Id love this 😆

Afan this week.

That’s looking awesome soma!

Don’t own any of these yet, but did a weekend’s demo, three of them at the Malvern Classic and the Trek half day at Long Mynd.

Trek have just bought out the 2019 the one here is the 2018, but it’s between the Cube and Trek.

Planning to head to Ard Rock for one more demo on the Cube and make a decision.

Yeah it turned out better than I thought, initially I had reservations regarding the somewhat agricultural in design Bafang motor but with up to 9 levels of gradual assist (user programmable for 3, 5 or 9 levels) it works surprisingly well, and the all important throttle is great for when I can’t be arsed pedalling. I don’t think I’ll bother fitting the gear sensor nor the brake sensors so I’ll remove the plugs/excess cabling from the loom and cap the ends with heat shrinking as that’ll be a neater wiring job.

The fully modded Bafang BBSHD with 1600+watts must be an absolute rocket ship/bit of a handful to ride.

Are they jones bars ? I’m thinking of similar for my new cargobike but not sure I can justify the cost really. Worth it ?

Yeah, Ti jones bars, not as good at dampening vibration as the carbon version – as bars they’re worth it but you’ll prob need to factor in a longer stem.

The fully modded Bafang BBSHD with 1600+watts must be an absolute rocket ship/bit of a handful to ride.

tbh if you were to horse it about on 9 on the bsshd on tight trails, you’d probably kill yourself! 😆

One benefit of the bafang add on kits is that if they break, it only takes half an hour to put your bike back together in normal mode, while the motor is getting fixed. (Had an issue with my motor where the PAS just stopped working, borrowed a throttle motor was fine(I don’t really want the temptation to use it tbh, so don’t have one), just the PAS stopped, so I’d to send it off down to some guy in London to fix for me(em3ev are paying postage and it’s their guy, which is decent, as is the fact not having to send it back to China!). should hopefully be getting it back next week or so, not sure on that.)

So, I just finished putting my bike back in normal mode, the hills will be interesting tomorrow! 😆

Great thread!

I was thinking of a mid motor conversion on a Fisher Sugar..

Those who went for the Bafang motors, did you consider the Tongsheng TSDZ2?

The TSDZ2 is similar – but has a torque sensing motor, so apparently gives a more natural feeling assistance? much like the off the peg decent e mountain bikes.

Also no throttles or brake sensors needed (although you can add them).

Theres a few on pedelecs and youtube vids.

Somafunk – Thats does look good. I’ve spent the last week researching these as looking at converting my Nail Trail. I’d figured the Bafang BBS01B kit 36V 250W extra torque model was the way to go.

What cassette range & chainring  are you running on it?

Wzzz, I hadn’t heard of the tongshen, so didn’t consider it tbh. Not really sure how popular they are either. So long term not sure how parts will be for that. I think bafang is pretty popular so should be bits to had for a good few years hopefully. Particularly when I need to strip it down a fix it for myself after warranty is done.

Must admit I’m curious to the torque sensing though, I’ve not tried it yet. But then again I’m happy enough with the cadence sensing and manually changing the assist/power levels(all that does is set the amps at a percentage. So it just setting the motor to assist at incremental watt levels.

The other factor was price for me. Think torque sensing is expensive so being on a budget was bafang all the way for me.

What cassette range & chainring  are you running on it?

Mines on 36 11-34 at the moment. Think I’ll want slight lower gearing down the road mind. So once I run it into the ground I might swap it all for 42 11-46.

This guy has put a lot of miles on a tsdz2, has a few vids (inc repairs) of the TSDZ2  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uym45P_dQQ4

The unit is £310  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/253682848954?var=552931509060

I was thinking for on road, a power setting is enough… but for offroad, torque sensing and ramping up the power with pedal effort would be nicer.

Good price, but buying off ebay offers zero support eh? Something I wanted when I was buying, why I went with that em3ev mob, it’s an english guy that runs a factory in china, and has local support in the uk, communication is decent with them, but laggy due to the time differences, but I’ve had an issue and I’m pretty please with the service (well assuming the motor comes back working! 😆 ). All in all the reviews were good online about them, and I agree so far.

Eventually, I’ll probably need to fix the thing myself as the years pass, but having that initial piece of mind and points of contact where they’ll be responsive to you was important to me. Atleast initially, over time, I’ll learn how to strip it down.

What cassette range & chainring  are you running on it?

Cassette is a Praxxis 11-40 and chainring is a Lekkie 42 tooth

Soma – now THAT is what an E-bike should look like!  It looks amazing!

I much prefer the ‘bolt-on’ approach rather than the ‘let’s make a massive ugly frame that looks heavy as ***k to hide the tech-bits’ approach.  I mean why bother covering all the gubbins up?  We don’t do that on ‘normal’ bikes.  It looks far more elegant than the ‘big frame’ options.  Very tempted to find an old frame and get it converted now.

