was a phaff. When we returned it he was at the dealer and we got chatting. I outlined a design which would have more transverse space under the bed for bikes and he was of a view that they could easily do that for a factory order, they could shift the gas locker. Easy to say for an 89 grand van but was an interesting chat. They designed it with walkthrough as they assume everyone is retired and want it. The fact we wanted dry, separated bike space was unique but he was a cyclist so got it. The Hymer finish is rather lovely.

I have no interest in the technicalities of building camper vans, but I thought it was an excellent, funny, well written article. Best I’ve read in ST in a while 🙂

I have a T5 day van at the moment but would like something bigger,not really into the whole self-build thing but might be a case of needs must and a winter project.We should have been in Spain for most of this spring/summer and we would have made the T5 work but it could have become a proper ball ache constantly juggling things around.
Anyway this is my dream van

StuE – they’re known as race vans, ebay camper section for race and you’ll find a number to look at for ideas. I have one each year, bikes underneath, bed on top and in the middle and full shower, toilet etc.
i’ve never had an issue with shower being poor in a van, always fine for me and 12v pumps can generate lots of pressure.

Just to state that I enjoyed the article, and the happy outgoing view of the writer and gentle love story (makes me sound like a right softy). But their van just got me thinking. Might have something to do with my pal also having a van conversion and the one time I stayed in it I found it very cramped and compromised but he loves it so to each their own.

Can’t help thinking there must be a better way!

Maybe in the future when cars are self driving and nobody owns them, just have a monthly lease/hire agreement, where they can change what car/vehicle they get depending on the type of trip and number of occupants required. Owning a camper van for half a dozen trips a year will seem like an expensive daft idea.

Essentially I want one but I’m not willing to pay or put up with such a compromise.

I am liking nobeerinthefridge’s idea though as I could replace the family car with it (actually only car).

NZcol – I hired a custom Hymer build a few years ago. the hire place had them built to their spec rather than using an off the peg spec. It was just inside the 3.5 tonne licence category, had a fixed double bed and the “garage” beneath the bed would take the tandem without dismantling

coach built, plenty of room for bikes. what’s not to like?

Narrow lanes, interesting campsites, fuel bulls.

Out of work builder ….. Nah . We lower than that. We are out of work delivery driver

Not even sure where I fit in to this categorisation system. Out of work… refrigerated goods delivery guy?