Daft question – does it work with zero pedalling and if so what kind of range do you have without any user effort at all?

er… Soma’s motor looks to be a great solution for his needs but there are some fairly good reasons to design Emtb frames specifically to their mount motors, batteries and electrics. Covering the gubbins is a pretty good idea for a bike ridden in all weathers through wet, muddy, dusty, rocky terrain etc. too.

normal bike gubbins such as the working/moving parts of BBs, Headsets, hubs, freehubs, pedal axles, brakes, shifters, pivot bearing, stanchions, dampers are all covered/sheilded, while the chain/cassette/mech/ring are easily accessed for cleaning/maintenance. same as on E bikes. My shimano motor is bolt on too and just as accessible/removable. My frame being specifically designed to hold it all is pretty reasuring when hitting a jump at 40mph

Cheers andykirk, It can work by throttle alone or by pedalling, not had it out for a proper run yet but hopefully i’ll get out later this afternoon, i expect/hope to get 25 miles out of it dependant on how i use the throttle (fully pinned and whizzing along at 20mph+ or just out for a pleasant bimble), obviously if i avoid the throttle and rely on crank revolutions to motor assist me then i’ll get further.

Total cost was £900ish, i could have built it cheaper by using aliexpress to buy the motor/battery etc from china but i wanted back-up in this country and Darren from from Brighton E-Bikes was really helpful.

Very simple to fit, if you can change a BB then you can fit this it in an hour or so, although saying that it took me 6 hrs due to my MS and fatigue setting in, especially annoying as a dropped bolt/washer tends to leave you staring at it on the floor in desperation as you summon the strength to get down to find it, then spending 10mins crawling around trying to get the strength to stand back up.

Throttle will significantly reduce the range btw. So be miserly with it! Ultimately tese mid drives are happiest when you are giving them a hand a decently high cadence.

Damn you somafunk :-). Everytime you post one of your bikes I end up poorer. First it was the Tripster and now that. I’ve got an old Stumpjumper in garage that would be a great candidate for conversion…

“My frame being specifically designed to hold it all is pretty reasuring when hitting a jump at 40mph”

on the other hand id like to see someone hit a jump at 40mph on somafunks machine.

i did fit full length mudguards with flaps to shield the worst of the shit off my bafang.

on the other hand id like to see someone hit a jump at 40mph on somafunks machine.

I wouldn’t fancy their chances, as an aside…..How bloody small are 26 x 2.4″ conti’s ?, i’ve been spoiled by 3.0″ & 2.8″ 27.5 plus tyres for the last couple of years and these conti’s are anorexic in their piddling size, another thing…..suspension has also spoiled me as i found out when hitting a pothole at no more than 10mph – i think i’ll be fitting the Talas 110mm/140mm fork i have for the hummer very soon.

Damn you somafunk :-). Everytime you post one of your bikes I end up poorer

Not all my bikes have been lookers, what about my f.u.ngrel?, (aka **** ugly mongrel). My 1994 Marin Indian Fire Trail that i built up as a single speed road  (52×16) bike a few years ago (before ms), still got this hanging up on my wall, done well over 70,000 miles on it in various iterations over the years and i still smile when i think of the places it took me.

More BBS01 questions for Somafunk, rather than an e-bike pic, sorry OP… Somafunk, (very nice conversion BTW) ..what happens as you near the max assist speed does the power ramp down or get to max assist speed and cut out?  Does the power cut out, or reduce, above a certain cadence or does it provide power (depending on level set) regardless of cadence provided the pedals are turning.  Thanks

You can set the maximum motor assist speed using the display controller to whatever you wish,  it comes pre-set to 16mph but i changed it to 23mph, for max efficiency i think the bafang BBS01 ETM i have prefers to used with a cadence of around 90rpm (i could be wrong) so obviously you need to use the gears to maintain as high a cadence as possible to avoid over heating the motor as it prefers to spin fast for efficiency.

Just back from the longest bike ride i’ve managed in a couple of years, only 24 miles but 1400ft of climbing and i used a mix of throttle assist for the steep hills and varied the cadence assist from 3 through to 9 on the controller – I still have 54% of battery left so i guess a range of 40miles+ should be achievable which is more than i was expecting.  My motor settings/voltage/amps etc were set up by Darren for a general middle of the road riding experience and i see no reason to mess about with them, you can drive the motor harder if you use a programming cable and mess about with the settings but at the expense of possible overheating/battery drain etc.

When the power cuts out you can still pedal as normal with minimal drag through the system, certainly much more efficient/easy to pedal than exceeding the limit on my Scott e-genius (bosch cx motor), there is no chance of me being able to pedal much faster than the 23mph top speed i’ve programmed as i can’t get my legs to turn the cranks fast enough so perhaps someone else will advise on how the power cuts out at the self imposed limit.

Thanks Soma, that’s helpful.

Longminge ride yesterday.

23miles, 1250 meters of climbing and still got three bars (30%) left on the battery.

Did 2 sections of around 30 meters in trail  mode and the rest in eco.

Average hart rate was actually higher than a similar ride on my Geometron.

Didn’t take any pics of the descents as half of them were a little naughty…

Seems like you’re having fun with the lenevo stu, riding so called cheeky trails as well eh?….i imagine the pitchforks and bombers will be getting sharpened by the luddites as i type this.

After waking up this morning feeling like my shoulders and neck have taken a beating due to the rigid forks (nice & light but not so practical) i’ve fitted my Talas CTD, feels much better to ride now and it’s lifted the BB so less chance of smacking the motor off obstacles.

140mm travel

110mm travel

Seems like you’re having fun with the lenevo stu, riding so called cheeky trails as well eh?

I am indeed mate.

Never had a problem with any trail over there TBH.

Stopped for a chat with a large group of walkers on a footpath and everyone was happy.

Even saw one of them later in the camp site who came over to ask me if I’d manged to get down the steep rocky stream section OK.😎

Glad you’re still managing to get out mate. 👍🏻

so those of you with bafang knowledge.

i have a bbs02 48v….  can i change controller to run a 36v  – basically when i was building mine *edit apparently it was only 2 years ago the 36v battery options were crap. Things have changed and a nice 15ah 36v battery is considerably cheaper than a similar 48v and the 36v motor has better torque(at 86RPM)  than the 48 which likes about 110-120 anyway

im researching else where as we speak but wondered if anyone knew

You might you might not(this is just from my googling), the issue seems to be the low voltage cut off point, which with 48v controllers is set to 41v usually. A 36v battery will usually charge up to about 42v I think, so it might run for a bit then it’ll cut off.

You can change the LVC with the programming cable on the bafangs, whether it’s advisable to run a 36v battery on a 48v controller I don’t know, but you’d need to change the LVC to 31 volts I think to get it to use the full juice in your battery.

short answer is no you cant.

I can change the controller and itll work BUT 36v controllers are like hens teeth.

efficiency will also drop off running it at 36v as the windings are different (source – paul at em3ev)

Theres no way to adjust the controller.

Anyhoo , i seemed to recall the controllers being around 50-60 quid not 120 quid such as they are so the batteries are considerably cheaper but the cost of a  controller more than makes up the difference…..

advise on how the power cuts out at the self imposed limit.

Yeah it just cuts off, feels a touch draggy when it does as you’ve just lost the power assist, but you can still pedal easily enough. tbh it’s a bit irritating at 16 mph, so I’ve bumped mine up too, so it cuts off at 22mph(don’t really want to go any faster anyhow, seems a good sweet spot(for road, off road, generally the limit doesn’t factor much anyhow as you’ll probably be below 15 mph there)).

Basically if you feel you are going beyond that limit all the time, just bring the assist level down so that you can just sit comfortably under the limit. You can basically find an easy balance point so you aren’t going over the limit.

Theres no way to adjust the controller.

You sure about that? As I said you can change that low voltage cut off with the programming cable. (I’ve got a programming cable, it’s dead easy to mess about with the settings.)

cannot be adjusted low enough for a 36v battery is what i should have said. yes you can play with it but it will not go low enough.,

BITD i was playing with it to achieve speed with my prog cable (hence mostly why  i need a new battery due to rapid discharge) i came to my senses now when i realised that 15mph is actually a faster average than most people achieve on utility bikes and arriving non sweaty is why i bought it. also cars dont expect you to be going faster so you find your self in trouble quickly.

surprised at that, as it just numbers, curious what actually happens then when you write 31 to the lvc, does it just jump back up to 41 when you read flash again?

wonder if that’s just because a 48v battery is connected, and the batteries bms just isn’t allowing it to be set any lower?

personally id just stick to 48v though, seem to get better watt hours for the money far as i can see. touch heavier though.

Wzzz, I hadn’t heard of the tongshen, so didn’t consider it tbh. Not really sure how popular they are either. So long term not sure how parts will be for that. I think bafang is pretty popular so should be bits to had for a good few years hopefully. Particularly when I need to strip it down a fix it for myself after warranty is done.

They are pretty well evaluated and understood here:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=79788&start=2925

Parts here:

http://www.pswpower.com/ven.php?cargo-s220010

By Scar house reservoir.

And in Gunship mode which initially was the main reason for the Ebike to get around farms more quickly.

I bet you don’t get accused of cheating very often! 😀

My Trek Super Commuter 8+ with NuVinci hub.

Had this bike about 8 months now. Enjoy being able to do a decent mileage and carry some photo equipment with me.

Very expensive to buy, but the NuVinci hub has been great, smooth, quiet, reliable.

Brooks saddle and a Thomsom layback post have been the only component changes.